Michael Hilbrandt

I can say that some of those bikes are stolen. Ask J. Creem about his Merlin

sometime. Stolen off U of M (Mich) campus, carried to Chicago and put up for

sale. Fortunately, someone was watching and gave him a heads-up. Police

nabbed the guy and months later, the bike was Josh's again.

Mike



 From: jakebigham <jakeb-@mac.com>

Reply-To: jakeb-@mac.com

To: news4-@gmail.com

CC: JTy-@onsitefinancial.com, OBRA <ob-@topica.com>

Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Bike thieves (LP)

Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2005 17:41:58 -0700



Joel- Having browsed ebay bikes before I really do not get the impression

that many (if any) are stolen, wouldn't the seller be taking a big risk?

Usually they have sold/bought other things before and sell/buy other

things after. If they were selling stolen goods I can imagine ebay would

cooperate in finding them. -Jake

On Oct 24, 2005, at 4:02 PM, Joel Morrissette wrote:



 On 10/24/05, Joe Tysoe <JTy-@onsitefinancial.com> wrote:

So.... where do the cracked-out freaks unload the bikes at??





I'd *love* to know where all these bikes are going. The crankheads have

to be unloading them (and quickly) to get the cash to support their

habit. It's not going to be on ebay or Craigslist (at least initially),

so I suppose there must be a black market street trade in high-end stolen

component s. Eventually, the trafficked parts must end up on eBay after

being resold a couple times. If I thought my Dura-Ace gruppo was going

to come up on eBay or Craigslist, I don't know that I'd bother with other

locales than the immediate neighborhood. Good luck finding it in Peoria.



I see the bike theft problem as having two parts. First, there are the

crankhead bike thieves cutting u-locks in broad daylight on the street.

But these guys wouldn't be able to get away with this if passers-by

started to notice. I have a hard time believing the bike theft at

Chunkathon (see http://bikeportland.org/2005/09/08/

bike-stolen-at-chunkathalon) went unwitnessed. Is there a need to

educate the public at large that bike theft is an increasingly common

street crime? Not the riding public - we're generally locking up and

doing the right things, I think - but everyone else who might see this

thing going on. Criminals get away with crimes in part because they are

under the radar - be it cover of darkness, large crowds or whatnot. As

soon as the risk is too high, they move on to other less-risky ventures.



Perhaps the areas to consider are this:

1) Rather than try and catch the thieves, let's reduce the demand for

their "services". Where are the parts going? If it's off to eBay

through bike chop-shops, let's get the PD to investigate this and try to

break it up. (They probably already are, I'd imagine).



2) Raise awareness in the general public that this is going on.   Get the

word out about how bike thieves are operating, how to recognize their

behavior, and how to report incidents to authorities. Perhaps info like

the "how to spot a meth house" but instead "how to spot a bike chop

shop". We don't even need to be reporting incidents - thieves just need

to *think* they are being reported. Build a culture where thieves think

they are being watched.



3) Tighten up the second-hand stores laws. Let's get to work with the

powers that be in Portland and Salem to get the needed changes taken care

of.



4) Take a look at other cities and towns that a lower/lowered bike theft

rate and get their input on this. Let's model our policies and practices

after something that's proven to work.



I think it goes without saying that if we're going to make Portland a

Platinum City for bikes, then we really need to get this under wraps.



Tawk amongst yuhselves.

-Joel



--

      __o "It never gets easier,

    _ \<_   you just go faster."

   (_)/(_)       -- Greg LeMond

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Joel- Having browsed ebay bikes before I really do not get the

impression that many (if any) are stolen, wouldn't the seller be

taking a big risk? Usually they have sold/bought other things before

and sell/buy other things after. If they were selling stolen goods I

can imagine ebay would cooperate in finding them. -Jake

On Oct 24, 2005, at 4:02 PM, Joel Morrissette wrote:



 On 10/24/05, Joe Tysoe <JTy-@onsitefinancial.com> wrote:

So.... where do the cracked-out freaks unload the bikes at??





I'd *love* to know where all these bikes are going. The crankheads

have to be unloading them (and quickly) to get the cash to support

their habit. It's not going to be on ebay or Craigslist (at least

initially), so I suppose there must be a black market street trade

in high-end stolen component s. Eventually, the trafficked parts

must end up on eBay after being resold a couple times. If I

thought my Dura-Ace gruppo was going to come up on eBay or

Craigslist, I don't know that I'd bother with other locales than

the immediate neighborhood. Good luck finding it in Peoria.



I see the bike theft problem as having two parts. First, there are

the crankhead bike thieves cutting u-locks in broad daylight on the

street. But these guys wouldn't be able to get away with this if

passers-by started to notice. I have a hard time believing the

bike theft at Chunkathon (see http://bikeportland.org/2005/09/08/

bike-stolen-at-chunkathalon) went unwitnessed. Is there a need to

educate the public at large that bike theft is an increasingly

common street crime? Not the riding public - we're generally

locking up and doing the right things, I think - but everyone else

who might see this thing going on. Criminals get away with crimes

in part because they are under the radar - be it cover of darkness,

large crowds or whatnot. As soon as the risk is too high, they

move on to other less-risky ventures.



Perhaps the areas to consider are this:

1) Rather than try and catch the thieves, let's reduce the demand

for their "services". Where are the parts going? If it's off to

eBay through bike chop-shops, let's get the PD to investigate this

and try to break it up. (They probably already are, I'd imagine).



2) Raise awareness in the general public that this is going on.   

Get the word out about how bike thieves are operating, how to

recognize their behavior, and how to report incidents to

authorities. Perhaps info like the "how to spot a meth house" but

instead "how to spot a bike chop shop". We don't even need to be

reporting incidents - thieves just need to *think* they are being

reported. Build a culture where thieves think they are being watched.



3) Tighten up the second-hand stores laws. Let's get to work with

the powers that be in Portland and Salem to get the needed changes

taken care of.



4) Take a look at other cities and towns that a lower/lowered bike

theft rate and get their input on this. Let's model our policies

and practices after something that's proven to work.



I think it goes without saying that if we're going to make Portland

a Platinum City for bikes, then we really need to get this under

wraps.



Tawk amongst yuhselves.

-Joel



--

      __o "It never gets easier,

    _ \<_   you just go faster."

   (_)/(_)       -- Greg LeMond

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charset=ISO-8859-1



<HTML><BODY style="word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space; ">Joel- Having browsed ebay bikes before I really do not get the impression that many (if any) are stolen, wouldn't the seller be taking a big risk? Usually they have sold/bought other things before and sell/buy other things after. If they were selling stolen goods I can imagine ebay would cooperate in finding them. -Jake<BR><DIV><DIV>On Oct 24, 2005, at 4:02 PM, Joel Morrissette wrote:</DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV><SPAN class="gmail_quote">On 10/24/05, <B class="gmail_sendername">Joe Tysoe</B> <<A href="mailto:JTy-@onsitefinancial.com">JTy-@onsitefinancial.com</A>> wrote:</SPAN><BLOCKQUOTE class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> <DIV align="left" dir="ltr"><FONT color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"><SPAN>So.... where do the cracked-out freaks unload the bikes at??<BR><BR></SPAN></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV> <BR> I'd *love* to know where all these bikes are going.? The crankheads have to be unloading them (and quickly) to get the cash to support their habit.? It's not going to be on ebay or Craigslist (at least initially), so I suppose there must be a black market street trade in high-end stolen component s.? Eventually, the trafficked parts must end up on eBay after being resold a couple times.? If I thought my Dura-Ace gruppo was going to come up on eBay or Craigslist, I don't know that I'd bother with other locales than the immediate neighborhood.? Good luck finding it in Peoria.<BR> <BR> I see the bike theft problem as having two parts.? First, there are the crankhead bike thieves cutting u-locks in broad daylight on the street.? But these guys wouldn't be able to get away with this if passers-by started to notice.? I have a hard time believing the bike theft at Chunkathon (see <A href="http://bikeportland.org/2005/09/08/bike-stolen-at-chunkathalon">http://bikeportland.org/2005/09/08/bike-stolen-at-chunkathalon</A>) went unwitnessed.? Is there a need to educate the public at large that bike theft is an increasingly common street crime?? Not the riding public - we're generally locking up and doing the right things, I think - but everyone else who might see this thing going on.? Criminals get away with crimes in part because they are under the radar - be it cover of darkness, large crowds or whatnot.? As soon as the risk is too high, they move on to other less-risky ventures.? <BR> <BR> Perhaps the areas to consider are this:<BR> 1)? Rather than try and catch the thieves, let's reduce the demand for their "services".? Where are the parts going?? If it's off to eBay through bike chop-shops, let's get the PD to investigate this and try to break it up.? (They probably already are, I'd imagine).? <BR> <BR> 2)? Raise awareness in the general public that this is going on.? Get the word out about how bike thieves are operating, how to recognize their behavior, and how to report incidents to authorities.? Perhaps info like the "how to spot a meth house" but instead "how to spot a bike chop shop".? We don't even need to be reporting incidents - thieves just need to *think* they are being reported.? Build a culture where thieves think they are being watched.<BR> <BR> 3)? Tighten up the second-hand stores laws.? Let's get to work with the powers that be in Portland and Salem to get the needed changes taken care of. <BR> <BR> 4)? Take a look at other cities and towns that a lower/lowered bike theft rate and get their input on this.? Let's model our policies and practices after something that's proven to work.<BR> <BR> I think it goes without saying that if we're going to make Portland a Platinum City for bikes, then we really need to get this under wraps.? <BR> <BR> Tawk amongst yuhselves.<BR> -Joel<BR> <BR>-- <BR>???? __o??"It never gets easier, <BR>?? _ \<_?? you just go faster." <BR>??(_)/(_)?????? -- Greg LeMond</BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></BODY></HTML>

--Apple-Mail-5--577620576--

Jonathan Maus

Great suggestions, Joel.



I've been thinking a lot about the theft issue. It's definitely getting a lot worse. I've heard some pretty brazen cases lately. Someone had a bike stolen while they slept just a few feet away, another guy had the entire rack taken with his bike downtown!, and of course the guy at Chunkathalon where they cut his ulock in broad daylight.



I'm sure a lot of the stolen bikes are being carted off to another city, but plenty of them are sticking around locally. The problem is awareness. If we just had more people checking stolen bike listings I think we could really put a damper on this. I started listing bikes on my site because I realized I have hundreds of local cyclists checking it every day. The next step is to go and get all the bike shops to be checking it. I'm going to revamp the listings a bit so it's easy for shops to get an email whenever a new bike is listed.



I'm a real believer in the power of the community and I think if we can get enough people listing and reviewing stolen bikes we can start to recover more of them. So far, my listings have already helped 2 people recover their bikes (although one of them has since been re-stolen!).



I know my listings aren't the be all, end all solution, but they're quick, cheap and they're available right now. I to make them better as time and resources allow, but for now I just want to encourage everyone to list their bikes and tell their friends to view the listings before they buy one.



Thanks.

--Jonathan

Stolen Bike Listings - Free, easy, local

http://bikeportland.org/stolenbikes



--------------------------

BikePortland.org

Local bike news, events, culture and opinion

http://bikeportland.org

(503) 283-8855

cell (503) 706-8804

Subscribe via email:

http://bikeportland.org/subscribe.php





----- Original Message -----

From: Joel Morrissette

To: JTy-@onsitefinancial.com

Cc: OBRA

Sent: Monday, October 24, 2005 4:02 PM

Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Bike thieves (LP)





On 10/24/05, Joe Tysoe <JTy-@onsitefinancial.com> wrote:

    So.... where do the cracked-out freaks unload the bikes at??







I'd *love* to know where all these bikes are going. The crankheads have to be unloading them (and quickly) to get the cash to support their habit. It's not going to be on ebay or Craigslist (at least initially), so I suppose there must be a black market street trade in high-end stolen component s. Eventually, the trafficked parts must end up on eBay after being resold a couple times. If I thought my Dura-Ace gruppo was going to come up on eBay or Craigslist, I don't know that I'd bother with other locales than the immediate neighborhood. Good luck finding it in Peoria.



I see the bike theft problem as having two parts. First, there are the crankhead bike thieves cutting u-locks in broad daylight on the street. But these guys wouldn't be able to get away with this if passers-by started to notice. I have a hard time believing the bike theft at Chunkathon (see http://bikeportland.org/2005/09/08/bike-stolen-at-chunkathalon) went unwitnessed. Is there a need to educate the public at large that bike theft is an increasingly common street crime? Not the riding public - we're generally locking up and doing the right things, I think - but everyone else who might see this thing going on. Criminals get away with crimes in part because they are under the radar - be it cover of darkness, large crowds or whatnot. As soon as the risk is too high, they move on to other less-risky ventures.



Perhaps the areas to consider are this:

1) Rather than try and catch the thieves, let's reduce the demand for their "services". Where are the parts going? If it's off to eBay through bike chop-shops, let's get the PD to investigate this and try to break it up. (They probably already are, I'd imagine).



2) Raise awareness in the general public that this is going on. Get the word out about how bike thieves are operating, how to recognize their behavior, and how to report incidents to authorities. Perhaps info like the "how to spot a meth house" but instead "how to spot a bike chop shop". We don't even need to be reporting incidents - thieves just need to *think* they are being reported. Build a culture where thieves think they are being watched.



3) Tighten up the second-hand stores laws. Let's get to work with the powers that be in Portland and Salem to get the needed changes taken care of.



4) Take a look at other cities and towns that a lower/lowered bike theft rate and get their input on this. Let's model our policies and practices after something that's proven to work.



I think it goes without saying that if we're going to make Portland a Platinum City for bikes, then we really need to get this under wraps.



Tawk amongst yuhselves.

-Joel



--

       __o "It never gets easier,

     _ \<_   you just go faster."

    (_)/(_)       -- Greg LeMond

Joel Morrissette

On 10/24/05, Joe Tysoe <JTy-@onsitefinancial.com> wrote:

 

So.... where do the cracked-out freaks unload the bikes at??

I'd *love* to know where all these bikes are going. The crankheads have to

be unloading them (and quickly) to get the cash to support their habit. It's

not going to be on ebay or Craigslist (at least initially), so I suppose

there must be a black market street trade in high-end stolen component s.

Eventually, the trafficked parts must end up on eBay after being resold a

couple times. If I thought my Dura-Ace gruppo was going to come up on eBay

or Craigslist, I don't know that I'd bother with other locales than the

immediate neighborhood. Good luck finding it in Peoria.



I see the bike theft problem as having two parts. First, there are the

crankhead bike thieves cutting u-locks in broad daylight on the street. But

these guys wouldn't be able to get away with this if passers-by started to

notice. I have a hard time believing the bike theft at Chunkathon (see

http://bikeportland.org/2005/09/08/bike-stolen-at-chunkathalon) went

unwitnessed. Is there a need to educate the public at large that bike theft

is an increasingly common street crime? Not the riding public - we're

generally locking up and doing the right things, I think - but everyone else

who might see this thing going on. Criminals get away with crimes in part

because they are under the radar - be it cover of darkness, large crowds or

whatnot. As soon as the risk is too high, they move on to other less-risky

ventures.



Perhaps the areas to consider are this:

1) Rather than try and catch the thieves, let's reduce the demand for their

"services". Where are the parts going? If it's off to eBay through bike

chop-shops, let's get the PD to investigate this and try to break it up.

(They probably already are, I'd imagine).



2) Raise awareness in the general public that this is going on. Get the word

out about how bike thieves are operating, how to recognize their behavior,

and how to report incidents to authorities. Perhaps info like the "how to

spot a meth house" but instead "how to spot a bike chop shop". We don't even

need to be reporting incidents - thieves just need to *think* they are being

reported. Build a culture where thieves think they are being watched.



3) Tighten up the second-hand stores laws. Let's get to work with the powers

that be in Portland and Salem to get the needed changes taken care of.



4) Take a look at other cities and towns that a lower/lowered bike theft

rate and get their input on this. Let's model our policies and practices

after something that's proven to work.



I think it goes without saying that if we're going to make Portland a

Platinum City for bikes, then we really need to get this under wraps.



Tawk amongst yuhselves.

-Joel



--

__o "It never gets easier,

_ \<_ you just go faster."

(_)/(_) -- Greg LeMond