B Mills

I tend to agree with you Dave. In my younger days I have had very negative
reactions fro drivers when I flipped them off, one instance came to a full
on fight. In the last five years (or so) I have followed a friend's
advice...."Kill em with Kindness" now I just wave and smile...(and I get
their plate # and call the police) in the hope that they will think about
their actions and respond differently next time.

On 8/27/08, Dave Dezellem wrote:
>
> Typically I don't respond to these, but I felt compled to because this is
> an area where my wife and I do a lot of ridding (once or twice a week).
>
> I've been riding Helvetia Rd up into the hills, Moreland, Dorland, Logie
> Trail, ect since moving here 3 years ago and I can honestly say that I have
> never had any problems out there. Most of the motorest have been curtious,
> moving over, a few have made close passes, but that is rare (execept on west
> union).
>
> The chip seal has made riding a bit more difficult, I rode it a couple
> days after they laid it down and I had to ride out in the middle of the lane
> then. Rode there this past Sunday and had no problems staying to the right
> where the fog line would be other than it was diffiuct to tell the
> differance between the paved shoulder and the pile of soft gravel in a few
> places.
>
> I guess my main reason for responding is to echo a few of the other
> comments. When I was young and crazy I would chase people down and confront
> them, now as an older (38) hopefully wiser father of two, I just want us all
> to get along (cars and bikes). I don'twant to have to fear for my life when
> I go out on ride because of the actions of a fellow cyclist. Get the plate
> number call the cops, but don't piss folks off,giving the bird, conforting
> them won't solve anything it will just make them madder and the next cyclist
> they see might end up taking the fall for your actions....
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>

Joe Cipale

There is a group of us who live/work out in the West Union/North Plains area who ride many of the above mentioned roads on a daily basis. Sadly, WaCo has gone through and laid chipseal down on many of the roads, thus making things squirrelly for a while.

That being said, I have had one or two encounters along W. Union and Dairy Creek (that road still conjures up the theme from 'Deliverance' whenever I ride out there). Most people are polite and cogniscent of our presence and are more than willing to share the road. Often times if they are coming around a blind corner, 'our group' will wave them around if we have clear visibility. It is all about working together. Most people are not the stereotypical knuckle-dragging CroMagnon types we want to label. There are the exceptions but they would be rude bastards to anyone if you impeded their attempts to get home in time to watch NASCAR, Monday Night Football or Wrasslin.

That being said, I learned a technique sometime ago from my wife who learned some American Sign Language as part of a college class:
1 - Make an 'OK' sign with your thumb and forefinger.
2 - With the 'O' parallel to the ground and your three fingers pointing forward, rotate your wrist inward.

This is barely noticeable, yet makes you feel A LOT better! Oh, BTW, this is the ASL symbol for 'Asshole'. =)

Joe

Dave Dezellem

Typically I don't respond to these, but I felt compled to because this is an area where my wife and I do a lot of ridding (once or twice a week).

I've been riding Helvetia Rd up into the hills, Moreland, Dorland, Logie Trail, ect since moving here 3 years ago and I can honestly say that I have never had any problems out there. Most of the motorest have been curtious, moving over, a few have made close passes, but that is rare (execept on west union).

The chip seal has made riding a bit more difficult, I rode it a couple days after they laid it down and I had to ride out in the middle of the lane then. Rode there this past Sunday and had no problems staying to the right where the fog line would be other than it was diffiuct to tell the differance between the paved shoulder and the pile of soft gravel in a few places.

I guess my main reason for responding is to echo a few of the other comments. When I was young and crazy I would chase people down and confront them, now as an older (38) hopefully wiser father of two, I just want us all to get along (cars and bikes). I don'twant to have to fear for my life when I go out on ride because of the actions of a fellow cyclist. Get the plate number call the cops, but don't piss folks off,giving the bird, conforting them won't solve anything it will just make them madder and the next cyclist they see might end up taking the fall for your actions....

Matthew Wolpert

In keeping with the comments below, I would like to add that people who get
shot while being mugged should likewise ponder the laws of physics and not
be so stubborn as to stand in front of those bullets.

On an unrelated note, I second the post a while back, a highly
satisfying thing to do with aggressive drivers can be to smile and wave; if
you feel like voicing your feelings, you can add in a "have a nice day" or
"thank you"
.
-Matthew

On 5/19/06, Anon wrote:
>
>
>
>
> "Here Lies the body of Jonathan Jay, who died defending his right of
> way, He was right, dead right, as he sped along, but he's just as dead as
> if he'd been wrong,"
>
> I was out in the valley Tuesday and went for lunch at the Rock Creek
> Tavern. It was a gorgeous day and I saw quite a few people riding the
> roads. It looked like a lot of fun but it didn't look safe.
>
> Maybe those of us that embrace a biking lifestyle should also ponder the
> laws concerning Physics.
>
> Ride smart, ride safe.
>
> Anon
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>

Trask River Wood Works

"Here Lies the body of Jonathan Jay, who died defending his right of way,
He was right, dead right, as he sped along, but he's just as dead as if he'd
been wrong,"

I was out in the valley Tuesday and went for lunch at the Rock Creek Tavern.
It was a gorgeous day and I saw quite a few people riding the roads. It
looked like a lot of fun but it didn't look safe.

Maybe those of us that embrace a biking lifestyle should also ponder the
laws concerning Physics.

Ride smart, ride safe.

Ike Kendrick

Robert M. Huff

------ Forwarded Message
From: "Robert M. Huff"
Date: Thu, 18 May 2006 09:26:00 -0700
To:
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

I spent a very long weekend in the northern suburbs of Chicago and let me
tell you...soul crushing. I know there is some riding there but bikes are
not welcome on most streets. Big fast concrete slabs.

While there, I saw 5 riders, yes the weather was poor, all on sidewalk, all
got cut off at crossings. 4 of the 5 seem to be going to or from work. It
took me a couple of days to get over how self-centered and nasty the mood
was there.

Portlanders have it very good, not perfect but very good. Wave and if it get
worse know your rights and calmly be the ambassador you are at that moment.
Don¹t become the ³jackass² (in there eyes) biker. I¹ve tried that and it
goes nowhere but to further threats of violence. I¹ve tried to appeal to
there sense of community and neighborhood sharing. That got me more ³f²
bombs.

Peace out
Bob Huff

Wait! I¹ve put more thought to this don¹t wave don¹t say a word. Get there
digits and report them. Most people are fairly nice, those who are not
should be schooled.

on 5/17/06 8:13 PM, Mike Murray at mike.murray@obra.org wrote:

> John Beckman used to say you should just wave ... using all five fingers. It
> is amazing how satisfying it can be to give an overtly friendly wave while
> having other thoughts. Much more satisfying then other hand signals or verbal
> abuse.
>
> I think it is also important for us to recognize how luck we are here. Even
> though there are a fair amount of adverse car/bike interactions if anything
> the average driver in Oregon is overly polite and aware of the existence of
> bikes on the road. Try riding in other parts of the country where there are
> lots more drivers with a bug up about bicycles. Or in some countries were
> riding a bike on the open road is impossible. There are some better places,
> but not many.
> Mike Murray
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
>> Behalf Of MR. Kristinn Thorlaksson
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 19:48 PM
>> To: obra@list.obra.org
>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>>
>>
>> The best we can do, as long as you are not alongisde the road with a broken
>> back or shattered hip, is just do and say nothing to them.
>>
>>
>>
>> If you give these little criminals sign language then you are rewarding
>> their behavior. That is like giving a wild dog, that is chewing on your
>> leg, a bowl of water on the side.
>>
>>
>>
>> These people are animals and have no sense of humanity. Their problems are
>> at home and they found an outlet. We are it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>>
>>
>> Kristinn Thorlaksson
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

------ End of Forwarded Message

KG

Did you even read his post?

----- Original Message ----
From: Jon Hansen
To: obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 10:03:39 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

Dude, you're kidding right? If you're that afraid on the roads that you feel the need to intimidate drivers with a gun, please, do the world a favor and stay at home.

jon.

----- Original Message ----
From: Ray Thomas
To: Keith A. Prior ; obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 9:46:31 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

This road rage discussion is as much of an MMPI of bike riders as it is for
different types of drivers of vehicles. I am going to ask Kristin at my
office to post my MIMIC article for you to read if you want in a separate
posting. It involves some fun I have had in dressing in riding clothes in a
conservative anti bike area that look enough like the uniform of a
motorcycle cop to throw drivers into a conflicted place that causes enough
confusion for them to get them safely past me.

The other day I strapped my .38 Smith and Wesson with a laser sight onto my
left hip so that the butt was clearly visible when I went for my regular
ride in from Cornelius on Wa. County backroads. I have a concealed weapon
permit and carry a gun on a regular basis. My view of carrying a gun is that
it is a tool with dangerous potential but that if there are people with guns
out there I want to be one and if you had to choose who would have a gun you
would probably choose to have me be one of them too because I have taken the
time to learn about it and my history demonstrates that I can live safely
with it without abusing the privilege. It was interesting to see the
reactions of drivers. I guess I was sort of the bike freak equivalent of the
pickup guy with a rifle in the gun rack in the rear window. It was
interesting that most people did not even notice it. However, it was the
folks who were the hellyeah good old boys who did notice it. I have to say I
got more room on the road than I am accustomed to receiving. It was a pretty
subtle display of force but it is interesting to ponder how things might be
different if the angry drivers began to see that the bike freaks are even
carrying guns now. There is a certain reticence that all but the most meth
blasted criminals carry with them when they approach a rural residence at
night. This is because most of those rural houses have guns that are
regarded as a natural part of home furnishings, and owners who know how to
use them. One single incident where a stupid biker hurts s omeone or
themsleves would be used by anti-gun folks as a perfect example about how it
is that this sort of talk by people llike me in a supposed position of
leadership in the bike community is reckless and dangerous. Maybe so. I made
my choice a long time ago and am willing to live with the consequences, even
in a public forum like this one. I can also tell you from personal
experience that when I ride I carry a cellphone/camera. When I am
endorphined up and someone is an asshole to me on the road and it scares me
and then makes me mad I can honestly say that I am more temperate in my
response knowing that if necessary I have the means on my person to defend
myself.

Ray
-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Keith A. Prior
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 9:13 AM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

I too have noticed that most of my unpleasant motorist
experiences have been with people driving trucks or other
large V8 or V10 or V20 powered vehicles.

Some of the most scary ones have been when I was in more rural areas
so as to avoid any future brushes with the people out in the country
I pinned a Bush/Cheney sign on my back. This may or may not have been
my choice of political candidates but I think it helped ease relations
with some who might otherwise consider me just another pansy ass spandex
wearing faggot !

I am working on a Smith and Wesson or Colt jersey idea!
Anyone want to buy one?! :)

-K

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Geri Bossen

Mike is right. You also need to remember that if you are rude, the driver will probably not take it out on you but on the next bike they see. I have had some young riders get the brunt of some other bike riders rude behavior. The smile and full wave is the most effective tool we have to handle them. If a rider smiles and waves its no fun for the rude driver.

Their game is to get a reaction from the bike rider. No reaction no game. For many of them it is just a game like smash the mail boxes or shoot the stop sign. (I lived rural and used to hear the "boys" talk.)

Geri
----- Original Message -----
From: Mike Murray
To: obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 8:13 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

John Beckman used to say you should just wave ... using all five fingers. It is amazing how satisfying it can be to give an overtly friendly wave while having other thoughts. Much more satisfying then other hand signals or verbal abuse.

I think it is also important for us to recognize how luck we are here. Even though there are a fair amount of adverse car/bike interactions if anything the average driver in Oregon is overly polite and aware of the existence of bikes on the road. Try riding in other parts of the country where there are lots more drivers with a bug up about bicycles. Or in some countries were riding a bike on the open road is impossible. There are some better places, but not many.
Mike Murray

Mark Jenkins

How is a pistol 'a pretty subtle display' of anything? Seems like you've
already escalated the stakes in any discussion you might have, however
'temperate' you think you are. If you feel the need to be carrying a gun
while you ride a bike, you must be pretty worried about these
confrontations, really worried. And if you're that worried -- or if you need
the pistol to be less afraid, I don't know if that's the right mindset to be
carrying a gun in the first place. Actually, I do know -- it's not.

On 5/18/06, Ray Thomas wrote:
>
> This road rage discussion is as much of an MMPI of bike riders as it is
> for
> different types of drivers of vehicles. I am going to ask Kristin at my
> office to post my MIMIC article for you to read if you want in a separate
> posting. It involves some fun I have had in dressing in riding clothes in
> a
> conservative anti bike area that look enough like the uniform of a
> motorcycle cop to throw drivers into a conflicted place that causes enough
> confusion for them to get them safely past me.
>
> The other day I strapped my .38 Smith and Wesson with a laser sight onto
> my
> left hip so that the butt was clearly visible when I went for my regular
> ride in from Cornelius on Wa. County backroads. I have a concealed weapon
> permit and carry a gun on a regular basis. My view of carrying a gun is
> that
> it is a tool with dangerous potential but that if there are people with
> guns
> out there I want to be one and if you had to choose who would have a gun
> you
> would probably choose to have me be one of them too because I have taken
> the
> time to learn about it and my history demonstrates that I can live safely
> with it without abusing the privilege. It was interesting to see the
> reactions of drivers. I guess I was sort of the bike freak equivalent of
> the
> pickup guy with a rifle in the gun rack in the rear window. It was
> interesting that most people did not even notice it. However, it was the
> folks who were the hellyeah good old boys who did notice it. I have to say
> I
> got more room on the road than I am accustomed to receiving. It was a
> pretty
> subtle display of force but it is interesting to ponder how things might
> be
> different if the angry drivers began to see that the bike freaks are even
> carrying guns now. There is a certain reticence that all but the most meth
> blasted criminals carry with them when they approach a rural residence at
> night. This is because most of those rural houses have guns that are
> regarded as a natural part of home furnishings, and owners who know how to
> use them. One single incident where a stupid biker hurts s omeone or
> themsleves would be used by anti-gun folks as a perfect example about how
> it
> is that this sort of talk by people llike me in a supposed position of
> leadership in the bike community is reckless and dangerous. Maybe so. I
> made
> my choice a long time ago and am willing to live with the consequences,
> even
> in a public forum like this one. I can also tell you from personal
> experience that when I ride I carry a cellphone/camera. When I am
> endorphined up and someone is an asshole to me on the road and it scares
> me
> and then makes me mad I can honestly say that I am more temperate in my
> response knowing that if necessary I have the means on my person to defend
> myself.
>
> Ray
> -----Original Message-----
> From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
> Behalf Of Keith A. Prior
> Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 9:13 AM
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
> I too have noticed that most of my unpleasant motorist
> experiences have been with people driving trucks or other
> large V8 or V10 or V20 powered vehicles.
>
> Some of the most scary ones have been when I was in more rural areas
> so as to avoid any future brushes with the people out in the country
> I pinned a Bush/Cheney sign on my back. This may or may not have been
> my choice of political candidates but I think it helped ease relations
> with some who might otherwise consider me just another pansy ass spandex
> wearing faggot !
>
> I am working on a Smith and Wesson or Colt jersey idea!
> Anyone want to buy one?! :)
>
>
> -K
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>

Jon Hansen

Dude, you're kidding right? If you're that afraid on the roads that you feel the need to intimidate drivers with a gun, please, do the world a favor and stay at home.

jon.

----- Original Message ----
From: Ray Thomas
To: Keith A. Prior ; obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 9:46:31 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

This road rage discussion is as much of an MMPI of bike riders as it is for
different types of drivers of vehicles. I am going to ask Kristin at my
office to post my MIMIC article for you to read if you want in a separate
posting. It involves some fun I have had in dressing in riding clothes in a
conservative anti bike area that look enough like the uniform of a
motorcycle cop to throw drivers into a conflicted place that causes enough
confusion for them to get them safely past me.

The other day I strapped my .38 Smith and Wesson with a laser sight onto my
left hip so that the butt was clearly visible when I went for my regular
ride in from Cornelius on Wa. County backroads. I have a concealed weapon
permit and carry a gun on a regular basis. My view of carrying a gun is that
it is a tool with dangerous potential but that if there are people with guns
out there I want to be one and if you had to choose who would have a gun you
would probably choose to have me be one of them too because I have taken the
time to learn about it and my history demonstrates that I can live safely
with it without abusing the privilege. It was interesting to see the
reactions of drivers. I guess I was sort of the bike freak equivalent of the
pickup guy with a rifle in the gun rack in the rear window. It was
interesting that most people did not even notice it. However, it was the
folks who were the hellyeah good old boys who did notice it. I have to say I
got more room on the road than I am accustomed to receiving. It was a pretty
subtle display of force but it is interesting to ponder how things might be
different if the angry drivers began to see that the bike freaks are even
carrying guns now. There is a certain reticence that all but the most meth
blasted criminals carry with them when they approach a rural residence at
night. This is because most of those rural houses have guns that are
regarded as a natural part of home furnishings, and owners who know how to
use them. One single incident where a stupid biker hurts s omeone or
themsleves would be used by anti-gun folks as a perfect example about how it
is that this sort of talk by people llike me in a supposed position of
leadership in the bike community is reckless and dangerous. Maybe so. I made
my choice a long time ago and am willing to live with the consequences, even
in a public forum like this one. I can also tell you from personal
experience that when I ride I carry a cellphone/camera. When I am
endorphined up and someone is an asshole to me on the road and it scares me
and then makes me mad I can honestly say that I am more temperate in my
response knowing that if necessary I have the means on my person to defend
myself.

Ray
-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Keith A. Prior
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 9:13 AM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

I too have noticed that most of my unpleasant motorist
experiences have been with people driving trucks or other
large V8 or V10 or V20 powered vehicles.

Some of the most scary ones have been when I was in more rural areas
so as to avoid any future brushes with the people out in the country
I pinned a Bush/Cheney sign on my back. This may or may not have been
my choice of political candidates but I think it helped ease relations
with some who might otherwise consider me just another pansy ass spandex
wearing faggot !

I am working on a Smith and Wesson or Colt jersey idea!
Anyone want to buy one?! :)

-K

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Ray Thomas

This road rage discussion is as much of an MMPI of bike riders as it is for
different types of drivers of vehicles. I am going to ask Kristin at my
office to post my MIMIC article for you to read if you want in a separate
posting. It involves some fun I have had in dressing in riding clothes in a
conservative anti bike area that look enough like the uniform of a
motorcycle cop to throw drivers into a conflicted place that causes enough
confusion for them to get them safely past me.

The other day I strapped my .38 Smith and Wesson with a laser sight onto my
left hip so that the butt was clearly visible when I went for my regular
ride in from Cornelius on Wa. County backroads. I have a concealed weapon
permit and carry a gun on a regular basis. My view of carrying a gun is that
it is a tool with dangerous potential but that if there are people with guns
out there I want to be one and if you had to choose who would have a gun you
would probably choose to have me be one of them too because I have taken the
time to learn about it and my history demonstrates that I can live safely
with it without abusing the privilege. It was interesting to see the
reactions of drivers. I guess I was sort of the bike freak equivalent of the
pickup guy with a rifle in the gun rack in the rear window. It was
interesting that most people did not even notice it. However, it was the
folks who were the hellyeah good old boys who did notice it. I have to say I
got more room on the road than I am accustomed to receiving. It was a pretty
subtle display of force but it is interesting to ponder how things might be
different if the angry drivers began to see that the bike freaks are even
carrying guns now. There is a certain reticence that all but the most meth
blasted criminals carry with them when they approach a rural residence at
night. This is because most of those rural houses have guns that are
regarded as a natural part of home furnishings, and owners who know how to
use them. One single incident where a stupid biker hurts s omeone or
themsleves would be used by anti-gun folks as a perfect example about how it
is that this sort of talk by people llike me in a supposed position of
leadership in the bike community is reckless and dangerous. Maybe so. I made
my choice a long time ago and am willing to live with the consequences, even
in a public forum like this one. I can also tell you from personal
experience that when I ride I carry a cellphone/camera. When I am
endorphined up and someone is an asshole to me on the road and it scares me
and then makes me mad I can honestly say that I am more temperate in my
response knowing that if necessary I have the means on my person to defend
myself.

Ray
-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Keith A. Prior
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 9:13 AM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

I too have noticed that most of my unpleasant motorist
experiences have been with people driving trucks or other
large V8 or V10 or V20 powered vehicles.

Some of the most scary ones have been when I was in more rural areas
so as to avoid any future brushes with the people out in the country
I pinned a Bush/Cheney sign on my back. This may or may not have been
my choice of political candidates but I think it helped ease relations
with some who might otherwise consider me just another pansy ass spandex
wearing faggot !

I am working on a Smith and Wesson or Colt jersey idea!
Anyone want to buy one?! :)

-K

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Hormann, Douglas J.

I have two cars, a Volkswagen Jetta diesel and a Toyota Landcruiser SUV.
What does that make me, schizophrenic? I used to have a Subaru WRX, but
that car was definitely going to get me in trouble.

Dep. Doug Hormann, WCSO
Office of Consolidated Emergency Management
20665 SW Blanton Street, Aloha, OR 97007
503.642.0374 - Work
503.807.7485 - Mobile/Pager
112*30326*128 - Nextel DC
doug@ocem.org
http://www.ocem.org

-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Monty Hill
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 8:31 AM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

I would venture to say the vehicle affects some people. My mother, say
what you will, drives a extremely large 4-door pickup to pull her huge
horse trailer. She becomes a different person when behind the wheel of
this V10 bohemeth. I remember riding with her and some hot-shot with a
coffee can stuck to the back of his Acura pulled up next to us, tunes
up, revving the engine. My mom said, "watch this" and she proceeded to
blow away from the guy when the light changed. I was shocked, but as
that was about 10 years ago, part me thought yeah right on. I
definitely believe the vehicle does affect some peoples driving, it is a
power trip for some people who feel they have to show everyone who's
boss.

>>> "Dave German" 5/17/2006 6:24 pm >>>
Right on Robert. Mike is trying to be all PC but come on dude,
everyone
knows certain types of people drive certain types of cars. When was
the
last time you saw a mullet wearing, raccoon hunting, trailer dweling,
readneck driving a VW, Cooper or Miata? Never, cuz they don't. They
drive
manly vehicles like trucks and muscle cars and the ones with more
credit
drive SUVs. And they think they are more important than you and that
their
time is more important. Although if it was a farm tractor that held
them up
for five minutes and not just a few seconds, well then thats OK cuz
Bruce
Springtien says farming is cool.

Kumba Ya!

>From: Robert Nobles
>To: "Adams, Mike" , obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 16:37:15 -0700 (PDT)
>
>But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini
Cooper,
>and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.
>
> Some market research has been done on the subject:
> http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html
>
>"Adams, Mike" wrote:
> Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the

>person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep

>working together to change public perception. On the other side of the

>issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no

>shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they
slowed
>to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought
for
>an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As
the
>racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the
>responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's
in
>both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave
and
>smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and
they
>may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over
30
>years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way
to
>deal with the auto society we live. Just some
> thoughts
>.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
>To: obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
>The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
>myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
>terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
>people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or
excuse
>me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going
to
>convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth
it.
>I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
>critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right
of
>Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile
as
>fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!
>
>I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
>after you make it home to give your family a hug.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Monty
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
>Robert W Nobles
>rwnobles@yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>http://mail.yahoo.com

>_______________________________________________
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KG

BRILLIANT! However I could see the Bush/Cheney thing backfire if you have to roll through metro on your way home. How 'bout Velcro patches we could rotate with the territory? Reversible jersey?

----- Original Message ----
From: Keith A. Prior
To: obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 9:12:36 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

I too have noticed that most of my unpleasant motorist
experiences have been with people driving trucks or other
large V8 or V10 or V20 powered vehicles.

Some of the most scary ones have been when I was in more rural areas
so as to avoid any future brushes with the people out in the country
I pinned a Bush/Cheney sign on my back. This may or may not have been
my choice of political candidates but I think it helped ease relations
with some who might otherwise consider me just another pansy ass spandex
wearing faggot !

I am working on a Smith and Wesson or Colt jersey idea!
Anyone want to buy one?! :)

-K

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Keith A. Prior

I too have noticed that most of my unpleasant motorist
experiences have been with people driving trucks or other
large V8 or V10 or V20 powered vehicles.

Some of the most scary ones have been when I was in more rural areas
so as to avoid any future brushes with the people out in the country
I pinned a Bush/Cheney sign on my back. This may or may not have been
my choice of political candidates but I think it helped ease relations
with some who might otherwise consider me just another pansy ass spandex
wearing faggot !

I am working on a Smith and Wesson or Colt jersey idea!
Anyone want to buy one?! :)

-K

Dave German

I guess I got worked up because 90% of my close calls/run-ins have been with
trucks/SUVs. A close second would be the Mercedes. Get lots of Mercedes
honks when riding around Lake O.

>From: "Joe Cipale"
>Reply-To: joec@aracnet.com
>To: "Dave German"
>CC: rwnobles@yahoo.com, MAdams@Huttig.com, obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:36:18 -0700
>
>Dave,
>
>You are just a few lines short of a Farm Aid concert... ;)
>
>Joe
>
>Dave German wrote:
>
> > Right on Robert. Mike is trying to be all PC but come on dude, everyone
> > knows certain types of people drive certain types of cars. When was the
> > last time you saw a mullet wearing, raccoon hunting, trailer dweling,
> > readneck driving a VW, Cooper or Miata? Never, cuz they don't. They
>drive
> > manly vehicles like trucks and muscle cars and the ones with more credit
> > drive SUVs. And they think they are more important than you and that
>their
> > time is more important. Although if it was a farm tractor that held
>them up
> > for five minutes and not just a few seconds, well then thats OK cuz
>Bruce
> > Springtien says farming is cool.
> >
> > Kumba Ya!
> >
> > >From: Robert Nobles
> > >To: "Adams, Mike" , obra@list.obra.org
> > >Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
> > >Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 16:37:15 -0700 (PDT)
> > >
> > >But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini
>Cooper,
> > >and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.
> > >
> > > Some market research has been done on the subject:
> > > http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html
> > >
> > >"Adams, Mike" wrote:
> > > Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the
> > >person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep
> > >working together to change public perception. On the other side of the
> > >issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no
> > >shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they
>slowed
> > >to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought
>for
> > >an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As
>the
> > >racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the
> > >responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's
>in
> > >both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave
>and
> > >smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and
>they
> > >may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over 30
> > >years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way
>to
> > >deal with the auto society we live. Just some
> > > thoughts
> > >.
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
> > >Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
> > >To: obra@list.obra.org
> > >Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage
> > >
> > >
> > >The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
> > >myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
> > >terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
> > >people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or
>excuse
> > >me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
> > >convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
> > >I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
> > >critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right
>of
> > >Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile
>as
> > >fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!
> > >
> > >I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
> > >after you make it home to give your family a hug.
> > >
> > >Best regards,
> > >
> > >Monty
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >OBRA mailing list
> > >obra@list.obra.org
> > >http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> > >Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >OBRA mailing list
> > >obra@list.obra.org
> > >http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> > >Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Robert W Nobles
> > >rwnobles@yahoo.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
> > >__________________________________________________
> > >Do You Yahoo!?
> > >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > >http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> >
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >OBRA mailing list
> > >obra@list.obra.org
> > >http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> > >Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OBRA mailing list
> > obra@list.obra.org
> > http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> > Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>

Brian Engelen

I drive an SUV. Stay out of my Suburb! You've been warned!

-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Monty Hill
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 7:31 AM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

I would venture to say the vehicle affects some people. My mother, say
what you will, drives a extremely large 4-door pickup to pull her huge
horse trailer. She becomes a different person when behind the wheel of
this V10 bohemeth. I remember riding with her and some hot-shot with a
coffee can stuck to the back of his Acura pulled up next to us, tunes
up, revving the engine. My mom said, "watch this" and she proceeded to
blow away from the guy when the light changed. I was shocked, but as
that was about 10 years ago, part me thought yeah right on. I
definitely believe the vehicle does affect some peoples driving, it is a
power trip for some people who feel they have to show everyone who's
boss.

>>> "Dave German" 5/17/2006 6:24 pm >>>
Right on Robert. Mike is trying to be all PC but come on dude,
everyone
knows certain types of people drive certain types of cars. When was
the
last time you saw a mullet wearing, raccoon hunting, trailer dweling,
readneck driving a VW, Cooper or Miata? Never, cuz they don't. They
drive
manly vehicles like trucks and muscle cars and the ones with more
credit
drive SUVs. And they think they are more important than you and that
their
time is more important. Although if it was a farm tractor that held
them up
for five minutes and not just a few seconds, well then thats OK cuz
Bruce
Springtien says farming is cool.

Kumba Ya!

>From: Robert Nobles
>To: "Adams, Mike" , obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 16:37:15 -0700 (PDT)
>
>But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini
Cooper,
>and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.
>
> Some market research has been done on the subject:
> http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html
>
>"Adams, Mike" wrote:
> Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the

>person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep

>working together to change public perception. On the other side of the

>issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no

>shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they
slowed
>to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought
for
>an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As
the
>racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the
>responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's
in
>both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave
and
>smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and
they
>may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over
30
>years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way
to
>deal with the auto society we live. Just some
> thoughts
>.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
>To: obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
>The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
>myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
>terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
>people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or
excuse
>me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going
to
>convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth
it.
>I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
>critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right
of
>Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile
as
>fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!
>
>I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
>after you make it home to give your family a hug.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Monty
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
>Robert W Nobles
>rwnobles@yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>http://mail.yahoo.com

>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

_______________________________________________
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Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
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Monty Hill

I would venture to say the vehicle affects some people. My mother, say
what you will, drives a extremely large 4-door pickup to pull her huge
horse trailer. She becomes a different person when behind the wheel of
this V10 bohemeth. I remember riding with her and some hot-shot with a
coffee can stuck to the back of his Acura pulled up next to us, tunes
up, revving the engine. My mom said, "watch this" and she proceeded to
blow away from the guy when the light changed. I was shocked, but as
that was about 10 years ago, part me thought yeah right on. I
definitely believe the vehicle does affect some peoples driving, it is a
power trip for some people who feel they have to show everyone who's
boss.

>>> "Dave German" 5/17/2006 6:24 pm >>>
Right on Robert. Mike is trying to be all PC but come on dude,
everyone
knows certain types of people drive certain types of cars. When was
the
last time you saw a mullet wearing, raccoon hunting, trailer dweling,
readneck driving a VW, Cooper or Miata? Never, cuz they don't. They
drive
manly vehicles like trucks and muscle cars and the ones with more
credit
drive SUVs. And they think they are more important than you and that
their
time is more important. Although if it was a farm tractor that held
them up
for five minutes and not just a few seconds, well then thats OK cuz
Bruce
Springtien says farming is cool.

Kumba Ya!

>From: Robert Nobles
>To: "Adams, Mike" , obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 16:37:15 -0700 (PDT)
>
>But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini
Cooper,
>and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.
>
> Some market research has been done on the subject:
> http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html
>
>"Adams, Mike" wrote:
> Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the

>person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep

>working together to change public perception. On the other side of the

>issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no

>shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they
slowed
>to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought
for
>an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As
the
>racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the
>responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's
in
>both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave
and
>smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and
they
>may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over
30
>years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way
to
>deal with the auto society we live. Just some
> thoughts
>.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
>To: obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
>The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
>myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
>terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
>people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or
excuse
>me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going
to
>convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth
it.
>I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
>critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right
of
>Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile
as
>fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!
>
>I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
>after you make it home to give your family a hug.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Monty
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
>Robert W Nobles
>rwnobles@yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>http://mail.yahoo.com

>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

_______________________________________________
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Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

MR. Kristinn Thorlaksson

Thanks for some of the replies.

The other thing I like to do sometimes is wave and point for them to go before they turn in. Then they feel controlled. Then I feel good. :-) hehehe

Kristinn Thorlaksson

Joel Morrissette

On 5/17/06, Mike Murray wrote:
>
> I think it is also important for us to recognize how luck we are here.
> Even though there are a fair amount of adverse car/bike interactions if
> anything the average driver in Oregon is overly polite and aware of the
> existence of bikes on the road. Try riding in other parts of the country
> where there are lots more drivers with a bug up about bicycles. Or in some
> countries were riding a bike on the open road is impossible. There are some
> better places, but not many.
>

As a former Mainer, I can assure you that this is definitely the case. I
wouldn't consider hitting the roads in most parts of the state. No room,
lots of rednecks with a real vendetta against spandex-clad roadies, and
NOBODY ties their dog up. Pepper spray is not optional. I have no idea how
Joan Benoit Samuelson trained in that state. I figure she just outran
them. = )

-Joel

Patrick wilder

I'll second Mike's approach. Just yesterday I had an old guy in a sedan curse me out as he was trying to pull out of the post office. I was just riding down the street. When we made our stop at the stop sign, he was turning right, I held back my urges to yell back. I calmly (ok so I was a tad sarcastic) asked him, "I'm sorry you said something back there, was there something you needed?"

Now speechless, he just shook his head and made his turn.

Mike Murray wrote:
John Beckman used to say you should just wave ... using all five fingers. It is amazing how satisfying it can be to give an overtly friendly wave while having other thoughts. Much more satisfying then other hand signals or verbal abuse.

I think it is also important for us to recognize how luck we are here. Even though there are a fair amount of adverse car/bike interactions if anything the average driver in Oregon is overly polite and aware of the existence of bikes on the road. Try riding in other parts of the country where there are lots more drivers with a bug up about bicycles. Or in some countries were riding a bike on the open road is impossible. There are some better places, but not many.
Mike Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of MR. Kristinn Thorlaksson
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 19:48 PM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

The best we can do, as long as you are not alongisde the road with a broken back or shattered hip, is just do and say nothing to them.

If you give these little criminals sign language then you are rewarding their behavior. That is like giving a wild dog, that is chewing on your leg, a bowl of water on the side.

These people are animals and have no sense of humanity. Their problems are at home and they found an outlet. We are it.

Thanks,

Kristinn Thorlaksson
_______________________________________________
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obra@list.obra.org
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Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

~Patrick
/\
/ \/\ __o
/\/ \ --- \<,
_/ \_______(_)/(_)
www.patrickinportland.blogspot.com

---------------------------------
How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger?s low PC-to-Phone call rates.

Mike Murray

John Beckman used to say you should just wave ... using all five fingers.
It is amazing how satisfying it can be to give an overtly friendly wave
while having other thoughts. Much more satisfying then other hand signals
or verbal abuse.

I think it is also important for us to recognize how luck we are here. Even
though there are a fair amount of adverse car/bike interactions if anything
the average driver in Oregon is overly polite and aware of the existence of
bikes on the road. Try riding in other parts of the country where there are
lots more drivers with a bug up about bicycles. Or in some countries were
riding a bike on the open road is impossible. There are some better places,
but not many.

Mike Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of MR. Kristinn Thorlaksson
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 19:48 PM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

The best we can do, as long as you are not alongisde the road with a broken
back or shattered hip, is just do and say nothing to them.

If you give these little criminals sign language then you are rewarding
their behavior. That is like giving a wild dog, that is chewing on your
leg, a bowl of water on the side.

These people are animals and have no sense of humanity. Their problems are
at home and they found an outlet. We are it.

Thanks,

Kristinn Thorlaksson

MR. Kristinn Thorlaksson

The best we can do, as long as you are not alongisde the road with a broken back or shattered hip, is just do and say nothing to them.

If you give these little criminals sign language then you are rewarding their behavior. That is like giving a wild dog, that is chewing on your leg, a bowl of water on the side.

These people are animals and have no sense of humanity. Their problems are at home and they found an outlet. We are it.

Thanks,

Kristinn Thorlaksson

Michael O'Hair

Rude and agressive drivers are everywhere. I came close to being taken down
by a middle-aged woman driving a Mercedes-Benz when she passed me and then
immediately turned right onto Dairy Creek Road. I was loud but not obscene
as I grabbed the brakes and turned sharply into the turn. Just to make sure
I got the message, she flipped me off as she drove away, giving a good
example to the six year old girl in the back seat.

Try this: The next time you see someone in a car do something sensible
and/or polite, smile and wave at them and say thank you. Trying to punish
bad behavior is an endless job. Rewarding good behavior takes a lot lesss
energy overall.

As far as muscle cars go, you will seldom see a true muscle car driver put
his car at risk. ( I apologize for the blatant sexual type-casting, but you
just don't see Hemi 'cudas being driven by women these days. )

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave German"
They drive manly vehicles like trucks and muscle cars and the ones with
more credit
> drive SUVs. And they think they are more important than you and that
their
> time is more important.

Joe Cipale

Dave,

You are just a few lines short of a Farm Aid concert... ;)

Joe

Dave German wrote:

> Right on Robert. Mike is trying to be all PC but come on dude, everyone
> knows certain types of people drive certain types of cars. When was the
> last time you saw a mullet wearing, raccoon hunting, trailer dweling,
> readneck driving a VW, Cooper or Miata? Never, cuz they don't. They drive
> manly vehicles like trucks and muscle cars and the ones with more credit
> drive SUVs. And they think they are more important than you and that their
> time is more important. Although if it was a farm tractor that held them up
> for five minutes and not just a few seconds, well then thats OK cuz Bruce
> Springtien says farming is cool.
>
> Kumba Ya!
>
> >From: Robert Nobles
> >To: "Adams, Mike" , obra@list.obra.org
> >Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
> >Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 16:37:15 -0700 (PDT)
> >
> >But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini Cooper,
> >and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.
> >
> > Some market research has been done on the subject:
> > http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html
> >
> >"Adams, Mike" wrote:
> > Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the
> >person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep
> >working together to change public perception. On the other side of the
> >issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no
> >shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they slowed
> >to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought for
> >an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As the
> >racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the
> >responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's in
> >both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave and
> >smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and they
> >may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over 30
> >years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way to
> >deal with the auto society we live. Just some
> > thoughts
> >.
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
> >Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
> >To: obra@list.obra.org
> >Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage
> >
> >
> >The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
> >myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
> >terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
> >people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or excuse
> >me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
> >convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
> >I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
> >critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right of
> >Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile as
> >fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!
> >
> >I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
> >after you make it home to give your family a hug.
> >
> >Best regards,
> >
> >Monty
> >_______________________________________________
> >OBRA mailing list
> >obra@list.obra.org
> >http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> >Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >OBRA mailing list
> >obra@list.obra.org
> >http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> >Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> >
> >
> >
> >Robert W Nobles
> >rwnobles@yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
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>
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>
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Dave German

Right on Robert. Mike is trying to be all PC but come on dude, everyone
knows certain types of people drive certain types of cars. When was the
last time you saw a mullet wearing, raccoon hunting, trailer dweling,
readneck driving a VW, Cooper or Miata? Never, cuz they don't. They drive
manly vehicles like trucks and muscle cars and the ones with more credit
drive SUVs. And they think they are more important than you and that their
time is more important. Although if it was a farm tractor that held them up
for five minutes and not just a few seconds, well then thats OK cuz Bruce
Springtien says farming is cool.

Kumba Ya!

>From: Robert Nobles
>To: "Adams, Mike" , obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 16:37:15 -0700 (PDT)
>
>But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini Cooper,
>and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.
>
> Some market research has been done on the subject:
> http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html
>
>"Adams, Mike" wrote:
> Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the
>person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep
>working together to change public perception. On the other side of the
>issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no
>shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they slowed
>to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought for
>an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As the
>racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the
>responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's in
>both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave and
>smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and they
>may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over 30
>years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way to
>deal with the auto society we live. Just some
> thoughts
>.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
>To: obra@list.obra.org
>Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
>The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
>myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
>terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
>people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or excuse
>me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
>convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
>I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
>critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right of
>Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile as
>fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!
>
>I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
>after you make it home to give your family a hug.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Monty
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
>Robert W Nobles
>rwnobles@yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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>_______________________________________________
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>obra@list.obra.org
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Jeff Tedder

Mike if you would have kicked him the #$%&*+&*$@, he would have forgot about
the yelling and maybe
thought us spandex clad goofs weren't so wimpy, it's a good thought but not
a good idea I guess, but sometimes you almost can't help yourself, like my
little go around in the cemetary a few weeks ago..........
Everybody ride safe and stay away from those big old farmers.........

----- Original Message -----
From: "Adams, Mike"
To: ; "Robert Nobles"
Cc:
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 5:13 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

> I've seen allot of big people get out of small cars and big trucks. It is
> the person not the vehicle, although there is the intimidation factor but
> that person is compensating for other issues. I was doing a PWTC ride with
> about 40 other riders and the most aggressive driver I have ever
> encountered sped around us at 60 in a 35 in a Geo. Big old farmer jumps
> out at the next stop and wants to take on all of us spandex clad
> #$@#$%^&*(. We merely rolled on without incident as he continued to yell.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe Cipale [mailto:joec@aracnet.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 5:01 PM
> To: Robert Nobles
> Cc: Adams, Mike; obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
> I think it has to do with the big vehicle is a way to... uhhhh..
> compensate for thier other shortcomings... ;)
>
> Joe
>
> Robert Nobles wrote:
>
>> But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini
>> Cooper, and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.
>>
>> Some market research has been done on the subject:
>> http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html
>>
>> "Adams, Mike" wrote:
>> Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the
>> person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep
>> working together to change public perception. On the other side of the
>> issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no
>> shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they
>> slowed to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all
>> thought for an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to
>> be. As the racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take
>> the responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are
>> bozo's in both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you
>> just wave and smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the
>> situation and they may think we are not that bad after all. I have been
>> riding for over 30 years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver
>> is the best way to deal with the auto society we live. Just some
>> thoughts
>> .
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
>> To: obra@list.obra.org
>> Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>>
>>
>> The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
>> myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
>> terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
>> people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or excuse
>> me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
>> convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
>> I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
>> critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right of
>> Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile as
>> fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!
>>
>> I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
>> after you make it home to give your family a hug.
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Monty
>> _______________________________________________
>> OBRA mailing list
>> obra@list.obra.org
>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OBRA mailing list
>> obra@list.obra.org
>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>
>>
>>
>> Robert W Nobles
>> rwnobles@yahoo.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
>> __________________________________________________
>> Do You Yahoo!?
>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Adams, Mike

I've seen allot of big people get out of small cars and big trucks. It is the person not the vehicle, although there is the intimidation factor but that person is compensating for other issues. I was doing a PWTC ride with about 40 other riders and the most aggressive driver I have ever encountered sped around us at 60 in a 35 in a Geo. Big old farmer jumps out at the next stop and wants to take on all of us spandex clad #$@#$%^&*(. We merely rolled on without incident as he continued to yell.

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Cipale [mailto:joec@aracnet.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 5:01 PM
To: Robert Nobles
Cc: Adams, Mike; obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

I think it has to do with the big vehicle is a way to... uhhhh.. compensate for thier other shortcomings... ;)

Joe

Robert Nobles wrote:

> But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini Cooper, and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.
>
> Some market research has been done on the subject:
> http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html
>
> "Adams, Mike" wrote:
> Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep working together to change public perception. On the other side of the issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they slowed to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought for an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As the racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's in both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave and smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and they may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over 30 years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way to deal with the auto society we live. Just some
> thoughts
> .
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
> The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
> myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
> terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
> people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or excuse
> me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
> convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
> I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
> critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right of
> Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile as
> fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!
>
> I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
> after you make it home to give your family a hug.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Monty
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
> Robert W Nobles
> rwnobles@yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com

Joe Cipale

I think it has to do with the big vehicle is a way to... uhhhh.. compensate for thier other shortcomings... ;)

Joe

Robert Nobles wrote:

> But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini Cooper, and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.
>
> Some market research has been done on the subject:
> http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html
>
> "Adams, Mike" wrote:
> Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep working together to change public perception. On the other side of the issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they slowed to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought for an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As the racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's in both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave and smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and they may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over 30 years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way to deal with the auto society we live. Just some
> thoughts
> .
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
> The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
> myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
> terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
> people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or excuse
> me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
> convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
> I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
> critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right of
> Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile as
> fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!
>
> I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
> after you make it home to give your family a hug.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Monty
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
> Robert W Nobles
> rwnobles@yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com

Robert Nobles

But why is it always the SUV or the big truck? The Geo Metro, Mini Cooper, and Mazda Miatas never seem to be trying to run me off the road.

Some market research has been done on the subject:
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0212.mencimer.html

"Adams, Mike" wrote:
Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep working together to change public perception. On the other side of the issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they slowed to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought for an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As the racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's in both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave and smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and they may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over 30 years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way to deal with the auto society we live. Just some
thoughts
.

-----Original Message-----
From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage

The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or excuse
me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right of
Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile as
fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!

I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
after you make it home to give your family a hug.

Best regards,

Monty
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Robert W Nobles
rwnobles@yahoo.com

vvv IGNORE THIS AD vvvv
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

KG

"Do not be a bicycle bozo." (That's the best line this week, however the 'Giro - Italy' one is still tops.)

If we TRULY want cars to respects us more we can't be bicycle bozos.

DARE we mention this to fellow riders who manage to break 4 laws inside of 2 blocks?

----- Original Message ----
From: "Adams, Mike"
To: Monty Hill ; obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 3:24:45 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep working together to change public perception. On the other side of the issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they slowed to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought for an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As the racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's in both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave and smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and they may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over 30 years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way to deal with the auto society we live. Just some
thoughts
.

-----Original Message-----
From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage

The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or excuse
me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right of
Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile as
fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!

I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
after you make it home to give your family a hug.

Best regards,

Monty
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
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Adams, Mike

Let's all remember not to make this about what type of car but the person driving the SUV, sedan or any other car\truck. We need to keep working together to change public perception. On the other side of the issue, I was out for a team ride on the back side of Hillsboro on a no shoulder road, and as a driver in some new model sedan went by they slowed to say thanks for the single file and for keeping over. We all thought for an instant that it was going to be harassment but alas not to be. As the racing\cycling community we are the ambassadors, please take the responsibility and ride safe, the public will notice. There are bozo's in both camps. Do not be a bicycle bozo. There are times if you just wave and smile at the outraged driver this alone may defuse the situation and they may think we are not that bad after all. I have been riding for over 30 years and the patience to just ignore the rude driver is the best way to deal with the auto society we live. Just some thoughts.

-----Original Message-----
From: Monty Hill [mailto:Montyh@tvapdx.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:46 PM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage

The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or excuse
me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right of
Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile as
fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!

I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
after you make it home to give your family a hug.

Best regards,

Monty
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John Beaston

Don't forget to document your close-calls at

http://forums.bikeportland.org/viewforum.php?f=1

-John

-------- Original Message --------
From: "Hormann, Douglas J."
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re:[OBRA Chat] road rage
Date: 5/17/2006 1:59 PM
>
> Last night must have been harass Dougs night, because I too had a run
> in with an irate motorist. Mine wasn't in an SUV, just a Ford
> mini-pickup, but what a goober.
>
>
>
> I was heading home from work and decided to enjoy the nice weather and
> make a longer loop through Cornelius and then back to Hillsboro from
> my office in Aloha. I was riding westbound on Johnson School Road
> between Hwy. 219 and Forest Hills Golf Course. This is a two lane road
> with pretty good sight lines and minimal traffic. I was going about 19
> MPH and about a foot from the white line when I heard a car coming up
> behind me laying on his horn. The guy went buy without even moving
> over and I gave the traditional "read between the lines" salute. The
> driver, who looked to be about 50 years old, slowed and finally came
> to a stop ahead of me. I continued on toward him and moved over as if
> to pass him when he pulled across the road and blocked the entire
> road. He leaned out his window and started yelling and calling me
> everything in the book. As I approached him I didn't say anything, but
> just kept smiling (my badge was in the back pocket of my jersey, but I
> was otherwise unidentifiable as a police officer and was not armed). I
> think as I got closer, he realized I wasn't all that small and puny
> and easily intimidated, I weigh about 235 lbs and wasn't slowing down,
> he started to drive off still yelling. Unfortunately, I couldn't get
> the last three digits of his license plate as it was in shadow and my
> sunglasses are very dark, so I wasn't able to follow up, but I'll be
> keeping my eye out for him again as that's one of my favorite routes
> home.
>
> Doug Hormann
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org]
> *On Behalf Of *Mark J. Ginsberg
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:45 PM
> *To:* joec@aracnet.com; djshanks@comcast.net
> *Cc:* obra@list.obra.org
> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
>
> I wrote to Doug off list a few hours ago . . .
>
> Mark Ginsberg, Esq.
>
> */Joe Cipale /* wrote:
>
> Where oh where is our freindly Bicycle Attorney when you need him.
>
> I am certain that HE can render justice (along with a good swift kick
> to the
> wallet and, hopefully the 'nads).
>
> Joe
>
> djshanks wrote:
>
> > Forwarding this from a friend who had a near miss on Cornell last night.
> >
> > He's going to file a police report.
> >
> > -------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
> > From: "Shanks, Douglas J"
> > To: "Doug Shanks"
> > Subject: FW: misc
> > Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:12:32 +0000
> >
> >
> >
> > Valuable lesson learned commuting home last night. It is never...
> ever worth yelling at somebody in an SUV... they are bigger than we
> are. Here is my story....
> > I roll over the top of skyline late for baseball practice so I start
> down the other side with a purpose. Between Skyline and Forest Heights
> I'm at about 37 MPH and this idiot in an SUV decides he can't wait to
> pass me and goes by with oncoming traffic in the other lane so he is
> about 12 inches off my shoulder when he goes by. Of course 10 seconds
> after he passes me he starts braking for the light at Miller/Forest
> Heights. As I roll by him at the light... I look into his window.
> Didn't say anything... didn't make any hand gestures... just looked in
> his window to remind him I existed.
> > I start off through the light and all of a sudden I hear this guy
> yelling behind me.... What are you looking at?? You *&((* cyclist all
> think you own the road and blah, blah, blah. Well now I've had enough.
> I don't need some clown in an SUV ripping on me about cyclist and
> their bad attitudes. So as he pulls up next to me... I let him have
> it. Next thing I know he guns it swerves in front of me and slams on
> his brakes. Now it's no longer fun and games. I'm grabbing both brakes
> as hard as I can and start skidding sideways. There is nowhere to go
> with his front tire on the shoulder and a ditch to my right. I'm
> looking for a soft spot to land just as my shoulder and forearm make
> first contact with the side of his SUV. It saved me. I got my balance
> back as I bumped up against him and he let off the brake and took off
> so I didn't hit him too hard.
> > I get his plate number and start reciting it in my head.... VCZ
> 915...VCZ915.... VCT915...VZC915.... As you can see, that is one hard
> plate to remember. Damn... now I'm really ticked and over my initial
> fear of death. I start down the hill like a madman figuring I got a
> chance to catch the bum at a light. Sure enough down in the shopping
> area I catch him at a light and I about break his window when I come
> up beside him. I'm screaming obscenities at him and as close to I can
> get to ripping him out of his car and beating him to death with my
> bike. Cars behind me are now honking (light is green). I don't care...
> I'm still yelling and as he takes off I get his plate again. Now I'm
> only 4 blocks from my house. I can remember that long...
> VCZ915...VZC915...VTZ915... damn... I've screwed it up again.
> > I'm filing a police report today. I know the "V_ _ 915" is right and
> it is a green explorer. How many matches can there be for that.
> > If anybody knows the best route to get the police to handle this
> situation... don't hesitate to tell me. This guy is going to kill a
> cyclist as it was only incredible luck that I didn't end up in the
> ditch or under his wheels.
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
>
> Mark J. Ginsberg
> Attorney At Law
> 621 SW Morrison St., Ste. 900
> Portland, OR 97204
> (503) 542-3000
> Fax (503) 227-2530
> markjginsberg@yahoo.com
> www.bikesafetylaw.com
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Feel free to call! Free PC-to-PC calls. Low rates on PC-to-Phone. Get
> Yahoo! Messenger with Voice
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>

Susan Otcenas

>>Today, I, Brian Spears, have joined the Bicycle Transportation Alliance.

Thank you Brian! The BTA is our biggest and best advocacy voice. You will
not be sorry you joined.

Yesterday morning in Beaverton, not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4, but FIVE
cyclists all going in the same direction, all pulled up at the same light at
the corner of Baseline and 185th. 2 other cyclists went by in the opposite
direction while we stood there waiting for MAX to pass. While this may be
commonplace for you downtown cyclists, to have 7 cyclists all at one
intersection at the same time out here in the 'burbs is an amazing and rare
event. Gleeful comments about bike lane traffic jams were uttered, and we
all rode off happily.

Now, I suspect the increase in bicycle traffic on these warm days (I never
see this many folks riding in the winter) is contributing to the perceived
increase in road rage. Motorists not only have to deal with more
bicyclists, they have to do it while burning gas at $3+ per gallon. No
wonder they're cranky.

Susan

--------------------------------------------
Susan Otcenas
TEAM ESTROGEN, INC. __~o
2038 NW Aloclek Dr., Suite 220 -\_<,
Hillsboro, OR 97124 (*)/'(*)

http://www.TeamEstrogen.com
1-877-310-4592
--------------------------------------------
Cycling Apparel and Accessories for Women
--------------------------------------------

Matthew Wolpert

This reminds me of Jimmy Stewart in "It's a Wonderful Life" ...
somewhere there's a bell ringing every time an OBRA member joins the
BTA. Way to go Brian!

On 5/17/06, brispear@comcast.net wrote:
> All right, that's it. After being solidly hit six years ago and a zillion
> close calls, I had seriously pondered joining the BTA but never *quite*
> pulled the trigger. These stories, combined with yet another close call
> with - of course - a big pickup truck at lunch, has forced the issue.
> Today, I, Brian Spears, have joined the Bicycle Transportation Alliance.
>
> http://www.bta4bikes.org/support/join.php
>
>
>
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "Hormann, Douglas J."
> > Last night must have been harass Dougs night, because I too had a run in
> > with an irate motorist. Mine wasn't in an SUV, just a Ford mini-pickup,
> > but what a goober.
> >
> >
> >
> > I was heading home from work and decided to enjoy the nice weather and
> > make a longer loop through Cornelius and then back to Hillsboro from my
> > office in Aloha. I was riding westbound on Johnson School Road between
> > Hwy. 219 and Forest Hills Golf Course. This is a two lane road with
> > pretty good sight lines and minimal traffic. I was going about 19 MPH
> > and about a foot from the white line when I heard a car coming up behind
> > me laying on his horn. The guy went buy without even moving over and I
> > gave the traditional "read between the lines" salute. The driver, who
> > looked to be about 50 years old, slowed and finally came to a stop ahead
> > of me. I continued on toward him and moved over as if to pass him when
> > he pulled across the road and blocked the entire road. He leaned out his
> > window and started yelling and calling me everything in the book. As I
> > approached him I didn't say anything, but just kept smiling (my badge
> > was in the back pocket of my jersey, but I was otherwise unidentifiable
> > as a police officer and was not armed). I think as I got closer, he
> > realized I wasn't all that small and puny and easily intimidated, I
> > weigh about 235 lbs and wasn't slowing down, he started to drive off
> > still yelling. Unfortunately, I couldn't get the last three digits of
> > his license plate as it was in shadow and my sunglasses are very dark,
> > so I wasn't able to follow up, but I'll be keeping my eye out for him
> > again as that's one of my favorite routes home.
> >
> > Doug Hormann
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
> > Behalf Of Mark J. Ginsberg
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:45 PM
> > To: joec@aracnet.com; djshanks@comcast.net
> > Cc: obra@list.obra.org
> > Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
> >
> >
> >
> > I wrote to Doug off list a few hours ago . . .
> >
> > Mark Ginsberg, Esq.
> >
> > Joe Cipale wrote:
> >
> > Where oh where is our freindly Bicycle Attorney when you need him.
> >
> > I am certain that HE can render justice (along with a good swift kick to
> > the
> > wallet and, hopefully the 'nads).
> >
> > Joe
> >
> > djshanks wrote:
> >
> > > Forwarding this from a friend who had a near miss on Cornell last
> > night.
> > >
> > > He's going to file a police report.
> > >
> > > -------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
> > > From: "Shanks, Douglas J"
> > > To: "Doug Shanks"
> > > Subject: FW: misc
> > > Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:12:32 +0000
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Valuable lesson learned commuting home last night. It is never... ever
> > worth yelling at somebody in an SUV... they are bigger than we are. Here
> > is my story....
> > > I roll over the top of skyline late for baseball practice so I start
> > down the other side with a purpose. Between Skyline and Forest Heights
> > I'm at about 37 MPH and this idiot in an SUV decides he can't wait to
> > pass me and goes by with oncoming traffic in the other lane so he is
> > about 12 inches off my shoulder when he goes by. Of course 10 seconds
> > after he passes me he starts braking for the light at Miller/Forest
> > Heights. As I roll by him at the light... I look into his window. Didn't
> > say anything... didn't make any hand gestures... just looked in his
> > window to remind him I existed.
> > > I start off through the light and all of a sudden I hear this guy
> > yelling behind me.... What are you looking at?? You *&((* cyclist all
> > think you own the road and blah, blah, blah. Well now I've had enough. I
> > don't need some clown in an SUV ripping on me about cyclist and their
> > bad attitudes. So as he pulls up next to me... I let him have it. Next
> > thing I know he guns it swerves in front of me and slams on his brakes.
> > Now it's no longer fun and games. I'm grabbing both brakes as hard as I
> > can and start skidding sideways. There is nowhere to go with his front
> > tire on the shoulder and a ditch to my right. I'm looking for a soft
> > spot to land just as my shoulder and forearm make first contact with the
> > side of his SUV. It saved me. I got my balance back as I bumped up
> > against him and he let off the brake and took off so I didn't hit him
> > too hard.
> > > I get his plate number and start reciting it in my head.... VCZ
> > 915...VCZ915.... VCT915...VZC915.... As you can see, that is one hard
> > plate to remember. Damn... now I'm really ticked and over my initial
> > fear of death. I start down the hill like a madman figuring I got a
> > chance to catch the bum at a light. Sure enough down in the shopping
> > area I catch him at a light and I about break his window when I come up
> > beside him. I'm screaming obscenities at him and as close to I can get
> > to ripping him out of his car and beating him to death with my bike.
> > Cars behind me are now honking (light is green). I don't care... I'm
> > still yelling and as he takes off I get his plate again. Now I'm only 4
> > blocks from my house. I can remember that long...
> > VCZ915...VZC915...VTZ915... damn... I've screwed it up again.
> > > I'm filing a police report today. I know the "V_ _ 915" is right and
> > it is a green explorer. How many matches can there be for that.
> > > If anybody knows the best route to get the police to handle this
> > situation... don't hesitate to tell me. This guy is going to kill a
> > cyclist as it was only incredible luck that I didn't end up in the ditch
> > or under his wheels.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OBRA mailing list
> > obra@list.obra.org
> > http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> > Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Mark J. Ginsberg
> > Attorney At Law
> > 621 SW Morrison St., Ste. 900
> > Portland, OR 97204
> > (503) 542-3000
> > Fax (503) 227-2530
> > markjginsberg@yahoo.com
> > www.bikesafetylaw.com
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > Feel free to call! Free PC-to-PC calls. Low rates on PC-to-Phone. Get
> > Yahoo! Messenger with Voice
> >
> > m/evt=39663/*http:/messenger.yahoo.com>
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: "Hormann, Douglas J."
> To:
> Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 20:59:56 +0000
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
>
> Last night must have been harass Dougs night, because I too had a run in
> with an irate motorist. Mine wasn't in an SUV, just a Ford mini-pickup, but
> what a goober.
>
>
>
> I was heading home from work and decided to enjoy the nice weather and make
> a longer loop through Cornelius and then back to Hillsboro from my office in
> Aloha. I was riding westbound on Johnson School Road between Hwy. 219 and
> Forest Hills Golf Course. This is a two lane road with pretty good sight
> lines and minimal traffic. I was going about 19 MPH and about a foot from
> the white line when I heard a car coming up behind me laying on his horn.
> The guy went buy without even moving over and I gave the traditional "read
> between the lines" salute. The driver, who looked to be about 50 years old,
> slowed and finally came to a stop ahead of me. I continued on toward him and
> moved over as if to pass him when he pulled across the road and blocked the
> entire road. He leaned out his window and started yelling and calling me
> everything in the book. As I approached him I didn't say anything, but just
> kept smiling (my badge was in the back pocket of my jersey, but I was
> otherwise unidentifiable as a police officer and was not armed). I think as
> I got closer, he realized I wasn't all that small and puny and easily
> intimidated, I weigh about 235 lbs and wasn't slowing down, he started to
> drive off still yelling. Unfortunately, I couldn't get the last three digits
> of his license plate as it was in shadow and my sunglasses are very dark, so
> I wasn't able to follow up, but I'll be keeping my eye out for him again as
> that's one of my favorite routes home.
>
>
> Doug Hormann
> ________________________________
>
>
> From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
> Behalf Of Mark J. Ginsberg
> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:45 PM
> To: joec@aracnet.com; djshanks@comcast.net
> Cc: obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
>
> I wrote to Doug off list a few hours ago . . .
>
> Mark Ginsberg, Esq.
>
> Joe Cipale wrote:
>
> Where oh where is our freindly Bicycle Attorney when you need him.
>
> I am certain that HE can render justice (along with a good swift kick to the
> wallet and, hopefully the 'nads).
>
> Joe
>
> djshanks wrote:
>
> > Forwarding this from a friend who had a near miss on Cornell last night.
> >
> > He's going to file a police report.
> >
> > -------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
> > From: "Shanks, Douglas J"
> > To: "Doug Shanks"
> > Subject: FW: misc
> > Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:12:32 +0000
> >
> >
> >
> > Valuable lesson learned commuting home last night. It is never… ever worth
> yelling at somebody in an SUV… they are bigger than we are. Here is my
> story….
> > I roll over the top of skyline late for baseball practice so I start down
> the other side with a purpose. Between Skyline and Forest Heights I'm at
> about 37 MPH and this idiot in an SUV decides he can't wait to pass me and
> goes by with oncoming traffic in the other lane so he is about 12 inches off
> my shoulder when he goes by. Of course 10 seconds after he passes me he
> starts braking for the light at Miller/Forest Heights. As I roll by him at
> the light… I look into his window. Didn't say anything… didn't make any hand
> gestures… just looked in his window to remind him I existed.
> > I start off through the light and all of a sudden I hear this guy yelling
> behind me…. What are you looking at?? You *&((* cyclist all think you own
> the road and blah, blah, blah. Well now I've had enough. I don't need some
> clown in an SUV ripping on me about cyclist and their bad attitudes. So as
> he pulls up next to me… I let him have it. Next thing I know he guns it
> swerves in front of me and slams on his brakes. Now it's no longer fun and
> games. I'm grabbing both brakes as hard as I can and start skidding
> sideways. There is nowhere to go with his front tire on the shoulder and a
> ditch to my right. I'm looking for a soft spot to land just as my shoulder
> and forearm make first contact with the side of his SUV. It saved me. I got
> my balance back as I bumped up against him and he let off the brake and took
> off so I didn't hit him too hard.
> > I get his plate number and start reciting it in my head…. VCZ 915…VCZ915….
> VCT915…VZC915…. As you can see, that is one hard plate to remember. Damn…
> now I'm really ticked and over my initial fear of death. I start down the
> hill like a madman figuring I got a chance to catch the bum at a light. Sure
> enough down in the shopping area I catch him at a light and I about break
> his window when I come up beside him. I'm screaming obscenities at him and
> as close to I can get to ripping him out of his car and beating him to death
> with my bike. Cars behind me are now honking (light is green). I don't care…
> I'm still yelling and as he takes off I get his plate again. Now I'm only 4
> blocks from my house. I can remember that long… VCZ915…VZC915…VTZ915… damn…
> I've screwed it up again.
> > I'm filing a police report today. I know the "V_ _ 915" is right and it is
> a green explorer. How many matches can there be for that.
> > If anybody knows the best route to get the police to handle this
> situation… don't hesitate to tell me. This guy is going to kill a cyclist as
> it was only incredible luck that I didn't end up in the ditch or under his
> wheels.
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Mark J. Ginsberg
> Attorney At Law
> 621 SW Morrison St., Ste. 900
> Portland, OR 97204
> (503) 542-3000
> Fax (503) 227-2530
> markjginsberg@yahoo.com
> www.bikesafetylaw.com
> ________________________________
>
>
> Feel free to call! Free PC-to-PC calls. Low rates on PC-to-Phone. Get Yahoo!
> Messenger with Voice
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>

brispear@comcast.net

All right, that's it. After being solidly hit six years ago and a zillion close calls, I had seriously pondered joining the BTA but never *quite* pulled the trigger. These stories, combined with yet another close call with - of course - a big pickup truck at lunch, has forced the issue. Today, I, Brian Spears, have joined the Bicycle Transportation Alliance.

http://www.bta4bikes.org/support/join.php

-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Hormann, Douglas J."
> Last night must have been harass Dougs night, because I too had a run in
> with an irate motorist. Mine wasn't in an SUV, just a Ford mini-pickup,
> but what a goober.
>
>
>
> I was heading home from work and decided to enjoy the nice weather and
> make a longer loop through Cornelius and then back to Hillsboro from my
> office in Aloha. I was riding westbound on Johnson School Road between
> Hwy. 219 and Forest Hills Golf Course. This is a two lane road with
> pretty good sight lines and minimal traffic. I was going about 19 MPH
> and about a foot from the white line when I heard a car coming up behind
> me laying on his horn. The guy went buy without even moving over and I
> gave the traditional "read between the lines" salute. The driver, who
> looked to be about 50 years old, slowed and finally came to a stop ahead
> of me. I continued on toward him and moved over as if to pass him when
> he pulled across the road and blocked the entire road. He leaned out his
> window and started yelling and calling me everything in the book. As I
> approached him I didn't say anything, but just kept smiling (my badge
> was in the back pocket of my jersey, but I was otherwise unidentifiable
> as a police officer and was not armed). I think as I got closer, he
> realized I wasn't all that small and puny and easily intimidated, I
> weigh about 235 lbs and wasn't slowing down, he started to drive off
> still yelling. Unfortunately, I couldn't get the last three digits of
> his license plate as it was in shadow and my sunglasses are very dark,
> so I wasn't able to follow up, but I'll be keeping my eye out for him
> again as that's one of my favorite routes home.
>
> Doug Hormann
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
> Behalf Of Mark J. Ginsberg
> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:45 PM
> To: joec@aracnet.com; djshanks@comcast.net
> Cc: obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage
>
>
>
> I wrote to Doug off list a few hours ago . . .
>
> Mark Ginsberg, Esq.
>
> Joe Cipale wrote:
>
> Where oh where is our freindly Bicycle Attorney when you need him.
>
> I am certain that HE can render justice (along with a good swift kick to
> the
> wallet and, hopefully the 'nads).
>
> Joe
>
> djshanks wrote:
>
> > Forwarding this from a friend who had a near miss on Cornell last
> night.
> >
> > He's going to file a police report.
> >
> > -------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
> > From: "Shanks, Douglas J"
> > To: "Doug Shanks"
> > Subject: FW: misc
> > Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:12:32 +0000
> >
> >
> >
> > Valuable lesson learned commuting home last night. It is never... ever
> worth yelling at somebody in an SUV... they are bigger than we are. Here
> is my story....
> > I roll over the top of skyline late for baseball practice so I start
> down the other side with a purpose. Between Skyline and Forest Heights
> I'm at about 37 MPH and this idiot in an SUV decides he can't wait to
> pass me and goes by with oncoming traffic in the other lane so he is
> about 12 inches off my shoulder when he goes by. Of course 10 seconds
> after he passes me he starts braking for the light at Miller/Forest
> Heights. As I roll by him at the light... I look into his window. Didn't
> say anything... didn't make any hand gestures... just looked in his
> window to remind him I existed.
> > I start off through the light and all of a sudden I hear this guy
> yelling behind me.... What are you looking at?? You *&((* cyclist all
> think you own the road and blah, blah, blah. Well now I've had enough. I
> don't need some clown in an SUV ripping on me about cyclist and their
> bad attitudes. So as he pulls up next to me... I let him have it. Next
> thing I know he guns it swerves in front of me and slams on his brakes.
> Now it's no longer fun and games. I'm grabbing both brakes as hard as I
> can and start skidding sideways. There is nowhere to go with his front
> tire on the shoulder and a ditch to my right. I'm looking for a soft
> spot to land just as my shoulder and forearm make first contact with the
> side of his SUV. It saved me. I got my balance back as I bumped up
> against him and he let off the brake and took off so I didn't hit him
> too hard.
> > I get his plate number and start reciting it in my head.... VCZ
> 915...VCZ915.... VCT915...VZC915.... As you can see, that is one hard
> plate to remember. Damn... now I'm really ticked and over my initial
> fear of death. I start down the hill like a madman figuring I got a
> chance to catch the bum at a light. Sure enough down in the shopping
> area I catch him at a light and I about break his window when I come up
> beside him. I'm screaming obscenities at him and as close to I can get
> to ripping him out of his car and beating him to death with my bike.
> Cars behind me are now honking (light is green). I don't care... I'm
> still yelling and as he takes off I get his plate again. Now I'm only 4
> blocks from my house. I can remember that long...
> VCZ915...VZC915...VTZ915... damn... I've screwed it up again.
> > I'm filing a police report today. I know the "V_ _ 915" is right and
> it is a green explorer. How many matches can there be for that.
> > If anybody knows the best route to get the police to handle this
> situation... don't hesitate to tell me. This guy is going to kill a
> cyclist as it was only incredible luck that I didn't end up in the ditch
> or under his wheels.
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Mark J. Ginsberg
> Attorney At Law
> 621 SW Morrison St., Ste. 900
> Portland, OR 97204
> (503) 542-3000
> Fax (503) 227-2530
> markjginsberg@yahoo.com
> www.bikesafetylaw.com
>
> ________________________________
>
> Feel free to call! Free PC-to-PC calls. Low rates on PC-to-Phone. Get
> Yahoo! Messenger with Voice
> m/evt=39663/*http:/messenger.yahoo.com>
>
>

Hormann, Douglas J.

Last night must have been harass Dougs night, because I too had a run in
with an irate motorist. Mine wasn't in an SUV, just a Ford mini-pickup,
but what a goober.

I was heading home from work and decided to enjoy the nice weather and
make a longer loop through Cornelius and then back to Hillsboro from my
office in Aloha. I was riding westbound on Johnson School Road between
Hwy. 219 and Forest Hills Golf Course. This is a two lane road with
pretty good sight lines and minimal traffic. I was going about 19 MPH
and about a foot from the white line when I heard a car coming up behind
me laying on his horn. The guy went buy without even moving over and I
gave the traditional "read between the lines" salute. The driver, who
looked to be about 50 years old, slowed and finally came to a stop ahead
of me. I continued on toward him and moved over as if to pass him when
he pulled across the road and blocked the entire road. He leaned out his
window and started yelling and calling me everything in the book. As I
approached him I didn't say anything, but just kept smiling (my badge
was in the back pocket of my jersey, but I was otherwise unidentifiable
as a police officer and was not armed). I think as I got closer, he
realized I wasn't all that small and puny and easily intimidated, I
weigh about 235 lbs and wasn't slowing down, he started to drive off
still yelling. Unfortunately, I couldn't get the last three digits of
his license plate as it was in shadow and my sunglasses are very dark,
so I wasn't able to follow up, but I'll be keeping my eye out for him
again as that's one of my favorite routes home.

Doug Hormann

________________________________

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Mark J. Ginsberg
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:45 PM
To: joec@aracnet.com; djshanks@comcast.net
Cc: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] road rage

I wrote to Doug off list a few hours ago . . .

Mark Ginsberg, Esq.

Joe Cipale wrote:

Where oh where is our freindly Bicycle Attorney when you need him.

I am certain that HE can render justice (along with a good swift kick to
the
wallet and, hopefully the 'nads).

Joe

djshanks wrote:

> Forwarding this from a friend who had a near miss on Cornell last
night.
>
> He's going to file a police report.
>
> -------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
> From: "Shanks, Douglas J"
> To: "Doug Shanks"
> Subject: FW: misc
> Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:12:32 +0000
>
>
>
> Valuable lesson learned commuting home last night. It is never... ever
worth yelling at somebody in an SUV... they are bigger than we are. Here
is my story....
> I roll over the top of skyline late for baseball practice so I start
down the other side with a purpose. Between Skyline and Forest Heights
I'm at about 37 MPH and this idiot in an SUV decides he can't wait to
pass me and goes by with oncoming traffic in the other lane so he is
about 12 inches off my shoulder when he goes by. Of course 10 seconds
after he passes me he starts braking for the light at Miller/Forest
Heights. As I roll by him at the light... I look into his window. Didn't
say anything... didn't make any hand gestures... just looked in his
window to remind him I existed.
> I start off through the light and all of a sudden I hear this guy
yelling behind me.... What are you looking at?? You *&((* cyclist all
think you own the road and blah, blah, blah. Well now I've had enough. I
don't need some clown in an SUV ripping on me about cyclist and their
bad attitudes. So as he pulls up next to me... I let him have it. Next
thing I know he guns it swerves in front of me and slams on his brakes.
Now it's no longer fun and games. I'm grabbing both brakes as hard as I
can and start skidding sideways. There is nowhere to go with his front
tire on the shoulder and a ditch to my right. I'm looking for a soft
spot to land just as my shoulder and forearm make first contact with the
side of his SUV. It saved me. I got my balance back as I bumped up
against him and he let off the brake and took off so I didn't hit him
too hard.
> I get his plate number and start reciting it in my head.... VCZ
915...VCZ915.... VCT915...VZC915.... As you can see, that is one hard
plate to remember. Damn... now I'm really ticked and over my initial
fear of death. I start down the hill like a madman figuring I got a
chance to catch the bum at a light. Sure enough down in the shopping
area I catch him at a light and I about break his window when I come up
beside him. I'm screaming obscenities at him and as close to I can get
to ripping him out of his car and beating him to death with my bike.
Cars behind me are now honking (light is green). I don't care... I'm
still yelling and as he takes off I get his plate again. Now I'm only 4
blocks from my house. I can remember that long...
VCZ915...VZC915...VTZ915... damn... I've screwed it up again.
> I'm filing a police report today. I know the "V_ _ 915" is right and
it is a green explorer. How many matches can there be for that.
> If anybody knows the best route to get the police to handle this
situation... don't hesitate to tell me. This guy is going to kill a
cyclist as it was only incredible luck that I didn't end up in the ditch
or under his wheels.

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Mark J. Ginsberg
Attorney At Law
621 SW Morrison St., Ste. 900
Portland, OR 97204
(503) 542-3000
Fax (503) 227-2530
markjginsberg@yahoo.com
www.bikesafetylaw.com

________________________________

Feel free to call! Free PC-to-PC calls. Low rates on PC-to-Phone. Get
Yahoo! Messenger with Voice

Monty Hill

The attitude of this SUV driver make my blood boil, but my advice to
myself always is, he/she is carring the equvilent of a machine gun in
terms of how quickly and easily he/she could kill a large number of
people with one blow, so I bite my tongue and simple say sorry or excuse
me even if they were absolutely wrong. There is no way you are going to
convince an idiot like that of anything and one's life is not worth it.
I personally would rather see you ride another day to help create a
critical mass of cyclist to get the message out that the Public Right of
Ways are public and not for the soul purpose of driving an automobile as
fast one can. The arrogance of some drivers!!!

I do advocate tracking this person down through the legal channels,
after you make it home to give your family a hug.

Best regards,

Monty

Mark J. Ginsberg

I wrote to Doug off list a few hours ago . . .

Mark Ginsberg, Esq.

Joe Cipale wrote: Where oh where is our freindly Bicycle Attorney when you need him.

I am certain that HE can render justice (along with a good swift kick to the
wallet and, hopefully the 'nads).

Joe

djshanks wrote:

> Forwarding this from a friend who had a near miss on Cornell last night.
>
> He's going to file a police report.
>
> -------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
> From: "Shanks, Douglas J"
> To: "Doug Shanks"
> Subject: FW: misc
> Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:12:32 +0000
>
>
>
> Valuable lesson learned commuting home last night. It is never… ever worth yelling at somebody in an SUV… they are bigger than we are. Here is my story….
> I roll over the top of skyline late for baseball practice so I start down the other side with a purpose. Between Skyline and Forest Heights I'm at about 37 MPH and this idiot in an SUV decides he can't wait to pass me and goes by with oncoming traffic in the other lane so he is about 12 inches off my shoulder when he goes by. Of course 10 seconds after he passes me he starts braking for the light at Miller/Forest Heights. As I roll by him at the light… I look into his window. Didn't say anything… didn't make any hand gestures… just looked in his window to remind him I existed.
> I start off through the light and all of a sudden I hear this guy yelling behind me…. What are you looking at?? You *&((* cyclist all think you own the road and blah, blah, blah. Well now I've had enough. I don't need some clown in an SUV ripping on me about cyclist and their bad attitudes. So as he pulls up next to me… I let him have it. Next thing I know he guns it swerves in front of me and slams on his brakes. Now it's no longer fun and games. I'm grabbing both brakes as hard as I can and start skidding sideways. There is nowhere to go with his front tire on the shoulder and a ditch to my right. I'm looking for a soft spot to land just as my shoulder and forearm make first contact with the side of his SUV. It saved me. I got my balance back as I bumped up against him and he let off the brake and took off so I didn't hit him too hard.
> I get his plate number and start reciting it in my head…. VCZ 915…VCZ915…. VCT915…VZC915…. As you can see, that is one hard plate to remember. Damn… now I'm really ticked and over my initial fear of death. I start down the hill like a madman figuring I got a chance to catch the bum at a light. Sure enough down in the shopping area I catch him at a light and I about break his window when I come up beside him. I'm screaming obscenities at him and as close to I can get to ripping him out of his car and beating him to death with my bike. Cars behind me are now honking (light is green). I don't care… I'm still yelling and as he takes off I get his plate again. Now I'm only 4 blocks from my house. I can remember that long… VCZ915…VZC915…VTZ915… damn… I've screwed it up again.
> I'm filing a police report today. I know the "V_ _ 915" is right and it is a green explorer. How many matches can there be for that.
> If anybody knows the best route to get the police to handle this situation… don't hesitate to tell me. This guy is going to kill a cyclist as it was only incredible luck that I didn't end up in the ditch or under his wheels.

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Mark J. Ginsberg
Attorney At Law
621 SW Morrison St., Ste. 900
Portland, OR 97204
(503) 542-3000
Fax (503) 227-2530
markjginsberg@yahoo.com
www.bikesafetylaw.com

---------------------------------
Feel free to call! Free PC-to-PC calls. Low rates on PC-to-Phone. Get Yahoo! Messenger with Voice

Joe Cipale

Where oh where is our freindly Bicycle Attorney when you need him.

I am certain that HE can render justice (along with a good swift kick to the
wallet and, hopefully the 'nads).

Joe

djshanks wrote:

> Forwarding this from a friend who had a near miss on Cornell last night.
>
> He's going to file a police report.
>
> -------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
> From: "Shanks, Douglas J"
> To: "Doug Shanks"
> Subject: FW: misc
> Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:12:32 +0000
>
>
>
> Valuable lesson learned commuting home last night. It is never? ever worth yelling at somebody in an SUV? they are bigger than we are. Here is my story?.
> I roll over the top of skyline late for baseball practice so I start down the other side with a purpose. Between Skyline and Forest Heights I'm at about 37 MPH and this idiot in an SUV decides he can't wait to pass me and goes by with oncoming traffic in the other lane so he is about 12 inches off my shoulder when he goes by. Of course 10 seconds after he passes me he starts braking for the light at Miller/Forest Heights. As I roll by him at the light? I look into his window. Didn't say anything? didn't make any hand gestures? just looked in his window to remind him I existed.
> I start off through the light and all of a sudden I hear this guy yelling behind me?. What are you looking at?? You *&((* cyclist all think you own the road and blah, blah, blah. Well now I've had enough. I don't need some clown in an SUV ripping on me about cyclist and their bad attitudes. So as he pulls up next to me? I let him have it. Next thing I know he guns it swerves in front of me and slams on his brakes. Now it's no longer fun and games. I'm grabbing both brakes as hard as I can and start skidding sideways. There is nowhere to go with his front tire on the shoulder and a ditch to my right. I'm looking for a soft spot to land just as my shoulder and forearm make first contact with the side of his SUV. It saved me. I got my balance back as I bumped up against him and he let off the brake and took off so I didn't hit him too hard.
> I get his plate number and start reciting it in my head?. VCZ 915?VCZ915?. VCT915?VZC915?. As you can see, that is one hard plate to remember. Damn? now I'm really ticked and over my initial fear of death. I start down the hill like a madman figuring I got a chance to catch the bum at a light. Sure enough down in the shopping area I catch him at a light and I about break his window when I come up beside him. I'm screaming obscenities at him and as close to I can get to ripping him out of his car and beating him to death with my bike. Cars behind me are now honking (light is green). I don't care? I'm still yelling and as he takes off I get his plate again. Now I'm only 4 blocks from my house. I can remember that long? VCZ915?VZC915?VTZ915? damn? I've screwed it up again.
> I'm filing a police report today. I know the "V_ _ 915" is right and it is a green explorer. How many matches can there be for that.
> If anybody knows the best route to get the police to handle this situation? don't hesitate to tell me. This guy is going to kill a cyclist as it was only incredible luck that I didn't end up in the ditch or under his wheels.

Long, Steve

Well, I know they don't use the letter O and I think there may be
another letter that they don't use, so that leaves 24 letters twice.
Actually it's 24 squared is the number of possible plate combinations
for that plate. 24 squared = 576

Also, recall this topic from a few weeks ago:

A Cyclist's Day in Court

Posted by: Jessica

Apr 13 2006, 12:11 pm

I spent the morning in traffic court.

Nope, I wasn't there because I got a ticket, but rather to support
Portland cyclist Sean Barrett. Sean was hit by a car last November near
the Rose Quarter. The driver made a sudden right turn from two lanes
over, darting into the bike lane where Sean was.

Luckily for Sean, a second driver who witnessed the crash stayed to
help. Unluckily, 911 operators refused to send out an ambulance when the
witness called, and thus police never arrived on the scene. No ticket
was issued, and when Sean tried to follow up with the police, they told
him they wouldn't fill out an accident report or issue a ticket.

In the past, that would have been the (frustrating) end of the story,
and it's a story I hear too often here at the BTA.

Portland lawyer (and dedicated cycling advocate) Ray Thomas has recently
been working on a revolutionary tool to help cyclists in this situation
(more info here), and Sean was in the perfect position to try this out.
(The first such case was recently resolved in favor of the cyclist;
here's a recent Portland Mercury article about it.)

Oregon law allows citizens to initiate a traffic complaint in court (ORS
153.058). It's seldom used, though--this morning in court the judge said
that he had never seen such a case in his six years on the traffic court
bench.

Following Ray's advice, Sean prepared his case thoroughly, filling out
plenty of paperwork, creating a detailed hand-drawn map, and making sure
his witness would be present. Thankfully, she was.

The driver had originally pled not guilty, but she changed her plea to
"no contest," which led to a conviction for failure to yield in a bike
lane (ORS 811.050) and improper right hand turn (ORS 811.355). Those
convictions will go on her driving record, and, I hope she'll think
twice before she darts across a bike lane without looking again.

I was there with BTA head honcho Evan, and bike community members Ken
and Meghan (as well as Sean's mom), to lend moral support and
demonstrate that the bike community is watching these cases. I couldn't
be happier for Sean that he was able to see justice done, and make sure
that cyclists are given their rightful protection under law.

We'll continue to work on this idea with Ray and others. With two wins
out of two cases, it's clear that citizen-initiated enforcement is an
idea whose time has come.

_______________________

I just wanted to let you all know that Sean's citizen-initiated traffic
case this morning resulted in two convictions against the driver. More

here:

http://www.bta4bikes.org/btablog/2006/04/13/a-cyclists-day-in-court/

Also, did you see today's article in the Mercury on the same topic?

http://www.portlandmercury.com/portland/Content?oid=38057&category=22101

________________________________

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of djshanks@comcast.net
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 11:17 AM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: [OBRA Chat] road rage

Forwarding this from a friend who had a near miss on Cornell last night.

He's going to file a police report.

-------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
From: "Shanks, Douglas J"
To: "Doug Shanks"
Subject: FW: misc
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:12:32 +0000

Valuable lesson learned commuting home last night. It is
never... ever worth yelling at somebody in an SUV... they are bigger
than we are. Here is my story....

I roll over the top of skyline late for baseball practice so I
start down the other side with a purpose. Between Skyline and Forest
Heights I'm at about 37 MPH and this idiot in an SUV decides he can't
wait to pass me and goes by with oncoming traffic in the other lane so
he is about 12 inches off my shoulder when he goes by. Of course 10
seconds after he passes me he starts braking for the light at
Miller/Forest Heights. As I roll by him at the light... I look into his
window. Didn't say anything... didn't make any hand gestures... just
looked in his window to remind him I existed.

I start off through the light and all of a sudden I hear this
guy yelling behind me.... What are you looking at?? You *&((* cyclist
all think you own the road and blah, blah, blah. Well now I've had
enough. I don't need some clown in an SUV ripping on me about cyclist
and their bad attitudes. So as he pulls up next to me... I let him have
it. Next thing I know he guns it swerves in front of me and slams on
his brakes. Now it's no longer fun and games. I'm grabbing both brakes
as hard as I can and start skidding sideways. There is nowhere to go
with his front tire on the shoulder and a ditch to my right. I'm
looking for a soft spot to land just as my shoulder and forearm make
first contact with the side of his SUV. It saved me. I got my balance
back as I bumped up against him and he let off the brake and took off so
I didn't hit him too hard.

I get his plate number and start reciting it in my head.... VCZ
915...VCZ915.... VCT915...VZC915.... As you can see, that is one hard
plate to remember. Damn... now I'm really ticked and over my initial
fear of death. I start down the hill like a madman figuring I got a
chance to catch the bum at a light. Sure enough down in the shopping
area I catch him at a light and I about break his window when I come up
beside him. I'm screaming obscenities at him and as close to I can get
to ripping him out of his car and beating him to death with my bike.
Cars behind me are now honking (light is green). I don't care... I'm
still yelling and as he takes off I get his plate again. Now I'm only 4
blocks from my house. I can remember that long...
VCZ915...VZC915...VTZ915... damn... I've screwed it up again.

I'm filing a police report today. I know the "V_ _ 915" is
right and it is a green explorer. How many matches can there be for
that.

If anybody knows the best route to get the police to handle this
situation... don't hesitate to tell me. This guy is going to kill a
cyclist as it was only incredible luck that I didn't end up in the ditch
or under his wheels.

djshanks@comcast.net

Forwarding this from a friend who had a near miss on Cornell last night.

He's going to file a police report.

-------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
From: "Shanks, Douglas J"
To: "Doug Shanks"
Subject: FW: misc
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:12:32 +0000

Valuable lesson learned commuting home last night. It is never? ever worth yelling at somebody in an SUV? they are bigger than we are. Here is my story?.
I roll over the top of skyline late for baseball practice so I start down the other side with a purpose. Between Skyline and Forest Heights I'm at about 37 MPH and this idiot in an SUV decides he can't wait to pass me and goes by with oncoming traffic in the other lane so he is about 12 inches off my shoulder when he goes by. Of course 10 seconds after he passes me he starts braking for the light at Miller/Forest Heights. As I roll by him at the light? I look into his window. Didn't say anything? didn't make any hand gestures? just looked in his window to remind him I existed.
I start off through the light and all of a sudden I hear this guy yelling behind me?. What are you looking at?? You *&((* cyclist all think you own the road and blah, blah, blah. Well now I've had enough. I don't need some clown in an SUV ripping on me about cyclist and their bad attitudes. So as he pulls up next to me? I let him have it. Next thing I know he guns it swerves in front of me and slams on his brakes. Now it's no longer fun and games. I'm grabbing both brakes as hard as I can and start skidding sideways. There is nowhere to go with his front tire on the shoulder and a ditch to my right. I'm looking for a soft spot to land just as my shoulder and forearm make first contact with the side of his SUV. It saved me. I got my balance back as I bumped up against him and he let off the brake and took off so I didn't hit him too hard.
I get his plate number and start reciting it in my head?. VCZ 915?VCZ915?. VCT915?VZC915?. As you can see, that is one hard plate to remember. Damn? now I'm really ticked and over my initial fear of death. I start down the hill like a madman figuring I got a chance to catch the bum at a light. Sure enough down in the shopping area I catch him at a light and I about break his window when I come up beside him. I'm screaming obscenities at him and as close to I can get to ripping him out of his car and beating him to death with my bike. Cars behind me are now honking (light is green). I don't care? I'm still yelling and as he takes off I get his plate again. Now I'm only 4 blocks from my house. I can remember that long? VCZ915?VZC915?VTZ915? damn? I've screwed it up again.
I'm filing a police report today. I know the "V_ _ 915" is right and it is a green explorer. How many matches can there be for that.
If anybody knows the best route to get the police to handle this situation? don't hesitate to tell me. This guy is going to kill a cyclist as it was only incredible luck that I didn't end up in the ditch or under his wheels.

markjgi-@yahoo.com

--0-991445132-1088093992=:55407

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii



If you are not hearing back from the officer, work your way up the supervisory ladder.



Mark Ginsberg



".David.Auker." <Dav-@Hevanet.com> wrote:

 (...)given his demeanor

Remember that the police are our public servants. I think you had a right

for the report to be taken by a friendly, unbiased officer. If he made the

situation uncomfortable, and hasn't lived up to his promise to "get back to

you," I think you are warranted to follow this up with a call back to the

Portland Police Bureau.



David





----- Original Message -----

From: "Dan Feiner"

To:

Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2004 8:54 PM

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Road rage





| I want to take this opportunity to thank everyone who responded to my road

| rage post last week. With all the encouragement I received I reported the

| incident to the Portland Police Bureau. The woman who took my report was

| helpful and sympathetic. She confirmed the plate I reported matched the

| description of the car I saw. She sent a cop over to take a report. He

was

| a different story altogether. He entered my office with a frown that he

| still had when he left. He said he would contact the registered owner and

| get back to me but I never heard another thing from him. Doesn't surprise

| me at all given his demeanor. It's been about a week now so I don't

really

| expect to hear more. Luck of the draw, I guess. Anyhow, thanks again to

| everyone for their advice and assistance. Dan Feiner

|

| To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

| To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

| To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com

|

|

|



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com









Mark J. GinsbergAttorney At Law1001 SW 5th Ave., Ste. 1900Portland, OR 97204(503) 542-3000Fax (503) 295-3720 markjgi-@yahoo.comwww.bikesafetylaw.com













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<DIV>If you are not hearing back from the officer, work your way up the supervisory ladder.</DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>Mark Ginsberg<BR><BR><B><I>".David.Auker." <Dav-@Hevanet.com></I></B> wrote:</DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">>(...)given his demeanor<BR><BR>Remember that the police are our public servants. I think you had a right<BR>for the report to be taken by a friendly, unbiased officer. If he made the<BR>situation uncomfortable, and hasn't lived up to his promise to "get back to<BR>you," I think you are warranted to follow this up with a call back to the<BR>Portland Police Bureau.<BR><BR>David<BR><BR><BR>----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Dan Feiner" <DA-@DANFEINER.COM><BR>To: <OB-@TOPICA.COM><BR>Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2004 8:54 PM<BR>Subject: [OBRA Chat] Road rage<BR><BR><BR>| I want to take this opportunity to thank everyone who responded to my road<BR>| rage post last week. With all the encouragement I received I reported the<BR>| incident to the Portland Police Bureau. The woman who took my report was<BR>| helpful and sympathetic. She confirmed the plate I reported matched the<BR>|

<DIV>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<ADDRESS>Mark J. Ginsberg</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>Attorney At Law</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>1001 SW 5th Ave., Ste. 1900</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>Portland, OR 97204</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>(503) 542-3000</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>Fax (503) 295-3720 </ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS><A href="mailto:markjgi-@yahoo.com">markjgi-@yahoo.com</A></ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS><A href="http://www.bikesafetylaw.com">www.bikesafetylaw.com</A> </ADDRESS></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV><p>

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.David.Auker.

 (...)given his demeanor

Remember that the police are our public servants.    I think you had a right

for the report to be taken by a friendly, unbiased officer.   If he made the

situation uncomfortable, and hasn't lived up to his promise to "get back to

you," I think you are warranted to follow this up with a call back to the

Portland Police Bureau.



David





----- Original Message -----

From: "Dan Feiner" <da-@danfeiner.com>

To: <ob-@topica.com>

Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2004 8:54 PM

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Road rage





| I want to take this opportunity to thank everyone who responded to my road

| rage post last week. With all the encouragement I received I reported the

| incident to the Portland Police Bureau. The woman who took my report was

| helpful and sympathetic. She confirmed the plate I reported matched the

| description of the car I saw. She sent a cop over to take a report. He

was

| a different story altogether. He entered my office with a frown that he

| still had when he left. He said he would contact the registered owner and

| get back to me but I never heard another thing from him. Doesn't surprise

| me at all given his demeanor. It's been about a week now so I don't

really

| expect to hear more. Luck of the draw, I guess. Anyhow, thanks again to

| everyone for their advice and assistance. Dan Feiner

|

| To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

| To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

| To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com

|

|

|

Dan Feiner

I want to take this opportunity to thank everyone who responded to my road

rage post last week. With all the encouragement I received I reported the

incident to the Portland Police Bureau. The woman who took my report was

helpful and sympathetic. She confirmed the plate I reported matched the

description of the car I saw. She sent a cop over to take a report. He was

a different story altogether. He entered my office with a frown that he

still had when he left. He said he would contact the registered owner and

get back to me but I never heard another thing from him. Doesn't surprise

me at all given his demeanor. It's been about a week now so I don't really

expect to hear more. Luck of the draw, I guess. Anyhow, thanks again to

everyone for their advice and assistance. Dan Feiner