Steve Brown

MKS Keirin Style Track Pedals with a strap. These babies lock you
in. You have to release the latch to get out. I also use the same
system as Donna but prefer these. They are way cool and the cleats
are easier to get.

On Apr 14, 2008, at 5:13 PM, bikingmom@centurytel.net wrote:

> I've had several accidental releases, all when riding with clipless
> pedals (Campy Daytona). I switched to "old school" durace sprint
> pedals with straps, scored from Brian (yeah, the guy with the
> hammer). As long as I make sure that I have the cleat system fully
> engaged and straps tight, I'm good to go. I wouldn't switch back
> to a straight clipless system if my life depended on it...oh wait,
> it does.
>
> Donna Smith
>
>
> So let's hear from more of you experienced track racers, what are
> you using for a pedal/cleat system on the track ? What IS working
> for you and what has NOT worked ?
>
>
> JD
>
>
>
> On 4/13/08, Mike Murray wrote:
>
> I'd have to disagree with a couple of John's points:
>
>
> 1) For racing at the track you want a shoe and pedal combination
> that NEVER comes unclipped accidentally. I have seen many
> accidents caused by inadvertent detachment of the shoe from the
> pedal (even with clips and straps). I have never seen an injury
> directly because of a failure of the pedal to release in a fall.
> Some riders use pedals that have an SPD or other clip in mechanism
> AND straps on top of that. Some people have actually bolted the
> shoes to the pedals, although this is really only practical for top
> level timed events and sprints.
>
>
> 2) Mountain bike pedals are designed to release if a foot needs to
> be dabbed. They should be avoided at the track.
>
>
> 3) A shoe with no cleat used in a toe clips and straps pedal is OK
> for training classes but should not be used for racing. There is
> no rule against it but I think it should be avoided.
>
>
> 4) Although mass start track racing is more about spin and less
> about strength a softer flex shoe is inadequate. Track specific
> shoes tend to be stiffer than road shoes.
>
>
>
> Mike Murray
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-
> bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of john
> Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2008 14:29 PM
> To: My Stretchy Pants; 'OBRA list'
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Shoes for Clips at Alpenrose
>
> Robert,
>
> http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_cl.html
> A cleat can be for Toe-and-Clip pedals or for Clipless pedals.
>
> Match sprinters use toe and clip usually double straps. Since
> match sprinters are usually pretty strong, i don't think roadies
> debate clip versus clipless with them.
>
> However for mass start omnium events, clip-less pedals are fine,
> and probably preferred since they release without a struggle or
> without having to reach down and loosen the strap. Probably a
> majority of track racers that race omnium events including the pros
> use the same Clipless pedals and thus same shoes as on their road
> bike.
>
> If you concerned or if you are accidentally pulling out with
> clipless pedals then they aren't adjusted correctly or you need
> pedals that offer more free rotation before release. By far the
> most secure pedals i have ever used were TIME mtb pedals, or
> Eggbeaters (the "two bar" type pedals, LOOK too now..), large
> float, they unclip easy but over at quite a large angle so never
> accidentally released. . My issue with them though is undefined
> and small pedal to shoe interface.
>
> If you are going to use Toe-and-Clip pedals with a slotted cleat,
> since there is no float or rotation, You must get the cleats
> aligned properly, preferably professionally or you will most likely
> hurt your knees. But even then, In the old days the shoes were
> fairly sloppy and so probably saved knees. if i recall correctly,
> As cycling shoe's heel cups stiffened, knee injuries increased.
> Depends on what sort of rotation you foot likes to do through a
> rotation. I had no issues when i first started on toe and clip
> pedals and a cleated slot shoe. But if i tried to go back now, i
> for sure would have issues...
>
> If you are going to use tennis / running shoes with Toe and Clip
> Pedals, it is rare but there is nothing wrong with this. Mass
> start Track racing is more about high spin speeds and thus low
> forces, so high shoe stiffness is not as critical as in other types
> of bicycle racing.
>
> 1. You want a clean no frills shoe with minimal tread (or remove
> with grinding wheel Wire Brush..) Something that cleanly and
> easily goes into the clip pedal. Stiff thin outer sole if you can
> get it, or you could maybe even find a stiff insole.. Err or you
> can do like did once with a fibrous insole... work in some
> fiberglass epoxy... thin and fairly stiff. .
>
> 2. And Pedals (if using a running shoe), you want probably almost a
> platform pedal that takes strap and clip. You want surface area,
> not a thin plate pedal as for a slotted cleat. You want to push
> with the ball of your foot and you want a nice flat surface to do
> this on..
>
> Keep in mind with Clip and Strap pedals, they might stick out a
> little further and you thus you have to be a little more mindful of
> clipping the Alpenrose banking at slow speeds. Also tuck in
> laces. Also since the races are short , the pain is short if for
> example the strap is digging into your foot.
>
> Check out Next Adventure and City Bikes, the latter usually has a
> nice collection of used shoes and pedals for cheap. For sure
> there are still purposely built toe and clip shoes for match
> sprinters. bike central ..
> Probably the most cost effective clipless pedals are the three
> hole Look Style. Not that i like them. Just make sure you replace
> the cleat when worn. I use to use shimano SPD pedals a lot (cause
> i like walkable shoes for commuting) But seemed to have issue with
> accidental release here and there.. and then once they didn't
> release until after my leg snapped. So not a fan anymore of Steel
> on Steel pedal to cleat.
>
>
>
> My Stretchy Pants wrote:
>
> I've heard that at the track, clips are preferred over cleats, and
> have
> a set of clips for my track bike. But what sort of shoes do I stick in
> the clips? Tennis shoes? Standard cycling shoes without the cleats? I
> tried using chuck taylors in the clips on a hill and thought for a few
> weeks after that I may have broken my foot. Clearly, sneakers were the
> wrong choice. Is the clip v. clipless question an important religious
> matter, regularly debated, like optimum spoke count? Is there a
> purpose
> built shoe experienced track racers use with clips?
>
> Robert Synak
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>
>
> john m schmidt, pe
> portland oregon
>
>
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