Criterium Champion

Becky Walter

2004-08-16





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I want to congratulate everyone that was at the race, including the 69

year old guy in the 50+ race. And the guy who talked to me after

getting his butt kicked in the 30+ race that had never raced before.

And then there are all the kids who were there. Yes, I agree Nick had a

good race but so did the girl that finished 3rd in the 13 and under

race.

T

On Aug 16, 2004, at 6:55 PM, Damian wrote:



 Unless I read the email wrong all this guy did was congratulate Nick

for being the first amateur Oregon racer in the state championships (a

great result (Oregon state U. bias)).? Where was the part that he put

up a fuss that warranted another "put on your own race?"

?

I recently posed a simple question and received several responses like

this.??Maybe it's just me, but I would like this list a lot more if we

didn't stone everyone who speaks an opinion that doesn't agree with

the masses.? If it is just me then I'm sure that I'll hear about it

about 2 minutes after I?send this.

?

Congratulations again to Nick for being the first non-pro?Oregon rider

at the?state crit!

?

damian

ps The race flier?does say?"2004 Oregon Criterium Championships,"

which would eliminate?riders from other states?taking gold, silver and

bronze.?



markjgi-@yahoo.com wrote:

1. Read the rules in advance, so you know the rules under which you

are playing.

If you want to play by different rules: A. Put on your own race. B.

suggest rule changes as allowed by OBRA rules (see 1.)

?

I think both Doug and Evan were paying OBRA dues when we were still

calling it OCA.

Steve Holland is an OBRA member, so is Roger Worthington (I think) he

lives in California. The race is an OBRA championship, that is how is

was advertised, those were the rules. Deal with it.

?

Mark Ginsberg



Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn <cmur-@obra.org> wrote:

Doug and Evan have been OBRA riders since they were cat 4's . Does

their

success preclude them from competing? I think not.

Troy does live in Washington but joins every year. They are the OBRA

championships. Period.



Candi









Mark J. GinsbergAttorney At Law1001 SW 5th Ave., Ste. 1900Portland, OR

97204(503) 542-3000Fax (503) 295-3720

markjgi-@yahoo.comwww.bikesafetylaw.com



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I want to congratulate everyone that was at the race, including the 69

year old guy in the 50+ race. And the guy who talked to me after

getting his butt kicked in the 30+ race that had never raced before.

And then there are all the kids who were there. Yes, I agree Nick had

a good race but so did the girl that finished 3rd in the 13 and under

race.



T



On Aug 16, 2004, at 6:55 PM, Damian wrote:





<excerpt>Unless I read the email wrong all this guy did was

congratulate Nick for being the first amateur Oregon racer in the

state championships (a great result (Oregon state U. bias)).=A0 Where

was the part that he put up a fuss that warranted another "put on your

own race?"



=A0



I recently posed a simple question and received several responses like

this.=A0=A0Maybe it's just me, but I would like this list a lot more if =

we

didn't stone everyone who speaks an opinion that doesn't agree with

the masses.=A0 If it is just me then I'm sure that I'll hear about it

about 2 minutes after I=A0send this.



=A0



Congratulations again to Nick for being the first non-pro=A0Oregon rider

at the=A0state crit!



=A0



damian



ps The race flier=A0does say=A0"2004 Oregon Criterium Championships,"

which would eliminate=A0riders from other states=A0taking gold, silver =

and

bronze.=A0





<bold><italic>markjgi-@yahoo.com</italic></bold> wrote:



1. Read the rules in advance, so you know the rules under which you

are playing.



If you want to play by different rules: A. Put on your own race. B.

suggest rule changes as allowed by OBRA rules (see 1.)



=A0



I think both Doug and Evan were paying OBRA dues when we were still

calling it OCA.



Steve Holland is an OBRA member, so is Roger Worthington (I think) he

lives in California. The race is an OBRA championship, that is how is

was advertised, those were the rules. Deal with it.



=A0



Mark Ginsberg





<bold><italic>Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn

<<cmur-@obra.org></italic></bold> wrote:



Doug and Evan have been OBRA riders since they were cat 4's . Does

their



success preclude them from competing? I think not.



Troy does live in Washington but joins every year. They are the OBRA



championships. Period.





Candi











<italic>Mark J. GinsbergAttorney At Law1001 SW 5th Ave., Ste.

1900Portland, OR 97204(503) 542-3000Fax (503) 295-3720

=

<color><param>0000,0000,EEEE</param>markjgi-@yahoo.comwww.bikesafetyl=

aw.com</color> </italic>





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Damian

2004-08-16



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Unless I read the email wrong all this guy did was congratulate Nick for being the first amateur Oregon racer in the state championships (a great result (Oregon state U. bias)). Where was the part that he put up a fuss that warranted another "put on your own race?"



I recently posed a simple question and received several responses like this. Maybe it's just me, but I would like this list a lot more if we didn't stone everyone who speaks an opinion that doesn't agree with the masses. If it is just me then I'm sure that I'll hear about it about 2 minutes after I send this.



Congratulations again to Nick for being the first non-pro Oregon rider at the state crit!



damian

ps The race flier does say "2004 Oregon Criterium Championships," which would eliminate riders from other states taking gold, silver and bronze.



markjgi-@yahoo.com wrote:

1. Read the rules in advance, so you know the rules under which you are playing.

If you want to play by different rules: A. Put on your own race. B. suggest rule changes as allowed by OBRA rules (see 1.)



I think both Doug and Evan were paying OBRA dues when we were still calling it OCA.

Steve Holland is an OBRA member, so is Roger Worthington (I think) he lives in California. The race is an OBRA championship, that is how is was advertised, those were the rules. Deal with it.



Mark Ginsberg



Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn <cmur-@obra.org> wrote:

Doug and Evan have been OBRA riders since they were cat 4's . Does their

success preclude them from competing? I think not.

Troy does live in Washington but joins every year. They are the OBRA

championships. Period.



Candi







Mark J. GinsbergAttorney At Law1001 SW 5th Ave., Ste. 1900Portland, OR 97204(503) 542-3000Fax (503) 295-3720 markjgi-@yahoo.comwww.bikesafetylaw.com













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<DIV>Unless I read the email wrong all this guy did was congratulate Nick for being the first amateur Oregon racer in the state championships (a great result (Oregon state U. bias)).  Where was the part that he put up a fuss that warranted another "put on your own race?"</DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>I recently posed a simple question and received several responses like this.  Maybe it's just me, but I would like this list a lot more if we didn't stone everyone who speaks an opinion that doesn't agree with the masses.  If it is just me then I'm sure that I'll hear about it about 2 minutes after I send this.</DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>Congratulations again to Nick for being the first non-pro Oregon rider at the state crit!</DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>damian</DIV>

<DIV>ps The race flier does say "2004 Oregon Criterium Championships," which would eliminate riders from other states taking gold, silver and bronze.  <BR><BR><B><I>markjgi-@yahoo.com</I></B> wrote:</DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">

<DIV>1. Read the rules in advance, so you know the rules under which you are playing.</DIV>

<DIV>If you want to play by different rules: A. Put on your own race. B. suggest rule changes as allowed by OBRA rules (see 1.)</DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>I think both Doug and Evan were paying OBRA dues when we were still calling it OCA.</DIV>

<DIV>Steve Holland is an OBRA member, so is Roger Worthington (I think) he lives in California. The race is an OBRA championship, that is how is was advertised, those were the rules. Deal with it.</DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>Mark Ginsberg<BR><BR><B><I>Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn <cmur-@obra.org></I></B> wrote:</DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">Doug and Evan have been OBRA riders since they were cat 4's . Does their<BR>success preclude them from competing? I think not.<BR>Troy does live in Washington but joins every year. They are the OBRA<BR>championships. Period.<BR><BR>Candi<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<ADDRESS>Mark J. Ginsberg</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>Attorney At Law</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>1001 SW 5th Ave., Ste. 1900</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>Portland, OR 97204</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>(503) 542-3000</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>Fax (503) 295-3720 </ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS><A href="mailto:markjgi-@yahoo.com">markjgi-@yahoo.com</A></ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS><A href="http://www.bikesafetylaw.com/">www.bikesafetylaw.com</A> </ADDRESS></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV>

<P>

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markjgi-@yahoo.com

2004-08-16



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1. Read the rules in advance, so you know the rules under which you are playing.

If you want to play by different rules: A. Put on your own race. B. suggest rule changes as allowed by OBRA rules (see 1.)



I think both Doug and Evan were paying OBRA dues when we were still calling it OCA.

Steve Holland is an OBRA member, so is Roger Worthington (I think) he lives in California. The race is an OBRA championship, that is how is was advertised, those were the rules. Deal with it.



Mark Ginsberg



Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn <cmur-@obra.org> wrote:

Doug and Evan have been OBRA riders since they were cat 4's . Does their

success preclude them from competing? I think not.

Troy does live in Washington but joins every year. They are the OBRA

championships. Period.



Candi







Mark J. GinsbergAttorney At Law1001 SW 5th Ave., Ste. 1900Portland, OR 97204(503) 542-3000Fax (503) 295-3720 markjgi-@yahoo.comwww.bikesafetylaw.com













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<DIV>1. Read the rules in advance, so you know the rules under which you are playing.</DIV>

<DIV>If you want to play by different rules: A. Put on your own race. B. suggest rule changes as allowed by OBRA rules (see 1.)</DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>I think both Doug and Evan were paying OBRA dues when we were still calling it OCA.</DIV>

<DIV>Steve Holland is an OBRA member, so is Roger Worthington (I think) he lives in California. The race is an OBRA championship, that is how is was advertised, those were the rules. Deal with it.</DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>Mark Ginsberg<BR><BR><B><I>Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn <cmur-@obra.org></I></B> wrote:</DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">Doug and Evan have been OBRA riders since they were cat 4's . Does their<BR>success preclude them from competing? I think not.<BR>Troy does live in Washington but joins every year. They are the OBRA<BR>championships. Period.<BR><BR>Candi<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><DIV>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<ADDRESS>Mark J. Ginsberg</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>Attorney At Law</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>1001 SW 5th Ave., Ste. 1900</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>Portland, OR 97204</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>(503) 542-3000</ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS>Fax (503) 295-3720 </ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS><A href="mailto:markjgi-@yahoo.com">markjgi-@yahoo.com</A></ADDRESS>

<ADDRESS><A href="http://www.bikesafetylaw.com">www.bikesafetylaw.com</A> </ADDRESS></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV><p>

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Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn

2004-08-16



Doug and Evan have been OBRA riders since they were cat 4's . Does their

success preclude them from competing? I think not.

Troy does live in Washington but joins every year. They are the OBRA

championships. Period.



Candi







-----Original Message-----

From: Ron Frerichs [mailto:ronfre-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Monday, August 16, 2004 4:04 PM

To: cmur-@obra.org; gsza-@hotmail.com; ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion





I know it is currently open to all-comers with annual OBRA cards. My point

of sending this out was: Should it be Oregon-amateurs only? Is that even

possible? Steve Holland is as much of an Oregon racer as anyone, eventhough

he lives on the other side of the river.





From: Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn <cmur-@obra.org>

Reply-To: cmur-@obra.org

To: gsza-@hotmail.com, obra <ob-@topica.com>

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion

Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 15:20:50 -0700



It was never called the Oregon Amateur Championships!

Candi







-----Original Message-----

From: mark duff [mailto:gsza-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Monday, August 16, 2004 2:19 PM

To: ronfre-@hotmail.com; ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion





Since when was it called the Oregon State AMATEUR Criterium

championships???????





 From: Ron Frerichs <ronfre-@hotmail.com>

Reply-To: ronfre-@hotmail.com

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion

Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 13:41:21 -0700



1   Elken, Evan                            Jittery Joes

PRO

2   Ollerenshaw, Doug                  Jelly Belly

PRO

3   Critchlow, Troy                       Nella-Madison

WA

4   Nikolz, Chad                            Benaroya Research           WA



 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

---------------------------------

 5   Skenzick, Nick                         Hutch's

Oregon Amateur



Congratulations Nick Skenzick...the AMATEUR OREGON Criterium Champion !



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



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To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



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Ron Frerichs

2004-08-16



I know it is currently open to all-comers with annual OBRA cards. My point

of sending this out was: Should it be Oregon-amateurs only? Is that even

possible? Steve Holland is as much of an Oregon racer as anyone, eventhough

he lives on the other side of the river.





From: Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn <cmur-@obra.org>

Reply-To: cmur-@obra.org

To: gsza-@hotmail.com, obra <ob-@topica.com>

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion

Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 15:20:50 -0700



It was never called the Oregon Amateur Championships!

Candi







-----Original Message-----

From: mark duff [mailto:gsza-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Monday, August 16, 2004 2:19 PM

To: ronfre-@hotmail.com; ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion





Since when was it called the Oregon State AMATEUR Criterium

championships???????





 From: Ron Frerichs <ronfre-@hotmail.com>

Reply-To: ronfre-@hotmail.com

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion

Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 13:41:21 -0700



1   Elken, Evan                            Jittery Joes

PRO

2   Ollerenshaw, Doug                  Jelly Belly

PRO

3   Critchlow, Troy                       Nella-Madison

WA

4   Nikolz, Chad                            Benaroya Research           WA

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

---------------------------------

 5   Skenzick, Nick                         Hutch's

Oregon Amateur



Congratulations Nick Skenzick...the AMATEUR OREGON Criterium Champion !



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



_________________________________________________________________

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To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



Candi Murray/Oregon Bicycle Racing Assn

2004-08-16



It was never called the Oregon Amateur Championships!

Candi







-----Original Message-----

From: mark duff [mailto:gsza-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Monday, August 16, 2004 2:19 PM

To: ronfre-@hotmail.com; ob-@topica.com

Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion





Since when was it called the Oregon State AMATEUR Criterium

championships???????





 From: Ron Frerichs <ronfre-@hotmail.com>

Reply-To: ronfre-@hotmail.com

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion

Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 13:41:21 -0700



1   Elken, Evan                            Jittery Joes

PRO

2   Ollerenshaw, Doug                  Jelly Belly

PRO

3   Critchlow, Troy                       Nella-Madison

WA

4   Nikolz, Chad                            Benaroya Research           WA

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

---------------------------------

 5   Skenzick, Nick                         Hutch's

Oregon Amateur



Congratulations Nick Skenzick...the AMATEUR OREGON Criterium Champion !



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



_________________________________________________________________

Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!

hthttp://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



mark duff

2004-08-16



Since when was it called the Oregon State AMATEUR Criterium

championships???????





 From: Ron Frerichs <ronfre-@hotmail.com>

Reply-To: ronfre-@hotmail.com

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Criterium Champion

Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 13:41:21 -0700



1   Elken, Evan                            Jittery Joes                     

PRO

2   Ollerenshaw, Doug                  Jelly Belly                        

PRO

3   Critchlow, Troy                       Nella-Madison                   

WA

4   Nikolz, Chad                            Benaroya Research           WA

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

5   Skenzick, Nick                         Hutch's                          

Oregon Amateur



Congratulations Nick Skenzick...the AMATEUR OREGON Criterium Champion !



To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.

To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org

To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com



_________________________________________________________________

Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!

hthttp://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/



Ron Frerichs

2004-08-16



1   Elken, Evan                            Jittery Joes                     

PRO

2   Ollerenshaw, Doug                  Jelly Belly                        

PRO

3   Critchlow, Troy                       Nella-Madison                   WA

4   Nikolz, Chad                            Benaroya Research           WA

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

5   Skenzick, Nick                         Hutch's                          

Oregon Amateur



Congratulations Nick Skenzick...the AMATEUR OREGON Criterium Champion !