High Speed Wobble/Shimmy

br-@politesociety.com

2004-07-15



Lucky, or skilled?



----- Original Message -----

From: "Derek Darves" <dar-@yahoo.com>

To: <ob-@topica.com>

Sent: Thursday, July 15, 2004 7:08 AM

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy





 I was in the 1/2 field at Cascade and experienced wobbles on the descent

to Sparks Lake. I had problems in the same place last year at Cascade.

At the time I thought is was the high profile wheel I had just put on

the front of the bike. This year I used conventional wheels but still

had wobbles. My headset is adjusted properly, etc, which makes me think

it is some combination of the frame and fork. A local frame builder told

me that wobbles can often be traced to the weight/geometry of the rear

triangle.



The bottom line is that something about that area causes many bikes to

speed wobble - bikes that don't seem to wobble anywhere else. This fact

alone, measured against the danger of crashing at 50+, suggests that

maybe the course is not ideal for racing in that direction so long as we

still have little concensus on what is causing the wobble. There were

many riders in 1/2 field that had wobbles, but we all were lucky enough

to stay upright.





Mike Murray wrote:

 

Pat Sagers [mailto:pat_s-@orcom.com] asks:

"I know there is a lot of information on the internet, but isn't this

issue

a fairly recent phenomena? So what are the contributing factors?"



Not a new problem. It has been around since there were bikes. More

flexible bikes make it more likely but even though newer bikes are

lighter

they are generally stiffer than older bikes. High profile wheels

probably

make it more likely.



Mike Murray



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

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Derek Darves

2004-07-15



I was in the 1/2 field at Cascade and experienced wobbles on the descent

to Sparks Lake. I had problems in the same place last year at Cascade.

At the time I thought is was the high profile wheel I had just put on

the front of the bike. This year I used conventional wheels but still

had wobbles. My headset is adjusted properly, etc, which makes me think

it is some combination of the frame and fork. A local frame builder told

me that wobbles can often be traced to the weight/geometry of the rear

triangle.



The bottom line is that something about that area causes many bikes to

speed wobble - bikes that don't seem to wobble anywhere else. This fact

alone, measured against the danger of crashing at 50+, suggests that

maybe the course is not ideal for racing in that direction so long as we

still have little concensus on what is causing the wobble. There were

many riders in 1/2 field that had wobbles, but we all were lucky enough

to stay upright.





Mike Murray wrote:

 

Pat Sagers [mailto:pat_s-@orcom.com] asks:

"I know there is a lot of information on the internet, but isn't this

issue

a fairly recent phenomena? So what are the contributing factors?"



Not a new problem. It has been around since there were bikes. More

flexible bikes make it more likely but even though newer bikes are

lighter

they are generally stiffer than older bikes. High profile wheels

probably

make it more likely.



Mike Murray



Mike Murray

2004-07-14



Pat Sagers [mailto:pat_s-@orcom.com] asks:

"I know there is a lot of information on the internet, but isn't this issue

a fairly recent phenomena? So what are the contributing factors?"



Not a new problem. It has been around since there were bikes. More

flexible bikes make it more likely but even though newer bikes are lighter

they are generally stiffer than older bikes. High profile wheels probably

make it more likely.



Mike Murray



Pat Sagers

2004-07-14



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I know there is a lot of information on the internet, but isn't this issue a

fairly recent phenomena? So what are the contributing factors? I would

think the pros would definitely have gone through this a lot by now. They

descend fast as anyone and have the latest gear.



Pat



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<DIV><SPAN class=088162022-14072004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I know

there is a lot of information on the internet, but isn't this issue a fairly

recent phenomena?  So what are the contributing factors?  I would

think the pros would definitely have gone through this a lot by now.  They

descend fast as anyone and have the latest gear.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>

<DIV><SPAN class=088162022-14072004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff

size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>

<DIV><SPAN class=088162022-14072004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff

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D Grab

2004-07-14



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Hey, I read somewhere that if you touch your knees to the top tube, the shimmy will stop. I also heard that the lighter your bike (or wheelset) is the worse it handles. Any truth to that?





"Brad Cockman, DC" <bra-@bigfoot.com> wrote:Regardless of equipment questions, the road we're talking about at the

CCC is steep, fast and STRAIGHT. In other words, there is very little

input necessary into the bike which in my opinion would allow a harmonic

to develop. The backside of Bachelor is actually faster, but there are

some good turns. In the numerous times I've been down this particular

road I've never seen or experienced a wobble.



I witnessed at least two Master's riders develop wobbles on the same

stretch where the 3/4 crash occured. One very experienced rider took a

foot out in anticipation of going down, but didn't. The other pulled it

out somehow too. I know one of them was riding a very deep section

carbon wheel.



I don't think this course is going to go away soon so I'd suggest to

everyone coming to the CCC in 2005 go out and do some high speed

testing. I personally don't need to see that kind of carnage again.



And to all those that were involved I wish you a speedy recovery.



Brad







Adams, Mike wrote:

 The road Erik is talking about is Laurelwood Road. Steep, straight and

if you really hammer you might hit 55+. To much fun!!!



-----Original Message-----

From: Augusto C.D. Carneiro [mailto:acar-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 1:01 PM

To: eri-@fusium.com; ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy







The key in Erik's message is: "keep your arms and shoulders relaxed"



My worst wobbles were last year at a race in the Manchester velodrome.

I Got sandwiched by two riders and my reaction (besides trying to

backpedal) was to grip the handlebars tighly. As the wobbles started, I

freaked out and gripped the handlebars even tighter, which made the

wobbles way worse, until I slowed down enough. I immediatly thought for

sure there was something wrong with my bike, but one of the coaches told

me it was from the death grip I applied on the Handlebars.







 From: Erik Voldengen

Reply-To: eri-@fusium.com

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2004 10:18:56 -0700



It's completely possible some of the people in that CCC stage have never



decended so fast before. It's very hard to come by such a huge decent.



Anyone in the PDX area that hasn't done it yet, I'd suggest going down

Bald

Peak. I forget the name of the road, but it ends right at that store at

the

bottom of the hill. You can't miss it -- it's completely straight,

insanely

steep, and you will go faster than you've ever gone before. It's well

worth

riding for the experience. Keep your arms and shoulders relaxed. Be

careful, it's almost like a roller coaster ride.



I wish everyone a speedy recovery from the crash. Hope this message

helps

at least one person.



-Erik



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



_____



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<DIV><FONT size=2>

<P>Hey, I read somewhere that if you touch your knees to the top tube, the shimmy will stop.  I also heard that the lighter your bike (or wheelset) is the worse it handles.  Any truth to that? </P></FONT><BR><BR><B><I>"Brad Cockman, DC" <bra-@bigfoot.com></I></B> wrote:

<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">Regardless of equipment questions, the road we're talking about at the <BR>CCC is steep, fast and STRAIGHT. In other words, there is very little <BR>input necessary into the bike which in my opinion would allow a harmonic <BR>to develop. The backside of Bachelor is actually faster, but there are <BR>some good turns. In the numerous times I've been down this particular <BR>road I've never seen or experienced a wobble.<BR><BR>I witnessed at least two Master's riders develop wobbles on the same <BR>stretch where the 3/4 crash occured. One very experienced rider took a <BR>foot out in anticipation of going down, but didn't. The other pulled it <BR>out somehow too. I know one of them was riding a very deep section <BR>carbon wheel.<BR><BR>I don't think this course is going to go away soon so I'd suggest to <BR>everyone coming to the CCC in 2005 go out and do some high speed <BR>testing. I

personally don't need to see that kind of carnage again.<BR><BR>And to all those that were involved I wish you a speedy recovery.<BR><BR>Brad<BR><BR><BR><BR>Adams, Mike wrote:<BR>> The road Erik is talking about is Laurelwood Road. Steep, straight and <BR>> if you really hammer you might hit 55+. To much fun!!!<BR>> <BR>> -----Original Message-----<BR>> From: Augusto C.D. Carneiro [mailto:acar-@hotmail.com]<BR>> Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 1:01 PM<BR>> To: eri-@fusium.com; ob-@topica.com<BR>> Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> The key in Erik's message is: "keep your arms and shoulders relaxed"<BR>> <BR>> My worst wobbles were last year at a race in the Manchester velodrome. <BR>> I Got sandwiched by two riders and my reaction (besides trying to <BR>> backpedal) was to grip the handlebars tighly. As the wobbles started, I <BR>> freaked out and gripped the handlebars even tighter, which

made the <BR>> wobbles way worse, until I slowed down enough. I immediatly thought for <BR>> sure there was something wrong with my bike, but one of the coaches told <BR>> me it was from the death grip I applied on the Handlebars.<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> >From: Erik Voldengen <ERI-@FUSIUM.COM><BR>> >Reply-To: eri-@fusium.com <BR>> >To: ob-@topica.com <BR>> >Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy <BR>> >Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2004 10:18:56 -0700 <BR>> > <BR>> >It's completely possible some of the people in that CCC stage have never <BR>> ><BR>> >decended so fast before. It's very hard to come by such a huge decent. <BR>> > <BR>> >Anyone in the PDX area that hasn't done it yet, I'd suggest going down <BR>> >Bald <BR>> >Peak. I forget the name of the road, but it ends right at that store at <BR>> >the <BR>> >bottom of the hill. You can't miss it -- it's completely

straight, <BR>> >insanely <BR>> >steep, and you will go faster than you've ever gone before. It's well <BR>> >worth <BR>> >riding for the experience. Keep your arms and shoulders relaxed. Be <BR>> >careful, it's almost like a roller coaster ride. <BR>> > <BR>> >I wish everyone a speedy recovery from the crash. Hope this message <BR>> >helps <BR>> >at least one person. <BR>> > <BR>> >-Erik <BR>> > <BR>> >To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com. <BR>> >To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org <BR>> >To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com <BR>> > <BR>> > <BR>> <BR>> _____ <BR>> <BR>> MSN Messenger: converse com os seus amigos online. Instale gr?tis. <BR>> Clique aqui. <HTTP: 2749??PS="47575" 8HMABRBR g.msn.com><BR>> To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.<BR>> <BR>> To respond to the list manager send to

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Brad Cockman, DC

2004-07-14



Regardless of equipment questions, the road we're talking about at the

CCC is steep, fast and STRAIGHT. In other words, there is very little

input necessary into the bike which in my opinion would allow a harmonic

to develop. The backside of Bachelor is actually faster, but there are

some good turns. In the numerous times I've been down this particular

road I've never seen or experienced a wobble.



I witnessed at least two Master's riders develop wobbles on the same

stretch where the 3/4 crash occured. One very experienced rider took a

foot out in anticipation of going down, but didn't. The other pulled it

out somehow too. I know one of them was riding a very deep section

carbon wheel.



I don't think this course is going to go away soon so I'd suggest to

everyone coming to the CCC in 2005 go out and do some high speed

testing. I personally don't need to see that kind of carnage again.



And to all those that were involved I wish you a speedy recovery.



Brad







Adams, Mike wrote:

 The road Erik is talking about is Laurelwood Road. Steep, straight and

if you really hammer you might hit 55+. To much fun!!!



-----Original Message-----

From: Augusto C.D. Carneiro [mailto:acar-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 1:01 PM

To: eri-@fusium.com; ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy







The key in Erik's message is: "keep your arms and shoulders relaxed"



My worst wobbles were last year at a race in the Manchester velodrome.

I Got sandwiched by two riders and my reaction (besides trying to

backpedal) was to grip the handlebars tighly. As the wobbles started, I

freaked out and gripped the handlebars even tighter, which made the

wobbles way worse, until I slowed down enough. I immediatly thought for

sure there was something wrong with my bike, but one of the coaches told

me it was from the death grip I applied on the Handlebars.







 From: Erik Voldengen <eri-@fusium.com>

Reply-To: eri-@fusium.com

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2004 10:18:56 -0700



It's completely possible some of the people in that CCC stage have never



decended so fast before. It's very hard to come by such a huge decent.



Anyone in the PDX area that hasn't done it yet, I'd suggest going down

Bald

Peak. I forget the name of the road, but it ends right at that store at

the

bottom of the hill. You can't miss it -- it's completely straight,

insanely

steep, and you will go faster than you've ever gone before. It's well

worth

riding for the experience. Keep your arms and shoulders relaxed. Be

careful, it's almost like a roller coaster ride.



I wish everyone a speedy recovery from the crash. Hope this message

helps

at least one person.



-Erik



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



   _____



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David Oliphant

2004-07-14



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I was told that if you bike wobbles (which it shouldn't do) immediately place your knee(s) against the top tube...it will subside. Also, the reason why your bike wobbles in the first place is because the front end is too light...causing it to shimmy. Riders have a tendency to lean back on a fast descent...the best thing to do is lean forward a bit...putting your weight over the handlebars/front wheel in a more aero position.

----- Original Message -----

From: Adams, Mike

To: acar-@hotmail.com ; eri-@fusium.com ; ob-@topica.com

Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 1:07 PM

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy





The road Erik is talking about is Laurelwood Road. Steep, straight and if you really hammer you might hit 55+. To much fun!!!

    -----Original Message-----

    From: Augusto C.D. Carneiro [mailto:acar-@hotmail.com]

    Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 1:01 PM

    To: eri-@fusium.com; ob-@topica.com

    Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy





    The key in Erik's message is: "keep your arms and shoulders relaxed"



    My worst wobbles were last year at a race in the Manchester velodrome. I Got sandwiched by two riders and my reaction (besides trying to backpedal) was to grip the handlebars tighly. As the wobbles started, I freaked out and gripped the handlebars even tighter, which made the wobbles way worse, until I slowed down enough. I immediatly thought for sure there was something wrong with my bike, but one of the coaches told me it was from the death grip I applied on the Handlebars.







    >From: Erik Voldengen <eri-@fusium.com>

    >Reply-To: eri-@fusium.com

    >To: ob-@topica.com

    >Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy

    >Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2004 10:18:56 -0700

    >

    >It's completely possible some of the people in that CCC stage have never

    >decended so fast before. It's very hard to come by such a huge decent.

    >

    >Anyone in the PDX area that hasn't done it yet, I'd suggest going down Bald

    >Peak. I forget the name of the road, but it ends right at that store at the

    >bottom of the hill. You can't miss it -- it's completely straight, insanely

    >steep, and you will go faster than you've ever gone before. It's well worth

    >riding for the experience. Keep your arms and shoulders relaxed. Be

    >careful, it's almost like a roller coaster ride.

    >

    >I wish everyone a speedy recovery from the crash. Hope this message helps

    >at least one person.

    >

    >-Erik

    >

    >To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

    >To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

    >To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com

    >

    >





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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I was told that if you bike wobbles (which it

shouldn't do) immediately place your knee(s) against the top tube...it will

subside. Also, the reason why your bike wobbles in the first place is because

the front end is too light...causing it to shimmy. Riders have a tendency

to lean back on a fast descent...the best thing to do is lean forward a

bit...putting your weight over the handlebars/front wheel in a more aero

position.</FONT></DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr

style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>

<DIV

style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>

<A title=-@huttig.com href="mailto:mad-@huttig.com">Adams, Mike</A>

</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=a-@hotmail.com

href="mailto:acar-@hotmail.com">acar-@hotmail.com</A> ; <A

title=-@fusium.com href="mailto:eri-@fusium.com">eri-@fusium.com</A> ;

<A title-@topica.com href="mailto:ob-@topica.com">ob-@topica.com</A>

</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 14, 2004 1:07

PM</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed

Wobble/Shimmy</DIV>

<DIV><BR></DIV>

<DIV><SPAN class=720380420-14072004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>The

road Erik is talking about is Laurelwood Road. Steep, straight and if you

really hammer you might hit 55+. To much fun!!!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

    <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma

    size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> Augusto C.D. Carneiro

    [mailto:acar-@hotmail.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 14, 2004 1:01

    PM<BR><B>To:</B> <A href="mailto:eri-@fusium.com">eri-@fusium.com</A>; <A

    href="mailto:ob-@topica.com">ob-@topica.com</A><BR><B>Subject:</B> RE:

    [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>

    <DIV>

    <DIV class=RTE>

    <P>The key in Erik's message is: "keep your arms and shoulders

    relaxed"</P>

    <P>My worst wobbles were last year at a race in the Manchester

    velodrome.  I Got sandwiched by two riders and my reaction (besides

    trying to backpedal) was to grip the handlebars tighly. As the wobbles

    started, I freaked out and gripped the handlebars even tighter, which made

    the wobbles way worse, until I slowed down enough. I immediatly

    thought for sure there was something wrong with my bike, but one of the

    coaches told me it was from the death grip I applied on the

    Handlebars.<BR><BR></P></DIV>

    <DIV></DIV>>From: Erik Voldengen <eri-@fusium.com>

    <DIV></DIV>>Reply-To: eri-@fusium.com

    <DIV></DIV>>To: ob-@topica.com

    <DIV></DIV>>Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy

    <DIV></DIV>>Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2004 10:18:56 -0700

    <DIV></DIV>>

    <DIV></DIV>>It's completely possible some of the people in that CCC stage

    have never

    <DIV></DIV>>decended so fast before.  It's very hard to come by

    such a huge decent.

    <DIV></DIV>>

    <DIV></DIV>>Anyone in the PDX area that hasn't done it yet, I'd suggest

    going down Bald

    <DIV></DIV>>Peak.  I forget the name of the road, but it ends

    right at that store at the

    <DIV></DIV>>bottom of the hill.  You can't miss it -- it's

    completely straight, insanely

    <DIV></DIV>>steep, and you will go faster than you've ever gone

    before.  It's well worth

    <DIV></DIV>>riding for the experience.  Keep your arms and

    shoulders relaxed.  Be

    <DIV></DIV>>careful, it's almost like a roller coaster ride.

    <DIV></DIV>>

    <DIV></DIV>>I wish everyone a speedy recovery from the

    crash.  Hope this message helps

    <DIV></DIV>>at least one person.

    <DIV></DIV>>

    <DIV></DIV>>-Erik

    <DIV></DIV>>

    <DIV></DIV>>To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

    <DIV></DIV>>To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

    <DIV></DIV>>To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com

    <DIV></DIV>>

    <DIV></DIV>>

    <DIV></DIV></DIV><BR clear=all>

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Adams, Mike

2004-07-14



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The road Erik is talking about is Laurelwood Road. Steep, straight and if you really hammer you might hit 55+. To much fun!!!



-----Original Message-----

From: Augusto C.D. Carneiro [mailto:acar-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 1:01 PM

To: eri-@fusium.com; ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy







The key in Erik's message is: "keep your arms and shoulders relaxed"



My worst wobbles were last year at a race in the Manchester velodrome. I Got sandwiched by two riders and my reaction (besides trying to backpedal) was to grip the handlebars tighly. As the wobbles started, I freaked out and gripped the handlebars even tighter, which made the wobbles way worse, until I slowed down enough. I immediatly thought for sure there was something wrong with my bike, but one of the coaches told me it was from the death grip I applied on the Handlebars.







 From: Erik Voldengen <eri-@fusium.com>

Reply-To: eri-@fusium.com

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2004 10:18:56 -0700



It's completely possible some of the people in that CCC stage have never

decended so fast before. It's very hard to come by such a huge decent.



Anyone in the PDX area that hasn't done it yet, I'd suggest going down Bald

Peak. I forget the name of the road, but it ends right at that store at the

bottom of the hill. You can't miss it -- it's completely straight, insanely

steep, and you will go faster than you've ever gone before. It's well worth

riding for the experience. Keep your arms and shoulders relaxed. Be

careful, it's almost like a roller coaster ride.



I wish everyone a speedy recovery from the crash. Hope this message helps

at least one person.



-Erik



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<DIV><SPAN class=720380420-14072004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>The

road Erik is talking about is Laurelwood Road. Steep, straight and if you really

hammer you might hit 55+. To much fun!!!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma

size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> Augusto C.D. Carneiro

[mailto:acar-@hotmail.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 14, 2004 1:01

PM<BR><B>To:</B> eri-@fusium.com; ob-@topica.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE:

[OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>

<DIV>

<DIV class=RTE>

<P>The key in Erik's message is: "keep your arms and shoulders

relaxed"</P>

<P>My worst wobbles were last year at a race in the Manchester

velodrome.  I Got sandwiched by two riders and my reaction (besides

trying to backpedal) was to grip the handlebars tighly. As the wobbles

started, I freaked out and gripped the handlebars even tighter, which made the

wobbles way worse, until I slowed down enough. I immediatly thought

for sure there was something wrong with my bike, but one of the coaches told

me it was from the death grip I applied on the Handlebars.<BR><BR></P></DIV>

<DIV></DIV>>From: Erik Voldengen <eri-@fusium.com>

<DIV></DIV>>Reply-To: eri-@fusium.com

<DIV></DIV>>To: ob-@topica.com

<DIV></DIV>>Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy

<DIV></DIV>>Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2004 10:18:56 -0700

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>It's completely possible some of the people in that CCC stage

have never

<DIV></DIV>>decended so fast before.  It's very hard to come by

such a huge decent.

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>Anyone in the PDX area that hasn't done it yet, I'd suggest

going down Bald

<DIV></DIV>>Peak.  I forget the name of the road, but it ends

right at that store at the

<DIV></DIV>>bottom of the hill.  You can't miss it -- it's

completely straight, insanely

<DIV></DIV>>steep, and you will go faster than you've ever gone

before.  It's well worth

<DIV></DIV>>riding for the experience.  Keep your arms and

shoulders relaxed.  Be

<DIV></DIV>>careful, it's almost like a roller coaster ride.

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>I wish everyone a speedy recovery from the

crash.  Hope this message helps

<DIV></DIV>>at least one person.

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>-Erik

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

<DIV></DIV>>To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

<DIV></DIV>>To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV></DIV><BR clear=all>

<HR>

MSN Messenger: converse com os seus amigos online. <A

href="http://g.msn.com/8HMABRBR/2749??PS=47575">Instale gr?tis. Clique aqui.

</A><PRE>To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>



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Augusto C.D. Carneiro

2004-07-14



<html><div style='background-color:'><DIV class=RTE>

<P>The key in Erik's message is: "keep your arms and shoulders relaxed"</P>

<P>My worst wobbles were last year at a race in the Manchester velodrome.  I Got sandwiched by two riders and my reaction (besides trying to backpedal) was to grip the handlebars tighly. As the wobbles started, I freaked out and gripped the handlebars even tighter, which made the wobbles way worse, until I slowed down enough. I immediatly thought for sure there was something wrong with my bike, but one of the coaches told me it was from the death grip I applied on the Handlebars.<BR><BR></P></DIV>

<DIV></DIV>>From: Erik Voldengen <eri-@fusium.com>

<DIV></DIV>>Reply-To: eri-@fusium.com

<DIV></DIV>>To: ob-@topica.com

<DIV></DIV>>Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] High Speed Wobble/Shimmy

<DIV></DIV>>Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2004 10:18:56 -0700

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>It's completely possible some of the people in that CCC stage have never

<DIV></DIV>>decended so fast before.  It's very hard to come by such a huge decent.

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>Anyone in the PDX area that hasn't done it yet, I'd suggest going down Bald

<DIV></DIV>>Peak.  I forget the name of the road, but it ends right at that store at the

<DIV></DIV>>bottom of the hill.  You can't miss it -- it's completely straight, insanely

<DIV></DIV>>steep, and you will go faster than you've ever gone before.  It's well worth

<DIV></DIV>>riding for the experience.  Keep your arms and shoulders relaxed.  Be

<DIV></DIV>>careful, it's almost like a roller coaster ride.

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>I wish everyone a speedy recovery from the crash.  Hope this message helps

<DIV></DIV>>at least one person.

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>-Erik

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

<DIV></DIV>>To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

<DIV></DIV>>To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV></div><br clear=all><hr>MSN Messenger: converse com os seus amigos online. <a href="http://g.msn.com/8HMABRBR/2749??PS=47575">Instale gr?tis. Clique aqui. </a> </html>



eri-@fusium.com

2004-07-14



It's completely possible some of the people in that CCC stage have never

decended so fast before. It's very hard to come by such a huge decent.



Anyone in the PDX area that hasn't done it yet, I'd suggest going down Bald

Peak. I forget the name of the road, but it ends right at that store at the

bottom of the hill. You can't miss it -- it's completely straight, insanely

steep, and you will go faster than you've ever gone before. It's well worth

riding for the experience. Keep your arms and shoulders relaxed. Be

careful, it's almost like a roller coaster ride.



I wish everyone a speedy recovery from the crash. Hope this message helps

at least one person.



-Erik



Seth May

2004-07-14



There's a good discussion of this issue at Bike Forums:

http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/index.php/t-54327



I've also read a number of things from Zinn's Q&A articles on Velonews.

Check out these articles for info:



http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/articles/5022.1.html

http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/articles/4283.1.html

http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/articles/2226.0.html

http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/articles/2487.0.html

http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/articles/2993.0.html

http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/articles/3108.0.html



Generally, from what I've read, bike shimmy happens for different reasons on

different bikes. There is no fix-all solution, and the only way to test for

shimmy is a high-speed decent. Fun fun.



--

Seth May



-----Original Message-----

From: Adams, Mike [mailto:mad-@huttig.com]

Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 9:16 AM

To: ste-@ocfp.com; ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] 3/4 crash - mt. bachelor stage



I have hit 60+ and have not had any problems. Check headset, wheel true, and

frame alignment. Then check your nerves so you do not get involuntary fear

shakes. Oh and a good stiff bike.

Mike



-----Original Message-----

From: Steve Getsiv [mailto:ste-@ocfp.com]

Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 8:51 AM

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] 3/4 crash - mt. bachelor stage





I am pretty sure I saw his bike after the crash and the fork was broken.



I think we could all benefit from a discussion of what can cause the

wobbles at high speed and the basics of checking your equipment

thoroughly prior to a 50mph+ descent.



- Steve Getsiv



-----Original Message-----

From: galen mittermann [mailto:gmit-@yahoo.com]

Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 8:21 AM

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: [OBRA Chat] 3/4 crash - mt. bachelor stage





i was behind the rider who went down just a couple miles into the first

stage in the 3/4 race. what i saw was that this guy's front wheel began

to shake with speed wobbles (crosswinds, loose headset, grabbing the

brakes, i dont know what caused it), as far as i could tell no contact

with any other rider was made, and he may not have been sitting down

when it happened either. i saw the wobbles behind and thought "he's

going down" and started looking for a line around him, when his wheel

went over hard and his bike launched him straight over the bars at what

looked like head height. it was without a doubt the most horrendous

thing that i have ever witnessed.







Disclaimer:

All opions expressed are my own and only my own, and do not reflect the

opions or stand of my teammates, my team's sponsors, my employer, my

relatives, my girlfreind, my former college drinking buddies, or anyone

else with whom I have ever had an association, so gripes are to be

directed at myself and only at myself.



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

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To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



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To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

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