Mark J. Ginsberg
the speed limit signs are prima facia indications of what the "reasonable speed " is.
so yes, you can argue that I was going faster than the posted, and this is why it was reasonable, but the standard to get past is pretty high.
Mark
Matthew Klahn wrote: I think you misunderstand the basic speed law. It means that you
cannot drive faster than current conditions allow, even if that is
below the posted speed limit. So, if in the ticketing officer's
opinion, going 45 in a 65 limit zone in a blizzard is too fast for
conditions, then he can issue you a ticket. You can, of course, go to
court and defend yourself, etc.
Also, this law seems to keep you from pleading that going faster than
the posted speed limit is a reasonable speed:
http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/04/469.asp
But, it seems that according to the wording of that bill, that you
could go up to 70 mph in a 55 mph zone, if it is safe to do so. Which
will never almost never be the case on a bicycle.
Matthew Klahn, who just got his Oregon DL this year, and thus had to
study this crap recently.
On Jul 14, 2008, at 7:51 AM, Monty Hill wrote:
> I thought we had the ?Basic Speed Law? in Oregon where typically
> there are no speed limits only suggested speeds. That is why almost
> all signs say Speed in lieu of Speed Limit like our neighboring
> states.
>
> Monty
>
> From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org]
> On Behalf Of Mark J. Ginsberg
> Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 7:49 PM
> To: Don Mathews; obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Pulled over for speeding by Cornelius PD...
> on a MTB!
>
> yup, as mentioned, a bike is a vehicle and the rules of the road
> apply.
>
> and north plains officers and their chief LOVE ticketing cyclists.
>
> Mark Ginsberg
>
> Don Mathews wrote:
> Saturday morning I was riding into Cornelius on my normal Saturday
> morning
> ride on my MTB... just after I entered the city limits into a
> residential
> neighborhood I noticed a police cruiser following me... I thought
> nothing of
> it since I was being a good member of the biking community and
> obeying all
> traffic laws as I understand them... or so I thought... after just a
> few
> moments of following me the officer sounded his siren and fired off
> his
> lights... I looked back at him and gave him my best "Who me?"
> look... he
> motioned for me to pull over... he got out of his car came over to
> me and
> told me that the reason he was pulling me over was speeding... I
> guess I was
> going 32 in a 25 and he said he paced me at that speed... he did not
> issue
> me a ticket but told me I needed to watch my speed in a residential
> neighborhood and always obey the posted speed limit period... I was
> trying
> REALLY hard not to laugh that on a bike I was getting pulled over for
> speeding!
>
> So as a bicyclist... mind you with no speedometer... am I subject to
> the car
> speed limit?
>
> I did not think I could even get going that fast on my MTB... so that
> impressed me at least and I guess the conditioning rides are paying
> off...
> so was I getting my chain jerked by a bored police officer on a
> Saturday
> morning?
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Don Mathews
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org]
> On
> Behalf Of obra-request@list.obra.org
> Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 12:00 PM
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: OBRA Digest, Vol 31, Issue 17
>
> Send OBRA mailing list submissions to
> obra@list.obra.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> obra-request@list.obra.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> obra-owner@list.obra.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of OBRA digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. WTB: shallow drop road handlebar, 44/46 (Tim Schauer)
> 2. WTB ahead stem to Quill stem adaptor...? (Tim Schauer)
> 3. Unsubscribe (ironmanhawaii1044@yahoo.com)
> 4. July 25 Raffle Drawing for Veloforma F1R Frame,
> Lance-autographed Livestrong Cap (Darell C. Provencher)
> 5. Junior racer needs crutches! (will)
> 6. Attention Beaverton Area Bicyclists! (will)
> 7. Results-Track Championships Sprints & Keirins (Candi Murray)
> 8. State Track Champs Sunday Schedule (Candi Murray)
> 9. Ride to the State Games MTB race 7/20 (James Ceccorulli)
> 10. OT: F/S: HP 1250 fax machine (Karsten Hagen)
> 11. WTB: Brakeset (Derek Newell)
> 12. Cool Tour site (Karsten Hagen)
> 13. WTB: Italian thread Shimano Octalink Bottom bracket (Tim Schauer)
> 14. Any women going to MTB Oregon? (Kronda)
> 15. Awards at Rivercity (Mike Ripley)
> 16. Powertap (Alex)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 12:07:48 -0700
> From: Tim Schauer
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] WTB: shallow drop road handlebar, 44/46
> To: "obra@list.obra.org"
> Message-ID:
> <85B2BDAD0416D74FAA8BD75AE0FA81B10136576823@exch01.msi.local>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I'm looking for a shallow drop handlebar, like the Specialized
> shallow bar
> (78mm reach, 132mm drop). Looking for a 44 or 46 width. Either 31.8
> or 26.0
> clamp is okay. Not looking for an expensive one. I'm helping someone
> get
> into cycling on the cheap.
> Thanks,
> -Tim
>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 12:11:10 -0700
> From: Tim Schauer
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] WTB ahead stem to Quill stem adaptor...?
> To: "obra@list.obra.org"
> Message-ID:
> <85B2BDAD0416D74FAA8BD75AE0FA81B10136576824@exch01.msi.local>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I'm looking for one of those adaptors that converts a newer stem
> into a
> traditional old school quill stem for inserting into a 1" headset.
> Anybody
> want to get rid of one?
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 19:19:50 +0000
> From: ironmanhawaii1044@yahoo.com
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Unsubscribe
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Message-ID:
>
> <637391978-1215890452-
> cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-415848782-@bx
> e155.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain
>
>
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: obra-request@list.obra.org
>
> Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 12:00:01
> To:
> Subject: OBRA Digest, Vol 31, Issue 16
>
>
> Send OBRA mailing list submissions to
> obra@list.obra.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> obra-request@list.obra.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> obra-owner@list.obra.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of OBRA digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: butt rash (Michael O'Hair)
> 2. First rider kicked out of the Tour for doping
> (jon.ragsdale@comcast.net)
> 3. Re: butt rash (Douglas Duguay)
> 4. Re: butt rash (Chip)
> 5. Rider injured in Cascade Classic (Joe Cipale)
> 6. attorney referrals? (uma kleppinger)
> 7. Wilson River trail (David Rosen)
> 8. AVC starts one week from today!! (Charlie)
> 9. Re: Wilson River trail (Phreadi)
> 10. Bend: 85-year-old crash victim didn't survive (Eric Chu)
> 11. AVC host housing (Meg Mautner)
> 12. J. Rathe in bikeportland.org (Mark J. Ginsberg)
> 13. Re: Koin cyclist Poll (Monty Hill)
> 14. Re: Wilson River trail (Paul Greenwalt)
> 15. Triathlon aerobars and shorts for sale (Steph)
> 16. Re: butt rash (hrdtduck)
> 17. Wilson River trail (David Rosen)
> 18. Results-State Kilo/500 championships (Candi Murray)
> 19. Results-Thursday Night Alpenrose Series (Candi Murray)
> 20. Re: Butt Rash (Jon W)
> 21. WTB: Parts for cross bike (Millar-Griffin)
> 22. TdF cafe/shop telecast ?? (D. J.)
> 23. Re: TdF cafe/shop telecast ?? (Matthew Klahn)
> 24. FS: Giant TCR C1 - 15.4 lbs. Many Upgrades, big reduced
> price (Dave Bachman)
> 25. (no subject) (Lisa)
> 26. Re: (no subject) (Lisa)
> 27. WTB 52 CM Women's Bike (Douglas Duguay)
> 28. WTB 52 CM Women's Bike (Douglas Duguay)
> 29. FS: custom CX frameset (Anderson Folts)
> 30. WTB - 175mm road cranks (Tim Schauer)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 12:42:02 -0700
> From: "Michael O'Hair"
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] butt rash
> To:
> Message-ID: <003901c8e38e$31ba4010$19c963d8@qarus>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> First, wash everything, including your shorts to get rid of any salt
> residue. Second, grease up and lubricate any and all potential
> pressure
> points. I found that Cramer's SkinLube is very good in warm weather.
> It's
> basically vaseline with wax to raise the melting point.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "hrdtduck"
> To: "'Jimmy Cavalieri'" ;
> Sent: Friday, July 11, 2008 9:56 AM
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Grade of Corbett Rd
>
>
> > Speaking of curious,
> >
> > What do you guys do with butt rash...not a severe case or a
> infection of
> > any
> > kind, but a few pimples & irritation just from all the pressure and
> > rubbing
> > that "area" gets???
> >
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 19:42:09 +0000
> From: jon.ragsdale@comcast.net
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] First rider kicked out of the Tour for doping
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Message-ID:
>
> <
> 071120081942.18411.4877B791000C6C28000047EB22007511500A040E0B9C090E9DD20201
> 06@comcast.net>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Manuel Beltran was shown the door in the Tour today.
> http://www.kcra.com/sports/16855532/detail.html
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:13:06 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Douglas Duguay
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] butt rash
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Message-ID: <655733.84594.qm@web605.biz.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> You cannot beat Assos Chamois Creme for comfort. From
> the label: Assos chamois creme prolongs chamois life,
> prevents bacteria, and fungal infections (saddle
> sores,) keeps you comfortably cool by reducing
> friction.
>
>
>
> --- Michael O'Hair wrote:
>
> > First, wash everything, including your shorts to get
> > rid of any salt
> > residue. Second, grease up and lubricate any and
> > all potential pressure
> > points. I found that Cramer's SkinLube is very good
> > in warm weather. It's
> > basically vaseline with wax to raise the melting
> > point.
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "hrdtduck"
> > To: "'Jimmy Cavalieri'"
> > ;
> > Sent: Friday, July 11, 2008 9:56 AM
> > Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Grade of Corbett Rd
> >
> >
> > > Speaking of curious,
> > >
> > > What do you guys do with butt rash...not a severe
> > case or a infection of
> > > any
> > > kind, but a few pimples & irritation just from
> > all the pressure and
> > > rubbing
> > > that "area" gets???
> > >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OBRA mailing list
> > obra@list.obra.org
> > http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> > Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:17:54 -0700
> From: Chip
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] butt rash
> To: "Douglas Duguay"
> Cc: obra@list.obra.org
> Message-ID:
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Just got some DZNUTS, great stuff, and well as a Grundel Bruiser,
> very funny
> as well. I say easily as good or better than Assos
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 1:13 PM, Douglas Duguay
> wrote:
>
> > You cannot beat Assos Chamois Creme for comfort. From
> > the label: Assos chamois creme prolongs chamois life,
> > prevents bacteria, and fungal infections (saddle
> > sores,) keeps you comfortably cool by reducing
> > friction.
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Michael O'Hair wrote:
> >
> > > First, wash everything, including your shorts to get
> > > rid of any salt
> > > residue. Second, grease up and lubricate any and
> > > all potential pressure
> > > points. I found that Cramer's SkinLube is very good
> > > in warm weather. It's
> > > basically vaseline with wax to raise the melting
> > > point.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "hrdtduck"
> > > To: "'Jimmy Cavalieri'"
> > > ;
> > > Sent: Friday, July 11, 2008 9:56 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Grade of Corbett Rd
> > >
> > >
> > > > Speaking of curious,
> > > >
> > > > What do you guys do with butt rash...not a severe
> > > case or a infection of
> > > > any
> > > > kind, but a few pimples & irritation just from
> > > all the pressure and
> > > > rubbing
> > > > that "area" gets???
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > OBRA mailing list
> > > obra@list.obra.org
> > > http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> > > Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OBRA mailing list
> > obra@list.obra.org
> > http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> > Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:41:00 -0700
> From: "Joe Cipale"
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rider injured in Cascade Classic
> To: "OBRA"
> Message-ID: <200807112041.m6BKf0df028456@sapphire.spiritone.com>
>
> http://www.kgw.com/news-local/stories/kgw_071108_news_cyclist_crash_.45c0aa3
> 7.html
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:50:00 -0700
> From: uma kleppinger
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] attorney referrals?
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Message-ID: <4877c778f408b_1c315a0dd32745c15a@lizard.tmail>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> I know there are several bicycle attorneys around Portland, I'm just
> curious
> about referrals from riders who've resolved their bike-meets-car
> claims with
> the help of a local attorney.
>
> Please email me back off list and keep the OBRA chat clear.
>
> Thanks.
>
> uma
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 14:06:35 -0700
> From: "David Rosen"
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Wilson River trail
> To: "'Obra'"
> Cc: 'Jason Temchin'
> Message-ID: <004101c8e39a$01386140$6501a8c0@overlord>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Hi OBRA,
>
>
>
> A teammate and I were planning on doing some mountain biking at the
> Wilson
> River trail tomorrow, but with all of the emails going around about
> Gales
> Creek being destroyed, I was curious if anyone knew of the condition
> at
> Wilson River?
>
>
>
> Also, if Wilson River is not in good shape, anywhere else (aside from
> Brown's camp) that you would recommend?
>
>
>
> Thanks.
>
> Dave
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 14:02:03 -0700
> From: Charlie
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] AVC starts one week from today!!
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Message-ID: <4877ca4bb4594_1c315a0dc41dd1c24b@lizard.tmail>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> The Alpenrose Challenge starts next Friday and this year's racing
> will be
> fantastic. Elite men and women from all over the country are making
> their
> way to Portland to put on a good show. Let's show our support by
> filling
> the stands and making lots of noise!!! Racing starts at 10:00 a.m.
> Friday,
> Saturday and Sunday. There will be a kiddie kilo at the start of the
> Saturday and Sunday evening sessions.
>
> Food Saturday and Sunday will be available from Macaroni Grill.
> Intermission entertainment on Saturday will be provided by the Last
> Regiment
> of Syncopated Drummers. Each evening session will feature a chance for
> spectators to win money in a 50/50 Split the Pot raffle. Raffle
> tickets
> will be sold and all money will go into a pot that will be split
> 50/50. One
> half will go to the raffle winner, the other half will go to the
> racers in
> the form of a lap prize.
>
> Come out and enjoy some of the best track racing in the country in
> your own
> backyard. Admission is FREE!
>
> Check out www.alpenrosechallenge.com for a schedule of events.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 14:32:19 -0700
> From: Phreadi
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Wilson River trail
> To: "David Rosen"
> Cc: Obra , Jason Temchin
>
> Message-ID:
> <39d72ecc0807111432i36e55c43y61a795b0be5f4f36@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I've ridden wilson river from the Elk Creek TH to Kings Mountain TH
> (only
> 3.8 miles) and it was fine. I haven't ridden west of Kings Mountain
> though,
> but with no real clearcuts anywhere near the trail I'm guessing it's
> fine as
> well, save for some blow down.
> -Fred
>
> 2008/7/11 David Rosen :
>
> > Hi OBRA,
> >
> >
> >
> > A teammate and I were planning on doing some mountain biking at
> the Wilson
> > River trail tomorrow, but with all of the emails going around
> about Gales
> > Creek being destroyed, I was curious if anyone knew of the
> condition at
> > Wilson River?
> >
> >
> >
> > Also, if Wilson River is not in good shape, anywhere else (aside
> from
> > Brown's camp) that you would recommend?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Dave
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OBRA mailing list
> > obra@list.obra.org
> > http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> > Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Fred Ihle
> phreadi@gmail.com
> [503] 329-6634
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 14:57:40 -0700 (GMT-07:00)
> From: Eric Chu
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bend: 85-year-old crash victim didn't survive
> To: bendcycling@yahoogroups.com, OBRA chat
> Message-ID:
>
> <11923572.1215813460437.JavaMail.root@whwamui-soar.pas.sa.earthlink.net
> >
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
>
> regrettably, I just only now found out the 85-year-old that was hit
> by a
> truck on Purcell a few weeks ago did not survive his injuries. There
> was a
> brief mention from KTVZ in another story about a hit and run, but I
> thought
> I heard it wrong since I had not seen anything in the local press
> here in
> Bend, but found the following from the Gresham Outlook:
>
> "Duane ?Duke? Noteboom
>
> Dec. 21, 1922-June 28, 2008
>
> Former Gresham resident Duane ?Duke? Noteboom, 85, died Saturday,
> June 28,
> in Bend. He was hit by a pickup truck as he was bicycling.
>
> A memorial service will be held at 1 p.m. Wednesday, July 2, at Rock
> Arbor
> Villa Clubhouse, 2200 N.E. Highway 20, Bend.
>
> Duke was born Dec. 21, 1922, in South Dakota to Benjamin and Elsie
> (Husman)
> Noteboom. He was raised in Tillamook and graduated from Tillamook High
> School. He enlisted in the Army in 1942 and served during World War
> II.
>
> In December 1964, he married Lory Barnett. They lived in Gresham for
> 21
> years, and then they lived in Bend for the last 23 years.
>
> Duke worked as a truck driver, retiring in 1985. His hobbies included
> cycling and walking, and he danced with Rose City Squares for 35
> years.
>
> He was preceded in death by his brothers, Roland Noteboom and Don
> Noteboom;
> and stepdaughter, Diane Shelly.
>
> Survivors include his wife; daughters, Karen Forrester of West Linn
> and
> Yvonne Ellison of Milwaukie; stepsons, Jerry Graff of Sandy and
> Ronald Crane
> of Oregon City; brother, Dorence Noteboom of Corvallis; 12
=== message truncated ===
Mark J. Ginsberg
Attorney At Law
1216 SE Belmont St.
Portland, OR 97214
(503) 542-3000
Fax (503) 233-6874
markjginsberg@yahoo.com
www.bikesafetylaw.com