Ron

I agree with Seth's interpretation.

The key statement is: Unless otherwise specified in these rules, penalties are at the discretion of the Chief Referee.

I see specific penalties mentioned for certain infractions. But I don't see anything that changes the authority for enforcing them.

I think you're both hitting the key point; that the CR needs to give clear instructions to the AR on what infractions they can enforce penalties on...safety being the main consideration.

Ron

> On Apr 2, 2015, at 12:46 PM, Mike Murray via OBRA_Officials wrote:
>
> This is not correct information. There is nothing in the OBRA rules that
> limits the ability to disqualify to the CR. The applicable rule is:
>
> 2.12 Penalty
> A punishment for infraction of the rules. Penalties may be applied
> to clubs/event organizers (or their designees) , individual riders or
> teams. Unless otherwise specified in these rules, penalties are at
> the discretion of the Chief Referee.
>
> If there is a specified penalty then disqualification could be done by any
> official. For example:
>
> 7.1 Helmets
> ... (disqualification for failure to wear such a helmet
> or for removing it during a race).
>
> Centerline, like most road racing rules, does not have a specified
> penalty. Most of road racing penalties follow the statement:
>
> "These penalties are guidelines and Chief Referees
> may impose different penalties based on the different facts and
> circumstances of each situation"
>
> Track racing and cyclocross racing are a bit more rigid with many specific
> penalties listed without the "guidelines" proviso. Mountain biking has
> few specific penalties but there is one specific disqualification penalty:
>
> 18.4.2(h) Any racer found intentionally littering the course will be
> disqualified.
>
> I would recommend that the CR routinely give ARs the ability to make
> immediate disqualifications for safety related rules like center line
> violations.
>
> Mike Murray
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: OBRA_Officials [mailto:obra_officials-bounces@list.obra.org] On
> Behalf Of Seth May via OBRA_Officials
> Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 09:24
> To: obra_officials@list.obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Officials] Learning from feedback
>
> I know I'm a bit late to the conversation, but we need to be careful
> around DQ'ing riders. There are no automatic DQs for on-road offenses in
> road racing.
>
> Only Chief Referees are authorized to DQ riders. They may empower
> Assistant Referees to do so as well, generally with specific guidelines
> and instructions attached to it (Rule 15.7.2). The CR should make this
> authority and limitations clear in the pre-race officials meeting. If the
> CR doesn't say anything, AR does not have the authority to DQ a rider.
>
> That said, an AR can enforce alternative punishments in these cases (Rule
> 15.7.3). I'm sure my more experienced colleagues can recommend several
> effective strategies.
>
> Thanks
> Seth
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: OBRA_Officials [mailto:obra_officials-bounces@list.obra.org] On
> Behalf Of Lisa Winchester via OBRA_Officials
> Sent: Friday, March 27, 2015 3:32 PM
> To: Candi Murray
> Cc: OBRA Officials
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Officials] Learning from feedback
>
> Absolutely, repeated center line violations are an automatic dq in the
> rules. Those 2 riders should have been tossed.
>
> -Lisa
>
>>> On Mar 27, 2015, at 2:33 PM, Candi Murray via OBRA_Officials
>> wrote:
>>
>> See the note below that we received after a recent race. I redacted
>> the
> names so we could use this as a learning moment. Without knowing what the
> officials involved saw from the follow car I do think it is important that
> we enforce the rules with consistent penalties.
>> Thoughts?
>> Candi
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> Begin forwarded
>>>> Hello Kenji,
>>>>
>>>> I don't have Xxx email address so I am not able to add him to this
>>>> message.
>>>>
>>>> Looking at the results on OBRA.org you can see that Rider 1and rider
>>>> 2 both receive Warnings for center line violations on Sunday. I am
>>>> not really pleased how these infractions were handled by our
>>>> official's team. I would like to offer the following guidance of
>>>> what I would like to see. I would also like to note how in the
>>>> women's race Rider 3 was relegate to last unlike the warnings the
>>>> men's received. I am not sure how her's actions were more sever.
>>>>
>>>> The center line violation happened on the first lap within the break
>>>> of ten when we came to a T in the course for the first time. There
>>>> was a sweeping left turn lane in opposing lane coming in from the
>>>> left in addition to the T. There was a clear sign between the turn
>>>> that says DO NOT ENTER. The turn was confusing at first and Rider 2
>>>> on the front decided to go into the on coming turn lane and cut the
>>>> corner. The other break members how the turn went and followed the
>>>> course and turned at the T next to the cones. I did pay real
>>>> attention right afterwards, but the official did not point out the
>>>> infraction to warn us all and Tim also continued to race. I
>>>> expected the car to come along side us and warn us at least. After
>>>> the break made the turn the first time it was obvious which was the
>>>> correct direction. On the second lap Rider 1 clearly goes into the
>>>> on coming sweeping inside turn against the Do Not Enter sign. If
>>>> you look at the results he just got a warning as well. If the
>>>> grouped was warned before hand you could easily justify removing him
>>>> from the race. If a Sheriff was insight of these action, he would
> probably had the permit suspended for 2016 and would be extremely upset.
>>>>
>>>> I don't want any changes to be made to the results. It was clear
>>>> that he was the best rider and it is good to have him in the mix to
>>>> toughen everyone up. I would like to see an announcement made on
>>>> OBRA chat or at the beginning of the race this weekend in regards to
>>>> this and maybe someone speak to Rider 1 as well. Please leave me
>>>> out of it. I have hard enough time just trying to keep up with him.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you,
>>>>
>>>> Rider 4
>> _______________________________________________
>> OBRA_Officials mailing list
>> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA_Officials mailing list
> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA_Officials mailing list
> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA_Officials mailing list
> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials

Mike Murray

This is not correct information. There is nothing in the OBRA rules that
limits the ability to disqualify to the CR. The applicable rule is:

2.12 Penalty
A punishment for infraction of the rules. Penalties may be applied
to clubs/event organizers (or their designees) , individual riders or
teams. Unless otherwise specified in these rules, penalties are at
the discretion of the Chief Referee.

If there is a specified penalty then disqualification could be done by any
official. For example:

7.1 Helmets
... (disqualification for failure to wear such a helmet
or for removing it during a race).

Centerline, like most road racing rules, does not have a specified
penalty. Most of road racing penalties follow the statement:

"These penalties are guidelines and Chief Referees
may impose different penalties based on the different facts and
circumstances of each situation"

Track racing and cyclocross racing are a bit more rigid with many specific
penalties listed without the "guidelines" proviso. Mountain biking has
few specific penalties but there is one specific disqualification penalty:

18.4.2(h) Any racer found intentionally littering the course will be
disqualified.

I would recommend that the CR routinely give ARs the ability to make
immediate disqualifications for safety related rules like center line
violations.

Mike Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: OBRA_Officials [mailto:obra_officials-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Seth May via OBRA_Officials
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 09:24
To: obra_officials@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Officials] Learning from feedback

I know I'm a bit late to the conversation, but we need to be careful
around DQ'ing riders. There are no automatic DQs for on-road offenses in
road racing.

Only Chief Referees are authorized to DQ riders. They may empower
Assistant Referees to do so as well, generally with specific guidelines
and instructions attached to it (Rule 15.7.2). The CR should make this
authority and limitations clear in the pre-race officials meeting. If the
CR doesn't say anything, AR does not have the authority to DQ a rider.

That said, an AR can enforce alternative punishments in these cases (Rule
15.7.3). I'm sure my more experienced colleagues can recommend several
effective strategies.

Thanks
Seth

-----Original Message-----
From: OBRA_Officials [mailto:obra_officials-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Lisa Winchester via OBRA_Officials
Sent: Friday, March 27, 2015 3:32 PM
To: Candi Murray
Cc: OBRA Officials
Subject: Re: [OBRA Officials] Learning from feedback

Absolutely, repeated center line violations are an automatic dq in the
rules. Those 2 riders should have been tossed.

-Lisa

> On Mar 27, 2015, at 2:33 PM, Candi Murray via OBRA_Officials
wrote:
>
> See the note below that we received after a recent race. I redacted
> the
names so we could use this as a learning moment. Without knowing what the
officials involved saw from the follow car I do think it is important that
we enforce the rules with consistent penalties.
> Thoughts?
> Candi
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> Begin forwarded
>>> Hello Kenji,
>>>
>>> I don't have Xxx email address so I am not able to add him to this
>>> message.
>>>
>>> Looking at the results on OBRA.org you can see that Rider 1and rider
>>> 2 both receive Warnings for center line violations on Sunday. I am
>>> not really pleased how these infractions were handled by our
>>> official's team. I would like to offer the following guidance of
>>> what I would like to see. I would also like to note how in the
>>> women's race Rider 3 was relegate to last unlike the warnings the
>>> men's received. I am not sure how her's actions were more sever.
>>>
>>> The center line violation happened on the first lap within the break
>>> of ten when we came to a T in the course for the first time. There
>>> was a sweeping left turn lane in opposing lane coming in from the
>>> left in addition to the T. There was a clear sign between the turn
>>> that says DO NOT ENTER. The turn was confusing at first and Rider 2
>>> on the front decided to go into the on coming turn lane and cut the
>>> corner. The other break members how the turn went and followed the
>>> course and turned at the T next to the cones. I did pay real
>>> attention right afterwards, but the official did not point out the
>>> infraction to warn us all and Tim also continued to race. I
>>> expected the car to come along side us and warn us at least. After
>>> the break made the turn the first time it was obvious which was the
>>> correct direction. On the second lap Rider 1 clearly goes into the
>>> on coming sweeping inside turn against the Do Not Enter sign. If
>>> you look at the results he just got a warning as well. If the
>>> grouped was warned before hand you could easily justify removing him
>>> from the race. If a Sheriff was insight of these action, he would
probably had the permit suspended for 2016 and would be extremely upset.
>>>
>>> I don't want any changes to be made to the results. It was clear
>>> that he was the best rider and it is good to have him in the mix to
>>> toughen everyone up. I would like to see an announcement made on
>>> OBRA chat or at the beginning of the race this weekend in regards to
>>> this and maybe someone speak to Rider 1 as well. Please leave me
>>> out of it. I have hard enough time just trying to keep up with him.
>>>
>>> Thank you,
>>>
>>> Rider 4
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA_Officials mailing list
> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials
>
_______________________________________________
OBRA_Officials mailing list
OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials

_______________________________________________
OBRA_Officials mailing list
OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials

Seth May

I know I'm a bit late to the conversation, but we need to be careful around
DQ'ing riders. There are no automatic DQs for on-road offenses in road
racing.

Only Chief Referees are authorized to DQ riders. They may empower Assistant
Referees to do so as well, generally with specific guidelines and
instructions attached to it (Rule 15.7.2). The CR should make this authority
and limitations clear in the pre-race officials meeting. If the CR doesn't
say anything, AR does not have the authority to DQ a rider.

That said, an AR can enforce alternative punishments in these cases (Rule
15.7.3). I'm sure my more experienced colleagues can recommend several
effective strategies.

Thanks
Seth

-----Original Message-----
From: OBRA_Officials [mailto:obra_officials-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf
Of Lisa Winchester via OBRA_Officials
Sent: Friday, March 27, 2015 3:32 PM
To: Candi Murray
Cc: OBRA Officials
Subject: Re: [OBRA Officials] Learning from feedback

Absolutely, repeated center line violations are an automatic dq in the
rules. Those 2 riders should have been tossed.

-Lisa

> On Mar 27, 2015, at 2:33 PM, Candi Murray via OBRA_Officials
wrote:
>
> See the note below that we received after a recent race. I redacted the
names so we could use this as a learning moment. Without knowing what the
officials involved saw from the follow car I do think it is important that
we enforce the rules with consistent penalties.
> Thoughts?
> Candi
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> Begin forwarded
>>> Hello Kenji,
>>>
>>> I don't have Xxx email address so I am not able to add him to this
>>> message.
>>>
>>> Looking at the results on OBRA.org you can see that Rider 1and rider
>>> 2 both receive Warnings for center line violations on Sunday. I am
>>> not really pleased how these infractions were handled by our
>>> official's team. I would like to offer the following guidance of
>>> what I would like to see. I would also like to note how in the
>>> women's race Rider 3 was relegate to last unlike the warnings the
>>> men's received. I am not sure how her's actions were more sever.
>>>
>>> The center line violation happened on the first lap within the break
>>> of ten when we came to a T in the course for the first time. There
>>> was a sweeping left turn lane in opposing lane coming in from the
>>> left in addition to the T. There was a clear sign between the turn
>>> that says DO NOT ENTER. The turn was confusing at first and Rider 2
>>> on the front decided to go into the on coming turn lane and cut the
>>> corner. The other break members how the turn went and followed the
>>> course and turned at the T next to the cones. I did pay real
>>> attention right afterwards, but the official did not point out the
>>> infraction to warn us all and Tim also continued to race. I
>>> expected the car to come along side us and warn us at least. After
>>> the break made the turn the first time it was obvious which was the
>>> correct direction. On the second lap Rider 1 clearly goes into the
>>> on coming sweeping inside turn against the Do Not Enter sign. If
>>> you look at the results he just got a warning as well. If the
>>> grouped was warned before hand you could easily justify removing him
>>> from the race. If a Sheriff was insight of these action, he would
probably had the permit suspended for 2016 and would be extremely upset.
>>>
>>> I don't want any changes to be made to the results. It was clear
>>> that he was the best rider and it is good to have him in the mix to
>>> toughen everyone up. I would like to see an announcement made on
>>> OBRA chat or at the beginning of the race this weekend in regards to
>>> this and maybe someone speak to Rider 1 as well. Please leave me
>>> out of it. I have hard enough time just trying to keep up with him.
>>>
>>> Thank you,
>>>
>>> Rider 4
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA_Officials mailing list
> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials
>
_______________________________________________
OBRA_Officials mailing list
OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials

Jordan

It does make sense that if we make a statement to the racers or are enforcing the rules we are consistent with them. I don't feel the flyer should have any kind of rule enforcement jargon in it but maybe more of a warning as to what can happen if OBRA rules are not followed.

While DQ'ing riders seems like an easy solution and I don't want to hand hold I think we can collectively make all the racers understand our stance on said issues.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 27, 2015, at 3:32 PM, Lisa Winchester via OBRA_Officials wrote:
>
> Absolutely, repeated center line violations are an automatic dq in the rules. Those 2 riders should have been tossed.
>
> -Lisa
>
>> On Mar 27, 2015, at 2:33 PM, Candi Murray via OBRA_Officials wrote:
>>
>> See the note below that we received after a recent race. I redacted the names so we could use this as a learning moment. Without knowing what the officials involved saw from the follow car I do think it is important that we enforce the rules with consistent penalties.
>> Thoughts?
>> Candi
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> Begin forwarded
>>>> Hello Kenji,
>>>>
>>>> I don't have Xxx email address so I am not able to add him to this
>>>> message.
>>>>
>>>> Looking at the results on OBRA.org you can see that Rider 1and rider 2
>>>> both receive Warnings for center line violations on Sunday. I am not really
>>>> pleased how these infractions were handled by our official's team. I would
>>>> like to offer the following guidance of what I would like to see. I would
>>>> also like to note how in the women's race Rider 3 was relegate to last unlike
>>>> the warnings the men's received. I am not sure how her's actions were more
>>>> sever.
>>>>
>>>> The center line violation happened on the first lap within the break of ten
>>>> when we came to a T in the course for the first time. There was a sweeping
>>>> left turn lane in opposing lane coming in from the left in addition to the
>>>> T. There was a clear sign between the turn that says DO NOT ENTER. The
>>>> turn was confusing at first and Rider 2 on the front decided to go into
>>>> the on coming turn lane and cut the corner. The other break members how the
>>>> turn went and followed the course and turned at the T next to the cones. I
>>>> did pay real attention right afterwards, but the official did not point out
>>>> the infraction to warn us all and Tim also continued to race. I expected
>>>> the car to come along side us and warn us at least. After the break made
>>>> the turn the first time it was obvious which was the correct direction. On
>>>> the second lap Rider 1 clearly goes into the on coming sweeping inside turn
>>>> against the Do Not Enter sign. If you look at the results he just got a
>>>> warning as well. If the grouped was warned before hand you could easily
>>>> justify removing him from the race. If a Sheriff was insight of these
>>>> action, he would probably had the permit suspended for 2016 and would be
>>>> extremely upset.
>>>>
>>>> I don't want any changes to be made to the results. It was clear that he
>>>> was the best rider and it is good to have him in the mix to toughen everyone
>>>> up. I would like to see an announcement made on OBRA chat or at the
>>>> beginning of the race this weekend in regards to this and maybe someone
>>>> speak to Rider 1 as well. Please leave me out of it. I have hard enough time
>>>> just trying to keep up with him.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you,
>>>>
>>>> Rider 4
>> _______________________________________________
>> OBRA_Officials mailing list
>> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials
>>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA_Officials mailing list
> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials

Lisa Winchester

Absolutely, repeated center line violations are an automatic dq in the rules. Those 2 riders should have been tossed.

-Lisa

> On Mar 27, 2015, at 2:33 PM, Candi Murray via OBRA_Officials wrote:
>
> See the note below that we received after a recent race. I redacted the names so we could use this as a learning moment. Without knowing what the officials involved saw from the follow car I do think it is important that we enforce the rules with consistent penalties.
> Thoughts?
> Candi
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> Begin forwarded
>>> Hello Kenji,
>>>
>>> I don't have Xxx email address so I am not able to add him to this
>>> message.
>>>
>>> Looking at the results on OBRA.org you can see that Rider 1and rider 2
>>> both receive Warnings for center line violations on Sunday. I am not really
>>> pleased how these infractions were handled by our official's team. I would
>>> like to offer the following guidance of what I would like to see. I would
>>> also like to note how in the women's race Rider 3 was relegate to last unlike
>>> the warnings the men's received. I am not sure how her's actions were more
>>> sever.
>>>
>>> The center line violation happened on the first lap within the break of ten
>>> when we came to a T in the course for the first time. There was a sweeping
>>> left turn lane in opposing lane coming in from the left in addition to the
>>> T. There was a clear sign between the turn that says DO NOT ENTER. The
>>> turn was confusing at first and Rider 2 on the front decided to go into
>>> the on coming turn lane and cut the corner. The other break members how the
>>> turn went and followed the course and turned at the T next to the cones. I
>>> did pay real attention right afterwards, but the official did not point out
>>> the infraction to warn us all and Tim also continued to race. I expected
>>> the car to come along side us and warn us at least. After the break made
>>> the turn the first time it was obvious which was the correct direction. On
>>> the second lap Rider 1 clearly goes into the on coming sweeping inside turn
>>> against the Do Not Enter sign. If you look at the results he just got a
>>> warning as well. If the grouped was warned before hand you could easily
>>> justify removing him from the race. If a Sheriff was insight of these
>>> action, he would probably had the permit suspended for 2016 and would be
>>> extremely upset.
>>>
>>> I don't want any changes to be made to the results. It was clear that he
>>> was the best rider and it is good to have him in the mix to toughen everyone
>>> up. I would like to see an announcement made on OBRA chat or at the
>>> beginning of the race this weekend in regards to this and maybe someone
>>> speak to Rider 1 as well. Please leave me out of it. I have hard enough time
>>> just trying to keep up with him.
>>>
>>> Thank you,
>>>
>>> Rider 4
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA_Officials mailing list
> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials
>

Mike Hilbrandt

Assuming Rider 4 is a male and not racing with the women, any penalties
that happened in those two races are a moot point. There are too many
unknowns for anyone to play armchair official (was she/they warned during
the race and continued to cross c.l.?).

As for expecting the official to come up and warn the riders about riding
into oncoming traffic/ DO NOT ENTER areas - do we really need to do this?
It seems like the warning should be a given and a second infraction would
be relegation - at the discretion of the CR. Typically, when I ride up
alongside a rider to give them a warning, they already know why I am there
and are apologetic.
Perhaps there was an announcement at the beginning of the race, which most
of the riders do not listen to?

Maybe there needs to be a pre-race statement that just because we don't
call you out at the time of the infraction, do not assume it wasn't
observed - in other words, if you break the rules, expect at least a
warning in the results.

Then again, I'm pretty sure everyone was issued a center line warning at
the beginning of the dirty circles races, and yet, if I had removed all of
those who still crossed it, then the finishing 123 fields would have been a
lot smaller.

Mike

On Fri, Mar 27, 2015 at 2:33 PM, Candi Murray via OBRA_Officials <
obra_officials@list.obra.org> wrote:

> See the note below that we received after a recent race. I redacted the
> names so we could use this as a learning moment. Without knowing what the
> officials involved saw from the follow car I do think it is important that
> we enforce the rules with consistent penalties.
> Thoughts?
> Candi
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> Begin forwarded
> >> Hello Kenji,
> >>
> >> I don't have Xxx email address so I am not able to add him to this
> >> message.
> >>
> >> Looking at the results on OBRA.org you can see that Rider 1and rider 2
> >> both receive Warnings for center line violations on Sunday. I am not
> really
> >> pleased how these infractions were handled by our official's team. I
> would
> >> like to offer the following guidance of what I would like to see. I
> would
> >> also like to note how in the women's race Rider 3 was relegate to last
> unlike
> >> the warnings the men's received. I am not sure how her's actions were
> more
> >> sever.
> >>
> >> The center line violation happened on the first lap within the break of
> ten
> >> when we came to a T in the course for the first time. There was a
> sweeping
> >> left turn lane in opposing lane coming in from the left in addition to
> the
> >> T. There was a clear sign between the turn that says DO NOT ENTER. The
> >> turn was confusing at first and Rider 2 on the front decided to go into
> >> the on coming turn lane and cut the corner. The other break members
> how the
> >> turn went and followed the course and turned at the T next to the
> cones. I
> >> did pay real attention right afterwards, but the official did not point
> out
> >> the infraction to warn us all and Tim also continued to race. I
> expected
> >> the car to come along side us and warn us at least. After the break
> made
> >> the turn the first time it was obvious which was the correct
> direction. On
> >> the second lap Rider 1 clearly goes into the on coming sweeping inside
> turn
> >> against the Do Not Enter sign. If you look at the results he just got a
> >> warning as well. If the grouped was warned before hand you could easily
> >> justify removing him from the race. If a Sheriff was insight of these
> >> action, he would probably had the permit suspended for 2016 and would be
> >> extremely upset.
> >>
> >> I don't want any changes to be made to the results. It was clear that
> he
> >> was the best rider and it is good to have him in the mix to toughen
> everyone
> >> up. I would like to see an announcement made on OBRA chat or at the
> >> beginning of the race this weekend in regards to this and maybe someone
> >> speak to Rider 1 as well. Please leave me out of it. I have hard
> enough time
> >> just trying to keep up with him.
> >>
> >> Thank you,
> >>
> >> Rider 4
> >
> >
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA_Officials mailing list
> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials
>

Steven Beardsley

I was also a little surprised to see a centerline warning being issued in
the results after the "tough talk" on the race flyer about a first and
final warning already being issued for centerline violators. I have
suggested to Kenji and the CR a the race that language like this either be
adhered to or removed from the flyer. Otherwise it seems to make our
officials be all bark, but no bite, especially when dealing with our VIP
racers.

my $.02

On Fri, Mar 27, 2015 at 2:33 PM, Candi Murray via OBRA_Officials <
obra_officials@list.obra.org> wrote:

> See the note below that we received after a recent race. I redacted the
> names so we could use this as a learning moment. Without knowing what the
> officials involved saw from the follow car I do think it is important that
> we enforce the rules with consistent penalties.
> Thoughts?
> Candi
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> Begin forwarded
> >> Hello Kenji,
> >>
> >> I don't have Xxx email address so I am not able to add him to this
> >> message.
> >>
> >> Looking at the results on OBRA.org you can see that Rider 1and rider 2
> >> both receive Warnings for center line violations on Sunday. I am not
> really
> >> pleased how these infractions were handled by our official's team. I
> would
> >> like to offer the following guidance of what I would like to see. I
> would
> >> also like to note how in the women's race Rider 3 was relegate to last
> unlike
> >> the warnings the men's received. I am not sure how her's actions were
> more
> >> sever.
> >>
> >> The center line violation happened on the first lap within the break of
> ten
> >> when we came to a T in the course for the first time. There was a
> sweeping
> >> left turn lane in opposing lane coming in from the left in addition to
> the
> >> T. There was a clear sign between the turn that says DO NOT ENTER. The
> >> turn was confusing at first and Rider 2 on the front decided to go into
> >> the on coming turn lane and cut the corner. The other break members
> how the
> >> turn went and followed the course and turned at the T next to the
> cones. I
> >> did pay real attention right afterwards, but the official did not point
> out
> >> the infraction to warn us all and Tim also continued to race. I
> expected
> >> the car to come along side us and warn us at least. After the break
> made
> >> the turn the first time it was obvious which was the correct
> direction. On
> >> the second lap Rider 1 clearly goes into the on coming sweeping inside
> turn
> >> against the Do Not Enter sign. If you look at the results he just got a
> >> warning as well. If the grouped was warned before hand you could easily
> >> justify removing him from the race. If a Sheriff was insight of these
> >> action, he would probably had the permit suspended for 2016 and would be
> >> extremely upset.
> >>
> >> I don't want any changes to be made to the results. It was clear that
> he
> >> was the best rider and it is good to have him in the mix to toughen
> everyone
> >> up. I would like to see an announcement made on OBRA chat or at the
> >> beginning of the race this weekend in regards to this and maybe someone
> >> speak to Rider 1 as well. Please leave me out of it. I have hard
> enough time
> >> just trying to keep up with him.
> >>
> >> Thank you,
> >>
> >> Rider 4
> >
> >
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA_Officials mailing list
> OBRA_Officials@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra_officials
>

Candi Murray

See the note below that we received after a recent race. I redacted the names so we could use this as a learning moment. Without knowing what the officials involved saw from the follow car I do think it is important that we enforce the rules with consistent penalties.
Thoughts?
Candi

Sent from my iPad

Begin forwarded
>> Hello Kenji,
>>
>> I don't have Xxx email address so I am not able to add him to this
>> message.
>>
>> Looking at the results on OBRA.org you can see that Rider 1and rider 2
>> both receive Warnings for center line violations on Sunday. I am not really
>> pleased how these infractions were handled by our official's team. I would
>> like to offer the following guidance of what I would like to see. I would
>> also like to note how in the women's race Rider 3 was relegate to last unlike
>> the warnings the men's received. I am not sure how her's actions were more
>> sever.
>>
>> The center line violation happened on the first lap within the break of ten
>> when we came to a T in the course for the first time. There was a sweeping
>> left turn lane in opposing lane coming in from the left in addition to the
>> T. There was a clear sign between the turn that says DO NOT ENTER. The
>> turn was confusing at first and Rider 2 on the front decided to go into
>> the on coming turn lane and cut the corner. The other break members how the
>> turn went and followed the course and turned at the T next to the cones. I
>> did pay real attention right afterwards, but the official did not point out
>> the infraction to warn us all and Tim also continued to race. I expected
>> the car to come along side us and warn us at least. After the break made
>> the turn the first time it was obvious which was the correct direction. On
>> the second lap Rider 1 clearly goes into the on coming sweeping inside turn
>> against the Do Not Enter sign. If you look at the results he just got a
>> warning as well. If the grouped was warned before hand you could easily
>> justify removing him from the race. If a Sheriff was insight of these
>> action, he would probably had the permit suspended for 2016 and would be
>> extremely upset.
>>
>> I don't want any changes to be made to the results. It was clear that he
>> was the best rider and it is good to have him in the mix to toughen everyone
>> up. I would like to see an announcement made on OBRA chat or at the
>> beginning of the race this weekend in regards to this and maybe someone
>> speak to Rider 1 as well. Please leave me out of it. I have hard enough time
>> just trying to keep up with him.
>>
>> Thank you,
>>
>> Rider 4
>
>
>
>