Chad Butler

a bike lane isn't a fast lane, it's a shoulder. When making passes they should always be on the left. If the traffic on the left is slow or stopped you need to adjust your speed to react to their ingressions of your path of travel. Ambulances and police cars creep past stopped traffic on a shoulder rather than blowing past at top speed. Unless your emergency is more dire you should always be more careful than the examples they set. Even in a bike lane you're still a road user.

Seth May

There are a lot of articles and buzz out there right now about driver/bike interactions. The TDLR summary of it is that in the current environment, the best way of getting away with murder is to kill a cyclist/pedestrian with a car. Very few drivers are ticketed, let alone prosecuted for killing or injuring someone with their car. This isn’t how it should be, but it is a current reality (as well as an obvious over generalization).

www.nytimes.com/2013/11/10/opinion/sunday/is-it-ok-to-kill-cyclists.html

http://www.treehugger.com/bikes/lets-stop-calling-murder-cyclists-people-driving-bmws-accidents.html

https://www.google.com/search?q=drivers+kill+bikes

I believe the rider in your scenario would have the right of way. Bug, as my driving instructor put it, “There are a lot of dead people out there who had the right of way.”

Ride defensively, and don’t trust that people see you, even if you make eye contact.

Thanks

Seth

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of stevea.long
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2014 10:25 AM
To: Dan H; Tom Bird; obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Bike Lane Question

Ditto what Dan said. You have to be crazy to trust a car to keep you safe.

Sent via the Samsung GALAXY S®4, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

-------- Original message --------

From: Dan H

Date:05/13/2014 7:57 PM (GMT-08:00)

To: Tom Bird ,obra@list.obra.org

Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Bike Lane Question

I don't care who has the right of way. I'm passing on the left so as not to be killed.

From: Tom Bird

Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2014 7:36 PM

To: obra@list.obra.org

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bike Lane Question

I love having a resource like OBRA to ask these questions. A friend of mine just ran into this problem and I have been wondering about it for a while so here goes…

You are in a bike lane and there is a vehicle ahead of you that wants to turn right. Blinker on blinker off not sure if it really matters, the key is the car does not know you are there as they did not pass you, you are approaching them from behind and they want to take a right turn across the bike lane.

What is the legal ramification here> Are they obligated to check for an overtaking bike and wait (and I will throw this out there now since I discounted it above) even if they put their blinker on to turn right? Is a bike ever obligated to wait for a car ahead of them to turn before they continue on their path? Legally? Or do they always have the right of way in that situation.

OK I am looking for the legal standpoint here not the practical you should stop as you will lose to any vehicle and get crushed etc.

Page 82 of the Oregon Drive Manual states:

• You must yield to bicyclists in a bicycle lane or on a sidewalk, before you turn across the lane or sidewalk.

I find that still sort of vague considering most of what I found on the web make the argument that the car overtook the bike (thus knew it was there) and then tried to make a right turn cutting off the bicyclist. Not the car has no idea the bike is there and overtaking the car.

http://www.stc-law.com/bikelanes.html

http://blog.oregonlive.com/commuting/2010/11/helmet_needed_to_answer_bike_l.html

So anyone have a true legal verification or interpretation of this situation?

Thanks!

_____

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stevea.long

Ditto what Dan said. You have to be crazy to trust a car to keep you safe.

Sent via the Samsung GALAXY S®4, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

I don't care who has the right of way. I'm passing on the left so as not to be killed.

From: Tom Bird
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2014 7:36 PM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bike Lane Question

I love having a resource like OBRA to ask these questions. A friend of mine just ran into this problem and I have been wondering about it for a while so here goes…

You are in a bike lane and there is a vehicle ahead of you that wants to turn right. Blinker on blinker off not sure if it really matters, the key is the car does not know you are there as they did not pass you, you are approaching them from behind and they want to take a right turn across the bike lane.

What is the legal ramification here> Are they obligated to check for an overtaking bike and wait (and I will throw this out there now since I discounted it above) even if they put their blinker on to turn right? Is a bike ever obligated to wait for a car ahead of them to turn before they continue on their path? Legally? Or do they always have the right of way in that situation.

OK I am looking for the legal standpoint here not the practical you should stop as you will lose to any vehicle and get crushed etc.

Page 82 of the Oregon Drive Manual states:

• You must yield to bicyclists in a bicycle lane or on a sidewalk, before you turn across the lane or sidewalk.

I find that still sort of vague considering most of what I found on the web make the argument that the car overtook the bike (thus knew it was there) and then tried to make a right turn cutting off the bicyclist. Not the car has no idea the bike is there and overtaking the car.

http://www.stc-law.com/bikelanes.html

http://blog.oregonlive.com/commuting/2010/11/helmet_needed_to_answer_bike_l.html


So anyone have a true legal verification or interpretation of this situation?

Thanks!
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OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Ken Luke

I'm not a lawyer but it seems pretty clear to me: it says "You must yield…" and doesn't say "…unless the bicyclist snuck up on you."

In reality however, you'd be an idiot to put yourself right up next to that car. It's a pretty safe bet that their attention is to the left, looking for a gap in the traffic. Even in Portland, as long as the driver doesn't back up over your corpse a couple of times, they'll usually get off scott-free.

On May 13, 2014, at 7:36 PM, Tom Bird wrote:

> I love having a resource like OBRA to ask these questions. A friend of mine just ran into this problem and I have been wondering about it for a while so here goes…
>
> You are in a bike lane and there is a vehicle ahead of you that wants to turn right. Blinker on blinker off not sure if it really matters, the key is the car does not know you are there as they did not pass you, you are approaching them from behind and they want to take a right turn across the bike lane.
>
> What is the legal ramification here> Are they obligated to check for an overtaking bike and wait (and I will throw this out there now since I discounted it above) even if they put their blinker on to turn right? Is a bike ever obligated to wait for a car ahead of them to turn before they continue on their path? Legally? Or do they always have the right of way in that situation.
>
> OK I am looking for the legal standpoint here not the practical you should stop as you will lose to any vehicle and get crushed etc.
>
> Page 82 of the Oregon Drive Manual states:
>
> • You must yield to bicyclists in a bicycle lane or on a sidewalk, before you turn across the lane or sidewalk.
>
> I find that still sort of vague considering most of what I found on the web make the argument that the car overtook the bike (thus knew it was there) and then tried to make a right turn cutting off the bicyclist. Not the car has no idea the bike is there and overtaking the car.
>
> http://www.stc-law.com/bikelanes.html
>
> http://blog.oregonlive.com/commuting/2010/11/helmet_needed_to_answer_bike_l.html
>
>
> So anyone have a true legal verification or interpretation of this situation?

------------------------------------------------------------
Ken Luke kenl97216@gmail.com (971)207-6548

"Complexity is easy; Simplicity is hard."
-- Edmund Keane
------------------------------------------------------------

Dan H

I don't care who has the right of way. I'm passing on the left so as not to be killed.

From: Tom Bird
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2014 7:36 PM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bike Lane Question

I love having a resource like OBRA to ask these questions. A friend of mine just ran into this problem and I have been wondering about it for a while so here goes.

You are in a bike lane and there is a vehicle ahead of you that wants to turn right. Blinker on blinker off not sure if it really matters, the key is the car does not know you are there as they did not pass you, you are approaching them from behind and they want to take a right turn across the bike lane.

What is the legal ramification here> Are they obligated to check for an overtaking bike and wait (and I will throw this out there now since I discounted it above) even if they put their blinker on to turn right? Is a bike ever obligated to wait for a car ahead of them to turn before they continue on their path? Legally? Or do they always have the right of way in that situation.

OK I am looking for the legal standpoint here not the practical you should stop as you will lose to any vehicle and get crushed etc.

Page 82 of the Oregon Drive Manual states:

. You must yield to bicyclists in a bicycle lane or on a sidewalk, before you turn across the lane or sidewalk.

I find that still sort of vague considering most of what I found on the web make the argument that the car overtook the bike (thus knew it was there) and then tried to make a right turn cutting off the bicyclist. Not the car has no idea the bike is there and overtaking the car.

http://www.stc-law.com/bikelanes.html

http://blog.oregonlive.com/commuting/2010/11/helmet_needed_to_answer_bike_l.html

So anyone have a true legal verification or interpretation of this situation?

Thanks!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Tom Bird

I love having a resource like OBRA to ask these questions. A friend of mine
just ran into this problem and I have been wondering about it for a while so
here goes.

You are in a bike lane and there is a vehicle ahead of you that wants to
turn right. Blinker on blinker off not sure if it really matters, the key
is the car does not know you are there as they did not pass you, you are
approaching them from behind and they want to take a right turn across the
bike lane.

What is the legal ramification here> Are they obligated to check for an
overtaking bike and wait (and I will throw this out there now since I
discounted it above) even if they put their blinker on to turn right? Is a
bike ever obligated to wait for a car ahead of them to turn before they
continue on their path? Legally? Or do they always have the right of way
in that situation.

OK I am looking for the legal standpoint here not the practical you should
stop as you will lose to any vehicle and get crushed etc.

Page 82 of the Oregon Drive Manual states:

. You must yield to bicyclists in a bicycle lane or on a sidewalk, before
you turn across the lane or sidewalk.

I find that still sort of vague considering most of what I found on the web
make the argument that the car overtook the bike (thus knew it was there)
and then tried to make a right turn cutting off the bicyclist. Not the car
has no idea the bike is there and overtaking the car.

http://www.stc-law.com/bikelanes.html

http://blog.oregonlive.com/commuting/2010/11/helmet_needed_to_answer_bike_l.
html

So anyone have a true legal verification or interpretation of this
situation?

Thanks!