gschreckchat@comcast.net
I agree with your point, but it does not address Ivan's. Your argument applies to all age groups which was Ivan's point, although I would exempt juniors from an increase.
--
George Schreck
gschreckchat@comcast.net
(503) 502-0425
-------------- Original message --------------
From: Rick C Johnson
> "There are many 40 year old competitors raising a family. They may be
> racing as a master category 4 or category 5 for fun and competition, but
> they may not have those additional discretionary funds."
>
> We all have our own tails of woe but I think if we're honest with
> ourselves we'll admit that $5 a year won't put our kids through college,
> nor will it pay our rent or mortgage, insurance, utilities nor any other
> major expenses we regularly have. We're talking about the cost of a
> cheap lunch, six bottles of beer, a decent bicycle tube or a couple
> gallons of gas. Out of the whole year.
> In this case poverty doesn't work as an excuse unless someone is on
> welfare and collecting food stamps. If someone can't come up with a
> spare $5 out of their entire annual budget they shouldn't be racing,
> period. That is a sure sign of being dangerously overextended financially.
>
> I could come with all manner of excuses myself - but I won't because at
> 40 I realize that I'm responsible for the choices I make. I choose to
> race bicycles and I don't expect someone else to have to make a donation
> to cover the costs. This is about simply covering OBRAs present and
> future operating expenses. This is not about frills or options.
>
> Rick
>
>
> EAL wrote:
>
> > Well, more like age discrimination rather than reverse. That said,
> > there's plenty of precedent for this in both for profit and not for
> > profit pursuits. For example, in most movie theaters students and
> > children pay less than adults even though the kids occupy an entire
> > seat. The same is true with lift tickets in most ski areas and
> > tickets to many events such as art museums.
> >
> > If it came to a vote, I'd definitely be in favor of it and , I guess
> > Ivan would not be. Ivan amd I will just have to agree to
> > disagree (and perhaps, disagree and commit)
> >
> > Ed
> >
> >
> >
> > */"Meadors, Ivan C" /* wrote:
> >
> > Reverse age discrimination?
> > I would recommend continuing to allow a person to make the choice
> > to be charitable, not a requirement.
> >
> > There are many 40 year old competitors raising a family. They may be
> > racing as a master category 4 or category 5 for fun and
> > competition, but
> > they may not have those additional discretionary funds.
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org
> > [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On Behalf Of *EAL
> > *Sent:* Thursday, January 04, 2007 4:53 PM
> > *To:* Todd.Dye@CH2M.com; obra@list.obra.org
> > *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] 2007 OBRA Registration Donations
> >
> > I recommend an increase for 40+ riders. A "Senior Premium" Most
> > of us are out of our struggling college/early family days. I know
> > retirement looms, but I suspect as a group we can afford to
> > subsidize some of the younger participants.
> >
> > Ed Lanton
> >
> > */Todd.Dye@CH2M.com/* wrote:
> >
> > Thanks Rick.
> >
> > I was just going to respond, but you summed up my thoughts
> > exactly. There are a few groups where membership fee
> > increase could hinder participation, but honestly for the
> > majority of us, a $5 increase (the cost of one tube) isn't
> > going to make much difference.
> >
> > I don't ever want to see OBRA go to the type of fee structure
> > that USCF/NORBA has. Seriously, how much is it now to be able
> > to race Road/mtb/track/cross under their umbrella? OBRA is
> > one heck of a deal, and will remain so even with a $5 or more
> > increase.
> >
> > I think the donation option is a great start. If OBRA can
> > generate enough donations to cover rising costs, that is
> > great. If not, then we all know the answer.
> >
> > However, I think keeping single day licenses the same would be
> > a good idea to keep encouraging new participants who hopefully
> > then become new OBRA members.
> >
> > Does the OBRA Senior Citizen Discount kick in at age 35 or
> > 40? (I know that was below the belt but I couldn't help
> > myself)
> >
> > -Todd
> >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org
> > [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On Behalf Of *Rick Johnson
> > *Sent:* Thursday, January 04, 2007 1:17 PM
> > *To:* cmurray@obra.org
> > *Cc:* obra
> > *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] 2007 OBRA Registration Donations
> > Candi,
> > You just told me all I need to know, thanks for stating the
> > specifics of the costs OBRA is obligated to cover.
> > Also, since there has been no increase in membership fees for
> > 5-10 years I think it's very reasonable to consider an
> > increase. Looking back on all the things that have increased
> > in cost over that period - some by tremendous amounts - I find
> > it amazing that OBRA is even coming close to getting by on
> > that amount. Wow!
> >
> > If there is a concern over hindering participation then I'd
> > support tiered pricing. For instance beginners, juniors,
> > and/or students could enjoy a discount. The rest of us - with
> > our thousands in hardware - should be very reasonably be able
> > to afford another $5-10 a year to race it. With the majority
> > of the membership being Masters aged I'd have a lot of trouble
> > believing the cost of one decent lunch an undue burden.
> >
> > My check is in the mail. OBRA is too good of an organization
> > to have to beg for money.
> >
> > Rick
> >
> >
> > Candi Murray wrote:
> >
> >Somewhere between 5-10 years. It used to be $15 Candi -----Original
> Message----- From: Rick Johnson [mailto:RCJohnson1@attglobal.net] Sent:
> Thursday, January 04, 2007 12:49 PM To: cmurray@obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] 2007 OBRA Registration
> Donations and Signmeup.com Just out of curiosity
> > - How long has it been since there was an increase in the membership fee?
> Rick Candi Murray wrote:
> >
> >>Thanks for noticing that Todd, it was something that we had no control
> >>
> >over.
> >
> >>Speaking of the donation program. The number of
> >>
> >> people who
> >> have sent in donations has dropped considerably. I would really like to
> encourage everyone just to contribute at least $5.
> >>
> >We
> >
> >>have had some huge expenses that is really sticking it to our financial
> bottom line 1. We have been required to replace our traffic signs with the new
> ODOT specific ones - our cost for 60 signs is $14,000. 2. Our insurance
> premium went up 368 % and we were required to pay $11,000 in order for the
> policy to go in force for 2007. 3. Like always we have had to purchase the
> road and mtn bike numbers and the total cost for that is over
> >> $20,000. I really argued that we not increase our membership fees. I felt
> that it would hinder participation. But if everyone gave $5 more then we would
> >>
> >raise
> >
> >>almost $15,000. C -----Original Message----- From:
> >>
> >> obra-bounces@list.obra.org
> [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Todd.Dye@CH2M.com
> Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 12:30
> >> PM To: obra@list.obra.org Subject: [OBRA Chat]
> 2007 OBRA Registration Donations and Signmeup.com Hey OBRAland, I
> noticed today that if you do the online registration through Signmeup.com and
> put in an OBRA donation the processing fee goes up. Obviously, Signmeup.com
> is a business and need to take their cut to cover expenses and profit, but if
> you're going to make a sizable donation to OBRA and want to see all that money
> go to OBRA, you might want to do it the old fashioned way with a check/letter.
> The % that Signmeup charges
> >>
> >> decreases the more you pay. Playing around with their site I came up with
> the following: $10 donation = $1.65 charge $100
> >> donation = $7.50 charge $500 donation = $33.00 charge $1000 donation =
> $66.00 charge -Todd -----Original Message----- From:
> obra-bounces@list.obra.org
> [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Candi Murray Sent: Wednesday,
> January 03, 2007 12:04 PM To: obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] 2007 road numbers We have had 624 join for 2007 so far.
> As you know, we will hold your 2006 number until Jan 15, after that date we
> will issue numbers in numerical order according to category. This will mean
> that there will be no 300 numbers available after 1/15 and very few 500
> numbers. If you want
> >>
> >> to retain your 300 or 500 series number please join asap. Candi Ps Happy
> New Year, only 46 days until the first event
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