FW: USAC JR Talent Search

Mike Murray

2007-03-23

They could actually make money on the deal by certifying specific equipment
for use in Junior or beginner races, a la NJS, and charging the manufacturer
for that certification.

Mike Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Dan H
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 21:36 PM
To: Erik Long; cmurray@obra.org; obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search

Eric,
Checked the price of a high end BMX bike?
How about identical bikes like in some forms of auto racing or like the
Little 500 Roadmasters? Trek is so huge now they could make a stock junior
bike. Everybody would have the same tires and everything. A component
manufacturer would have to be on board so the same stuff would be available
year after year. Wouldn't it be nice to have interchangeable stock parts?
Hello, bike shop? I need a stock junior rim and spoke set.
The only negative I can think of is being forced to buy your race bike from
only Trek or whoever.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Erik Long"
To: ;
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 9:02 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search

> USAC needs to pull all the stops and get thier hands on Simon Cowell,
> Lance
> Armstrong, and Connie Carpenter for their own reality show. I'm sure that
> "American Cyclist" could be a huge success for the VS. network.
>
> Or they could just make the sport more affordable for Johnny
> Highschooler
> by
> enforcing a weight limit on race bikes, making it a possibility to be
> competitive on an entry-level road bike. More Moms and Dads might be
> willing to let their kids compete in a sport that requires equipment
> expenses on par with say, BMX racing.
>
> -Erik Long
> long-time XC/road racer,
> Industry schlub
>
> ----Original Message Follows----
> From: "Candi Murray"
> Reply-To: cmurray@obra.org
> To:
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search
> Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 21:44:20 -0700
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From: Jan Luke-Hamasaki [mailto:Luke2@ix.netcom.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:48 PM
> To: 'Casey Kerrigan'; 'David Douglas'; 'eric smith'; 'don melhado';
> cmurray@obra.org
> Cc: Patty Peoples MA; 'Lee, Andy'; Callan, Sam; O2 Paul Skilbeck;
> chuckwurster
> Subject: USAC JR Talent Search
>
>
>
> USA Cycling Talent Search, Powered by RacerMate, Extended to May 7th
>
> Nationwide Program Identifies Talented Juniors for Fast Track
> Development
>
>
>
> Good evening,
>
> I am attaching a document for your review and posting. I know that
> some of the discussion groups do not allow for attachments, so if you
> would be so kind, I would appreciate it that after you have viewed it
> you would convert and post. Please feel free to post on any LA
> website.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Track and road cycling ABRA, NCNCA, SCNCA, WSBA, Oregon, Hawaii and
> Alaska
>
>
>
>
>
> Jan Luke-Hamasaki
> USAC Pacific Regional Coordinator
>
> USA Cycling
> P.O. Box 231910
> Encinitas,Ca 92023
>
>
> JLuke@usacycling.org
>
>
> tel:
>
>
> mail=j
> luke@usacycling.org> 760-525-8557
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Add me to your address book...
>
> Want a signature like this?
>
>
>
> << image001.gif >>
>
>
> << 2007-03-21-USAC-NTS-ExtendFINAL(2)Release.doc >>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Watch free concerts with Pink, Rod Stewart, Oasis and more. Visit MSN
> Presents today.
> http://music.msn.com/presents?icid=ncmsnpresentstagline&ocid=T002MSN03
> A07001
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>

_______________________________________________
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Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org


But the equipment for bicycle racing is quite inexpensive... Bicycles and bicycle frames and components aren't like car or motorcycles...
Frames don't wear out. Some stuff does of course, like rims and tires and chains and cogs, handlebar tape brake shoes.. But anyone should be able to set up a great racing bicycle for a Junior for 300 to 400 easy, if not less. If you or the kid does the wrenching of course, it does take some time... Old bicycles, used steel or aluminum racing frames are a dime a dozen, and they still work great and will continue to work great. Even a new frame, coming from companies like soma or surly, etc are inexpensive and more than adequate for racing. Great working parts can be had for next to nothing if you know where to look (city bikes... cl, ebay.. ) The performance difference of a 23 or 24 lb bicycle versus a 17 lb carbon wonder is insignificant in a road race. It just doesn't matter. Obviously if the kid were on a schwinn varisity with gumwall tires and brake rub then it would matter. And then what happens when you crash on your expensive machine and holy crap, there
went $1000 ! To each his own, but i'll be damned if I race a road race, especially with cat 4 or 3s or masters on too expensive of stuff, i like to race, not be worried about or feel bad when i go down and break the expensive stuff, or worse yet, the non-durable expensive lightweight stuff breaks and then my body get broken and then i really feel bad.

The one issue is all the idiots telling the Kid wow you would be a lot faster if you had such and such bike. What a load of crap. It's not true. Telling a kid this with the authority of an adult or supposed expertise of bicycle connoisseur can create a mental disadvantage, BUT turned around and by doing away with some of this ignorance, it can create a nice mental and psychological advantage in a race situation. Finally, when and if the Kid gets strong enough, some team or sponsor will give him a bicycle to ride so that he isn't seen, with his crappy 'looking' bicycle handing your ass to you (on a $4000 machine that you bought from the sponsor...)

As far as time trials. Ok. The best thing is to get a good position with aerobars (dime a dozen too). But good aero wheels are nice and an aero helmet too. When i was junior though I could simply borrow from or from people in my bicycle club.

So I guess I am saying doing equipment limitation is for all practical purposes, a non issue. When it come to bicycles, the law of diminishing returns, rules.

John

Erik Long wrote: Dan, the point I was making was that some form of limitiation on equipment
would likely keep an advantage of wealth from becoming an advantage in
performance. As for identical bikes, it works for the Keirin riders in
Japan . . .

And I'm well aware of high-end BMX pricing. Still, $800 gets a pretty
top-notch BMX race bike, as opposed to $3-4K for a 17lb-ish road bike, maybe
you can find a deal at $1900, if you're lucky. If we can bring the overall
startup cost down to within $1000, we'll see junior numbers closer to what
we saw in the late 70's, when a viable race bike was easier to obtain.

It just seems silly for USAC (or anybody, for that matter) to expect new
young stars to rise up in the sport when the cost to join is five times the
cost of a Sony Playstation.

Let the Juniors race free, if that's what it takes. Presently, we're losing
all the real talent to video games, fast food, and YouTube. Cheap, easy,
waste-of-time kind of stuff. We have to make starting easy. As easy as
possible.

----Original Message Follows----
From: "Dan H"
To: "Erik Long"
,,
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search
Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2007 21:35:35 -0700

Eric,
Checked the price of a high end BMX bike?
How about identical bikes like in some forms of auto racing or like the
Little 500 Roadmasters? Trek is so huge now they could make a stock junior
bike. Everybody would have the same tires and everything. A component
manufacturer would have to be on board so the same stuff would be available
year after year. Wouldn't it be nice to have interchangeable stock parts?
Hello, bike shop? I need a stock junior rim and spoke set.
The only negative I can think of is being forced to buy your race bike from
only Trek or whoever.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Erik Long"
To: ;
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 9:02 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search

>USAC needs to pull all the stops and get thier hands on Simon Cowell, Lance
>Armstrong, and Connie Carpenter for their own reality show. I'm sure that
>"American Cyclist" could be a huge success for the VS. network.
>
>Or they could just make the sport more affordable for Johnny Highschooler
>by
>enforcing a weight limit on race bikes, making it a possibility to be
>competitive on an entry-level road bike. More Moms and Dads might be
>willing to let their kids compete in a sport that requires equipment
>expenses on par with say, BMX racing.
>
>-Erik Long
>long-time XC/road racer,
>Industry schlub
>
>----Original Message Follows----
>From: "Candi Murray"
>Reply-To: cmurray@obra.org
>To:
>Subject: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search
>Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 21:44:20 -0700
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
>From: Jan Luke-Hamasaki [mailto:Luke2@ix.netcom.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:48 PM
>To: 'Casey Kerrigan'; 'David Douglas'; 'eric smith'; 'don melhado';
>cmurray@obra.org
>Cc: Patty Peoples MA; 'Lee, Andy'; Callan, Sam; O2 Paul Skilbeck;
>chuckwurster
>Subject: USAC JR Talent Search
>
>
>
>USA Cycling Talent Search, Powered by RacerMate, Extended to May 7th
>
>Nationwide Program Identifies Talented Juniors for Fast Track Development
>
>
>
>Good evening,
>
>I am attaching a document for your review and posting. I know that some of
>the discussion groups do not allow for attachments, so if you would be so
>kind, I would appreciate it that after you have viewed it you would convert
>and post. Please feel free to post on any LA website.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Track and road cycling ABRA, NCNCA, SCNCA, WSBA, Oregon, Hawaii and Alaska
>
>
>
>
>
>Jan Luke-Hamasaki
>USAC Pacific Regional Coordinator
>
>USA Cycling
>P.O. Box 231910
>Encinitas,Ca 92023
>
>
> JLuke@usacycling.org
>
>
>tel:
>
>
>>luke@usacycling.org> 760-525-8557
>
>
>
>
>
> Add me
>to your address book...
>
> Want a signature like this?
>
>
>
><< image001.gif >>
>
>
><< 2007-03-21-USAC-NTS-ExtendFINAL(2)Release.doc >>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Watch free concerts with Pink, Rod Stewart, Oasis and more. Visit MSN
>Presents today.
>http://music.msn.com/presents?icid=ncmsnpresentstagline&ocid=T002MSN03A07001
>
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
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john m schmidt
portland oregon


Erik Long

2007-03-23

Dan, the point I was making was that some form of limitiation on equipment
would likely keep an advantage of wealth from becoming an advantage in
performance. As for identical bikes, it works for the Keirin riders in
Japan . . .

And I'm well aware of high-end BMX pricing. Still, $800 gets a pretty
top-notch BMX race bike, as opposed to $3-4K for a 17lb-ish road bike, maybe
you can find a deal at $1900, if you're lucky. If we can bring the overall
startup cost down to within $1000, we'll see junior numbers closer to what
we saw in the late 70's, when a viable race bike was easier to obtain.

It just seems silly for USAC (or anybody, for that matter) to expect new
young stars to rise up in the sport when the cost to join is five times the
cost of a Sony Playstation.

Let the Juniors race free, if that's what it takes. Presently, we're losing
all the real talent to video games, fast food, and YouTube. Cheap, easy,
waste-of-time kind of stuff. We have to make starting easy. As easy as
possible.

----Original Message Follows----
From: "Dan H"
To: "Erik Long"
,,
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search
Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2007 21:35:35 -0700

Eric,
Checked the price of a high end BMX bike?
How about identical bikes like in some forms of auto racing or like the
Little 500 Roadmasters? Trek is so huge now they could make a stock junior
bike. Everybody would have the same tires and everything. A component
manufacturer would have to be on board so the same stuff would be available
year after year. Wouldn't it be nice to have interchangeable stock parts?
Hello, bike shop? I need a stock junior rim and spoke set.
The only negative I can think of is being forced to buy your race bike from
only Trek or whoever.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Erik Long"
To: ;
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 9:02 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search

>USAC needs to pull all the stops and get thier hands on Simon Cowell, Lance
>Armstrong, and Connie Carpenter for their own reality show. I'm sure that
>"American Cyclist" could be a huge success for the VS. network.
>
>Or they could just make the sport more affordable for Johnny Highschooler
>by
>enforcing a weight limit on race bikes, making it a possibility to be
>competitive on an entry-level road bike. More Moms and Dads might be
>willing to let their kids compete in a sport that requires equipment
>expenses on par with say, BMX racing.
>
>-Erik Long
>long-time XC/road racer,
>Industry schlub
>
>----Original Message Follows----
>From: "Candi Murray"
>Reply-To: cmurray@obra.org
>To:
>Subject: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search
>Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 21:44:20 -0700
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
>From: Jan Luke-Hamasaki [mailto:Luke2@ix.netcom.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:48 PM
>To: 'Casey Kerrigan'; 'David Douglas'; 'eric smith'; 'don melhado';
>cmurray@obra.org
>Cc: Patty Peoples MA; 'Lee, Andy'; Callan, Sam; O2 Paul Skilbeck;
>chuckwurster
>Subject: USAC JR Talent Search
>
>
>
>USA Cycling Talent Search, Powered by RacerMate, Extended to May 7th
>
>Nationwide Program Identifies Talented Juniors for Fast Track Development
>
>
>
>Good evening,
>
>I am attaching a document for your review and posting. I know that some of
>the discussion groups do not allow for attachments, so if you would be so
>kind, I would appreciate it that after you have viewed it you would convert
>and post. Please feel free to post on any LA website.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Track and road cycling ABRA, NCNCA, SCNCA, WSBA, Oregon, Hawaii and Alaska
>
>
>
>
>
>Jan Luke-Hamasaki
>USAC Pacific Regional Coordinator
>
>USA Cycling
>P.O. Box 231910
>Encinitas,Ca 92023
>
>
> JLuke@usacycling.org
>
>
>tel:
>
>
>luke@usacycling.org> 760-525-8557
>
>
>
>
>
> Add me
>to your address book...
>
> Want a signature like this?
>
>
>
><< image001.gif >>
>
>
><< 2007-03-21-USAC-NTS-ExtendFINAL(2)Release.doc >>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Watch free concerts with Pink, Rod Stewart, Oasis and more. Visit MSN
>Presents today.
>http://music.msn.com/presents?icid=ncmsnpresentstagline&ocid=T002MSN03A07001
>
>_______________________________________________
>OBRA mailing list
>obra@list.obra.org
>http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Mortgage refinance is hot 1) Rates near 30-yr lows 2) Good credit get
intro-rate 4.625%*
https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h2a5f&s=4056&p=5117&disc=y&vers=743


Dan H

2007-03-22

Eric,
Checked the price of a high end BMX bike?
How about identical bikes like in some forms of auto racing or like the
Little 500 Roadmasters? Trek is so huge now they could make a stock junior
bike. Everybody would have the same tires and everything. A component
manufacturer would have to be on board so the same stuff would be available
year after year. Wouldn't it be nice to have interchangeable stock parts?
Hello, bike shop? I need a stock junior rim and spoke set.
The only negative I can think of is being forced to buy your race bike from
only Trek or whoever.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Erik Long"
To: ;
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 9:02 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search

> USAC needs to pull all the stops and get thier hands on Simon Cowell,
> Lance
> Armstrong, and Connie Carpenter for their own reality show. I'm sure that
> "American Cyclist" could be a huge success for the VS. network.
>
> Or they could just make the sport more affordable for Johnny Highschooler
> by
> enforcing a weight limit on race bikes, making it a possibility to be
> competitive on an entry-level road bike. More Moms and Dads might be
> willing to let their kids compete in a sport that requires equipment
> expenses on par with say, BMX racing.
>
> -Erik Long
> long-time XC/road racer,
> Industry schlub
>
> ----Original Message Follows----
> From: "Candi Murray"
> Reply-To: cmurray@obra.org
> To:
> Subject: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search
> Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 21:44:20 -0700
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From: Jan Luke-Hamasaki [mailto:Luke2@ix.netcom.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:48 PM
> To: 'Casey Kerrigan'; 'David Douglas'; 'eric smith'; 'don melhado';
> cmurray@obra.org
> Cc: Patty Peoples MA; 'Lee, Andy'; Callan, Sam; O2 Paul Skilbeck;
> chuckwurster
> Subject: USAC JR Talent Search
>
>
>
> USA Cycling Talent Search, Powered by RacerMate, Extended to May 7th
>
> Nationwide Program Identifies Talented Juniors for Fast Track Development
>
>
>
> Good evening,
>
> I am attaching a document for your review and posting. I know that some of
> the discussion groups do not allow for attachments, so if you would be so
> kind, I would appreciate it that after you have viewed it you would
> convert
> and post. Please feel free to post on any LA website.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Track and road cycling ABRA, NCNCA, SCNCA, WSBA, Oregon, Hawaii and Alaska
>
>
>
>
>
> Jan Luke-Hamasaki
> USAC Pacific Regional Coordinator
>
> USA Cycling
> P.O. Box 231910
> Encinitas,Ca 92023
>
>
> JLuke@usacycling.org
>
>
> tel:
>
>
> luke@usacycling.org> 760-525-8557
>
>
>
>
>
> Add me
> to your address book...
>
> Want a signature like this?
>
>
>
> << image001.gif >>
>
>
> << 2007-03-21-USAC-NTS-ExtendFINAL(2)Release.doc >>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Watch free concerts with Pink, Rod Stewart, Oasis and more. Visit MSN
> Presents today.
> http://music.msn.com/presents?icid=ncmsnpresentstagline&ocid=T002MSN03A07001
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>


Erik Long

2007-03-22

USAC needs to pull all the stops and get thier hands on Simon Cowell, Lance
Armstrong, and Connie Carpenter for their own reality show. I'm sure that
"American Cyclist" could be a huge success for the VS. network.

Or they could just make the sport more affordable for Johnny Highschooler by
enforcing a weight limit on race bikes, making it a possibility to be
competitive on an entry-level road bike. More Moms and Dads might be
willing to let their kids compete in a sport that requires equipment
expenses on par with say, BMX racing.

-Erik Long
long-time XC/road racer,
Industry schlub

----Original Message Follows----
From: "Candi Murray"
Reply-To: cmurray@obra.org
To:
Subject: [OBRA Chat] FW: USAC JR Talent Search
Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 21:44:20 -0700

_____

From: Jan Luke-Hamasaki [mailto:Luke2@ix.netcom.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:48 PM
To: 'Casey Kerrigan'; 'David Douglas'; 'eric smith'; 'don melhado';
cmurray@obra.org
Cc: Patty Peoples MA; 'Lee, Andy'; Callan, Sam; O2 Paul Skilbeck;
chuckwurster
Subject: USAC JR Talent Search

USA Cycling Talent Search, Powered by RacerMate, Extended to May 7th

Nationwide Program Identifies Talented Juniors for Fast Track Development

Good evening,

I am attaching a document for your review and posting. I know that some of
the discussion groups do not allow for attachments, so if you would be so
kind, I would appreciate it that after you have viewed it you would convert
and post. Please feel free to post on any LA website.

Track and road cycling ABRA, NCNCA, SCNCA, WSBA, Oregon, Hawaii and Alaska

Jan Luke-Hamasaki
USAC Pacific Regional Coordinator

USA Cycling
P.O. Box 231910
Encinitas,Ca 92023

JLuke@usacycling.org

tel:

760-525-8557

Add me
to your address book...

Want a signature like this?

<< image001.gif >>

<< 2007-03-21-USAC-NTS-ExtendFINAL(2)Release.doc >>

_______________________________________________
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Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

_________________________________________________________________
Watch free concerts with Pink, Rod Stewart, Oasis and more. Visit MSN
Presents today.
http://music.msn.com/presents?icid=ncmsnpresentstagline&ocid=T002MSN03A07001


Candi Murray

2007-03-21

_____

From: Jan Luke-Hamasaki [mailto:Luke2@ix.netcom.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:48 PM
To: 'Casey Kerrigan'; 'David Douglas'; 'eric smith'; 'don melhado';
cmurray@obra.org
Cc: Patty Peoples MA; 'Lee, Andy'; Callan, Sam; O2 Paul Skilbeck;
chuckwurster
Subject: USAC JR Talent Search

USA Cycling Talent Search, Powered by RacerMate, Extended to May 7th

Nationwide Program Identifies Talented Juniors for Fast Track Development

Good evening,

I am attaching a document for your review and posting. I know that some of
the discussion groups do not allow for attachments, so if you would be so
kind, I would appreciate it that after you have viewed it you would convert
and post. Please feel free to post on any LA website.

Track and road cycling ABRA, NCNCA, SCNCA, WSBA, Oregon, Hawaii and Alaska

Jan Luke-Hamasaki
USAC Pacific Regional Coordinator

USA Cycling
P.O. Box 231910
Encinitas,Ca 92023

JLuke@usacycling.org

tel:


760-525-8557

Add me
to your address book...

Want a signature like this?