Schreck, George

If you are not near the front with 2k's to go, do not plan on sprinting.
People who place high ride near the front. Those who do not, finish in
the pack. It is the people who think they can sprint from 20 places
back that cause many of the crashes.

-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Jeff Fuchs
Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 6:17 PM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Cherry Pie RR Safety Tips

I realize it could be logistically challenging, but would it be possible
to open the whole road further out than 200 meters, say 400 or 600
meters?

It seems like that would give us more room to maneuver as we are
accelerating toward the sprint. I think most people realize that they
can't sprint for 400 meters, unfortunately a lot of people think they
can sprint for 200 meters. This results in a bunch of people sprinting
hard and then sitting up somewhere between the 200 meter sign and the
finish line. Opening the road sooner would at least give people room to
manuever around people who are sitting up.

Last year at the Banana Belt race that finished up hill, there were more
than a few masters-riders who started the sprint, realized it was too
early, and then sat up and went backwards. Unfortunately, there were
other people behind them. This resulted in a pretty nasty crash in what
is supposed to be a safe field.

Just a thought...
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mark duff

This year that wont be a problem at any of the BB as the Masters field
starts at 40+ and the isn't a 30-39 field for the masters. Why have all the
promoters gone to a 40+ field and are leaving out those who want to race
Masters 30-39. Just a question????

>From: "Mark J. Ginsberg"
>Reply-To: markjginsberg@yahoo.com
>To: Jeff Fuchs , obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Cherry Pie RR Safety Tips
>Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2006 21:41:33 -0800 (PST)
>
>that up hill sprint was great in the masters, if only Kent Johnson hadn't
>timed it as well as he did, I wouldn't have been second!
>
> The hill was only part of it, we were going fast for 1k or more before
>that.
>
> Mark Ginsberg
>
>Jeff Fuchs wrote:
> I realize it could be logistically challenging, but would it be possible
>to open the whole road further out than 200 meters, say 400 or 600 meters?
>
>It seems like that would give us more room to maneuver as we are
>accelerating toward the sprint. I think most people realize that they can't
>sprint for 400 meters, unfortunately a lot of people think they can sprint
>for 200 meters. This results in a bunch of people sprinting hard and then
>sitting up somewhere between the 200 meter sign and the finish line.
>Opening the road sooner would at least give people room to manuever around
>people who are sitting up.
>
>Last year at the Banana Belt race that finished up hill, there were more
>than a few masters-riders who started the sprint, realized it was too
>early, and then sat up and went backwards. Unfortunately, there were other
>people behind them. This resulted in a pretty nasty crash in what is
>supposed to be a safe field.
>
>Just a thought...
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
>Mark J. Ginsberg
>Attorney At Law
>621 SW Morrison St., Ste. 900
>Portland, OR 97204
>(503) 542-3000
>Fax (503) 227-2530
>markjginsberg@yahoo.com
>www.bikesafetylaw.com
>
>---------------------------------
>Brings words and photos together (easily) with
> PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail.

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Mark J. Ginsberg

that up hill sprint was great in the masters, if only Kent Johnson hadn't timed it as well as he did, I wouldn't have been second!

The hill was only part of it, we were going fast for 1k or more before that.

Mark Ginsberg

Jeff Fuchs wrote:
I realize it could be logistically challenging, but would it be possible to open the whole road further out than 200 meters, say 400 or 600 meters?

It seems like that would give us more room to maneuver as we are accelerating toward the sprint. I think most people realize that they can't sprint for 400 meters, unfortunately a lot of people think they can sprint for 200 meters. This results in a bunch of people sprinting hard and then sitting up somewhere between the 200 meter sign and the finish line. Opening the road sooner would at least give people room to manuever around people who are sitting up.

Last year at the Banana Belt race that finished up hill, there were more than a few masters-riders who started the sprint, realized it was too early, and then sat up and went backwards. Unfortunately, there were other people behind them. This resulted in a pretty nasty crash in what is supposed to be a safe field.

Just a thought...
_______________________________________________
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Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Mark J. Ginsberg
Attorney At Law
621 SW Morrison St., Ste. 900
Portland, OR 97204
(503) 542-3000
Fax (503) 227-2530
markjginsberg@yahoo.com
www.bikesafetylaw.com

---------------------------------
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2nwb@comcast.net

I looked at the possibility of holding traffic for a full K or even 400 meters. The road really has to be closed. At 200 meters, we hold traffic until we cannot see anyone. As is, as soon as we open the road to traffic another bunch of riders come in 6 or 7 abreast. It is scary letting a car through and often they are scared with seeing bikes all over the road, and gingerly putt along at 15 MPH down the 200 meter line only to be met head on with more bikes coming at them.

The locals often need to get home, or get to an appointment and don't have all day to wait for a group of 6 or 7 cyclists dribbling in. We would almost need a pilot car like road construction uses. Remember there are several hundred riders out there, and many want to win the bunch sprint no matter where they place.

It would be difficult to justify closing the road. I am sure there is some way to make it happen, but not this year anyway.

Norman

-------------- Original message --------------
From: Jeff Fuchs

> I realize it could be logistically challenging, but would it be possible to open
> the whole road further out than 200 meters, say 400 or 600 meters?
>
> It seems like that would give us more room to maneuver as we are accelerating
> toward the sprint. I think most people realize that they can't sprint for 400
> meters, unfortunately a lot of people think they can sprint for 200 meters. This
> results in a bunch of people sprinting hard and then sitting up somewhere
> between the 200 meter sign and the finish line. Opening the road sooner would at
> least give people room to manuever around people who are sitting up.
>
> Last year at the Banana Belt race that finished up hill, there were more than a
> few masters-riders who started the sprint, realized it was too early, and then
> sat up and went backwards. Unfortunately, there were other people behind them.
> This resulted in a pretty nasty crash in what is supposed to be a safe field.
>
> Just a thought...
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Drew Russell

Jeff, I had that problem for years and then after much thought found a
solution that didn't require moving back the double lane.

I stayed near the front at the end of the race. It was so much better,
the slower people were already behind me!

D

-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Jeff Fuchs
Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 6:17 PM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Cherry Pie RR Safety Tips

I realize it could be logistically challenging, but would it be possible
to open the whole road further out than 200 meters, say 400 or 600
meters?

It seems like that would give us more room to maneuver as we are
accelerating toward the sprint. I think most people realize that they
can't sprint for 400 meters, unfortunately a lot of people think they
can sprint for 200 meters. This results in a bunch of people sprinting
hard and then sitting up somewhere between the 200 meter sign and the
finish line. Opening the road sooner would at least give people room to
manuever around people who are sitting up.

Last year at the Banana Belt race that finished up hill, there were more
than a few masters-riders who started the sprint, realized it was too
early, and then sat up and went backwards. Unfortunately, there were
other people behind them. This resulted in a pretty nasty crash in what
is supposed to be a safe field.

Just a thought...
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Jeff Fuchs

I realize it could be logistically challenging, but would it be possible to open the whole road further out than 200 meters, say 400 or 600 meters?

It seems like that would give us more room to maneuver as we are accelerating toward the sprint. I think most people realize that they can't sprint for 400 meters, unfortunately a lot of people think they can sprint for 200 meters. This results in a bunch of people sprinting hard and then sitting up somewhere between the 200 meter sign and the finish line. Opening the road sooner would at least give people room to manuever around people who are sitting up.

Last year at the Banana Belt race that finished up hill, there were more than a few masters-riders who started the sprint, realized it was too early, and then sat up and went backwards. Unfortunately, there were other people behind them. This resulted in a pretty nasty crash in what is supposed to be a safe field.

Just a thought...

mickwalsh1@comcast.net

I would advise only sprinting if you have a good chance of placing....It's a long season and crashing now will only mess it up, so don't try to sprint for 15th place from the middle of the pack.That is what causes a lot of accidents.

My 2c

Ride Hard.......and safely

Mick

-------------- Original message --------------
From: Ted Turner

> The most significant hazards that exist at Cherry Pie, besides the congestion
> around the finish line, are the early-season jitters and rusty bike handling
> skills that have resulted in significant crashes over the last few years.
> Almost all of the crashes have occurred during the last kilometer of racing. I
> remind you to pay attention during the sprint and give your comrades some room.
> You will have both lanes for sprinting in the final 200 meters only.
>
> Promoter Norman Babcock has provided you with a full suite of races that should
> satisfy just about everyone. But even though there will be morning and
> afternoon events, several fields will be on the 21-mile course at any given time
> and it is not uncommon to have faster fields catch and pass others. Race
> neutralization is a necessity. It is difficult for the officials to communicate
> directly to the field or to individual riders (we don?t have motorcycle refs or
> PA systems on our vehicles), so please pay attention to what?s going on well
> ahead and behind your field. If your field is being passed, slow down, ride
> single file, and wait for the passing field to get several hundred meters up the
> road before you resume racing. Or wait for a signal from your official. We
> will not allow any passing where it is not safe to do so or within the last
> couple of kilometers of your race.
>
> Finally, let?s all try to reduce the congestion at the finish area this year.
> Tell your friends and family who want to watch the finish of your race to
> carpool if possible and to park off the pavement and well downstream of the
> finish line. Don?t stand in front of the finish line camera (something I do all
> too often). When you?re done racing, get off the road and away from the OBRA
> truck and watch out for other riders and fields who are approaching.
>
> Good luck. And please have fun and play safe.
>
> Ted Turner
> Chief Referee

Ted Turner

The most significant hazards that exist at Cherry Pie, besides the congestion around the finish line, are the early-season jitters and rusty bike handling skills that have resulted in significant crashes over the last few years. Almost all of the crashes have occurred during the last kilometer of racing. I remind you to pay attention during the sprint and give your comrades some room. You will have both lanes for sprinting in the final 200 meters only.

Promoter Norman Babcock has provided you with a full suite of races that should satisfy just about everyone. But even though there will be morning and afternoon events, several fields will be on the 21-mile course at any given time and it is not uncommon to have faster fields catch and pass others. Race neutralization is a necessity. It is difficult for the officials to communicate directly to the field or to individual riders (we don?t have motorcycle refs or PA systems on our vehicles), so please pay attention to what?s going on well ahead and behind your field. If your field is being passed, slow down, ride single file, and wait for the passing field to get several hundred meters up the road before you resume racing. Or wait for a signal from your official. We will not allow any passing where it is not safe to do so or within the last couple of kilometers of your race.

Finally, let?s all try to reduce the congestion at the finish area this year. Tell your friends and family who want to watch the finish of your race to carpool if possible and to park off the pavement and well downstream of the finish line. Don?t stand in front of the finish line camera (something I do all too often). When you?re done racing, get off the road and away from the OBRA truck and watch out for other riders and fields who are approaching.

Good luck. And please have fun and play safe.

Ted Turner
Chief Referee