Doug Hormann

You were fine until you wrote "legally elected not to follow the bike lane".
Unless the bike lane was unsafe to a reasonable person (full of trash,
glass, under construction, under water) there is no choice to be made here.
The bike lane is the legal path and you may not "legally" deviate from it.
Convenience; not having to slow down; etc. are not legal reasons to leave
the path/lane. The path in that spot is there to prevent exactly this sort
of situation. The driver of the bus has the obligation to exibit due care
when operating the bus, just as cyclists have the same obligation; so if the
driver of the bus had seen the bicycle and sped up to "show him who's boss"
then there might be a culpable mental state of the part of the driver.
Having said all that, I've been known to take the road vs. the bike lane or
path just because I want to, but that doesn't mean that I can cry foul if I
get injured or squashed.

Doug Hormann

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Catlin, Wil
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 12:31 PM
To: Justin Serna; Chris Alling; Obra
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

Yup, it's hard enough for folks to follow the details of even this one
specific situation.

There was no lane holding by the cyclist: that's the problem. The 'on ramp'
there is its own lane in parallel with the two on Barbur that it joins. Form
that point down to the Front St. pullout (or so) there are three lanes on
Barbur.

So, the cyclist legally elected not to follow the bike lane and remained in
the right lane. Fine. BUT, once he passed Capitol HWY he found himself no
longer in the right lane but in the center lane. Bus is in the right lane,
heading on down the road toward its next stop like all buses do when they
aren't out hunting for cyclists. Fine again, in that at least the bus is not
demonstrably hunting. However, the cyclist then decides he just can't wait
for the bus to pass, in fact wants to beat that damn bus, demoralize the
indifferent, godless thing, and forthwith treats all and sundry to a
mortality-flaunting display of horsepower and senseless verve by outpacing
and then Oh! cutting past the beast, through the lane, a hair's breadth from
harm, safely into the . bike lane. Surely the stuff of demi-gods on earth,
yes? Cripes.

At least, at the very, very least, if cornered and stopped, if pressed by
cops or irate drivers, the cyclist wouldn't have gazed bewildered at the
gathered crowd and said. "Bus? I never saw it."

_____

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Justin Serna
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 12:03 PM
To: Chris Alling; Obra
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I would have to agree with Chris in this situation if the cyclist was in
fact traveling at the speeds you described he had every right to hold the
lane he was in and the bus should have given him the right of way. However
I will agree with you that merging in front of a bus at that speed and
proximity is very dangerous. I have found that quite often bus drivers can
be the worst offenders when it comes to giving way to cyclist.
Unfortunately with the increased popularity of cycling we will see many
different types of riders just as we see in those who drive automobiles. I
think the key is to judge each situation as an individual case and then
remember that everyone has a point of view, but I guess that would be a bit
idealistic.

Cheers and safe training and riding..........

J. Serna

#1250

_____

From: Chris Alling
To: Obra
Sent: Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

>From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the right
of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the brakes
and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the flow af
traffic.

_____

From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
To: obra@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

Amen !!! Let's all try to not give motorists any reasons to dislike cyclist
on the roadways. Let's make positive progress.

john

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I
have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown
and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal lighting
and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I would have
to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and
speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who
knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph. They
decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass.

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle
in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws
as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no
joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the
cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the
bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared
the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against
cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right
STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would
have watch you die. Horribly. Think of how the driver of the bus would
have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra
seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this
before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your
decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on
and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the
situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

_____

Rediscover HotmailR: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it out.

Chip Sloan

Perhaps everyone should take a minute or two and watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQgAMkMmsfg

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 1:56 PM, Robert Anderson wrote:

> I'm glad to hear that you didn't have to watch the dude get plowed by the
> bus and die. That would have sucked really bad.
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 1:28 PM, Mike Rosenfeld wrote:
>
>> Thanks for all the feed back and more details about the intersection.
>>
>> I actually do not care if the cyclist was in the right or wrong, or if the
>> Bus was right or wrong. It all comes down to realizing that what we do in
>> our day to day lives impact not just us but others around us.
>>
>> The whole incident actually shook me up pretty badly, the adrenaline boost
>> made my normal morning cup of coffee go cold. Most days I would have
>> shrugged this off and not even bothered writing in about it. However a lot
>> of "what if's" entered my mind I could not shake the image of just how darn
>> close that 10Ton bus was to the 200 Pounds of biker and bicycle. I have
>> even thought about the fact that he could have been bounced from the side of
>> the bus and directly in front of me...causing me to have killed him. Would
>> not that have been ironic. One avid cyclist kills another avid cyclist.
>>
>> I am glad that the, to quote Wil Catlin, "Demi god" of a sprinter made it
>> past the bumper of the bus and all is well. The flip side is this:
>>
>> He dies.
>> His mother and father who gave him life, raised him, and loved him are
>> with out a son.
>> His present or future children are denied a father.
>> His extended family and friends are denied the pleasure of his company
>> other than a yearly visit to his grave marker.
>> 30+ people have to deal with the fact they watch a man in the prime of his
>> life dragged to his death beneath a large vehicle they were riding in.
>>
>> One poor decision that worked out in his favor was one poor decision that
>> could have affected so many people lives.
>>
>> We are all guilty of it. In my younger years I did not wear a helmet, I
>> ran stop signs, I cut lanes of traffic with little or no regards to who or
>> what was where.
>>
>> I felt I should share this mornings event as a reminder to all of us about
>> what is important. Your life.... and how you live it, whether you wish to
>> admit it or not, decisions you make and things you do affect other people.
>>
>> I am not over thinking this...it is the cold hard truth.
>>
>> Thanks for your time.
>>
>> Mike Rosenfeld.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 12:39 PM, Steven Beardsley wrote:
>>
>>> Just to set the right of way discussion straight, at this point the
>>> lane of the on-ramp turns Barbur from a two lane road into a three lane
>>> road. So any cyclist that does not take the bike path is put in to the
>>> middle lane of traffic and no traffic is forced to actually merge. The bus
>>> stayed in its lane and the bike should have stayed in the middle lane until
>>> it was safe and legal to change lanes.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have just as many confrontations with motorist as anyone else. Just
>>> keep things in perspective, the vehicle or object with more lug bolts will
>>> win any roadway feud. Unfortunately bikes are at the bottom of that list.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On
>>> Behalf Of *Justin Serna
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 02, 2009 12:03 PM
>>> *To:* Chris Alling; Obra
>>> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I would have to agree with Chris in this situation if the cyclist was in
>>> fact traveling at the speeds you described he had every right to hold the
>>> lane he was in and the bus should have given him the right of way.
>>> However I will agree with you that merging in front of a bus at that speed
>>> and proximity is very dangerous. I have found that quite often bus drivers
>>> can be the worst offenders when it comes to giving way to cyclist.
>>> Unfortunately with the increased popularity of cycling we will see many
>>> different types of riders just as we see in those who drive automobiles. I
>>> think the key is to judge each situation as an individual case and then
>>> remember that everyone has a point of view, but I guess that would be a bit
>>> idealistic.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Cheers and safe training and riding..........
>>>
>>>
>>> J. Serna
>>>
>>> #1250
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> *From:* Chris Alling
>>> *To:* Obra
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM
>>> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>>>
>>> >From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the
>>> right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the
>>> brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the
>>> flow af traffic.
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
>>> To: obra@list.obra.org
>>> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>>>
>>> Amen !!! Let’s all try to *not* give motorists any reasons to dislike
>>> cyclist on the roadways. Let’s make positive progress.
>>>
>>> john
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On
>>> Behalf Of *Mike Rosenfeld
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
>>> *To:* OBRA
>>> *Subject:* [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
>>> huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.
>>>
>>> The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I
>>> have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.
>>>
>>> There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
>>> overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.
>>>
>>> It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.
>>>
>>> I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards
>>> downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal
>>> lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I
>>> would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth
>>> spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of
>>> someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30
>>> mph. They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over
>>> pass.
>>>
>>> As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
>>> coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.
>>>
>>> The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.
>>>
>>> The Bus increases speed.
>>>
>>> I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every
>>> muscle in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through
>>> clenched jaws as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is
>>> no joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the
>>> cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the
>>> bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.
>>>
>>> The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.
>>>
>>> I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
>>> actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared
>>> the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.
>>>
>>> This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against
>>> cyclists.
>>>
>>> I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
>>> being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
>>> handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right
>>> STUPID!!
>>>
>>> I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
>>> this. My message to you is this:
>>>
>>> Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
>>> abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would
>>> have watch you die. *Horribly.* Think of how the driver of the bus
>>> would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra
>>> seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this
>>> before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your
>>> decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.
>>>
>>> I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on
>>> and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the
>>> situation.
>>>
>>>
>>> Mike Rosenfeld
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it
>>> out.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OBRA mailing list
>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OBRA mailing list
>> obra@list.obra.org
>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Rob Anderson
> riznob@gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>

Robert Anderson

I'm glad to hear that you didn't have to watch the dude get plowed by the
bus and die. That would have sucked really bad.

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 1:28 PM, Mike Rosenfeld wrote:

> Thanks for all the feed back and more details about the intersection.
>
> I actually do not care if the cyclist was in the right or wrong, or if the
> Bus was right or wrong. It all comes down to realizing that what we do in
> our day to day lives impact not just us but others around us.
>
> The whole incident actually shook me up pretty badly, the adrenaline boost
> made my normal morning cup of coffee go cold. Most days I would have
> shrugged this off and not even bothered writing in about it. However a lot
> of "what if's" entered my mind I could not shake the image of just how darn
> close that 10Ton bus was to the 200 Pounds of biker and bicycle. I have
> even thought about the fact that he could have been bounced from the side of
> the bus and directly in front of me...causing me to have killed him. Would
> not that have been ironic. One avid cyclist kills another avid cyclist.
>
> I am glad that the, to quote Wil Catlin, "Demi god" of a sprinter made it
> past the bumper of the bus and all is well. The flip side is this:
>
> He dies.
> His mother and father who gave him life, raised him, and loved him are with
> out a son.
> His present or future children are denied a father.
> His extended family and friends are denied the pleasure of his company
> other than a yearly visit to his grave marker.
> 30+ people have to deal with the fact they watch a man in the prime of his
> life dragged to his death beneath a large vehicle they were riding in.
>
> One poor decision that worked out in his favor was one poor decision that
> could have affected so many people lives.
>
> We are all guilty of it. In my younger years I did not wear a helmet, I
> ran stop signs, I cut lanes of traffic with little or no regards to who or
> what was where.
>
> I felt I should share this mornings event as a reminder to all of us about
> what is important. Your life.... and how you live it, whether you wish to
> admit it or not, decisions you make and things you do affect other people.
>
> I am not over thinking this...it is the cold hard truth.
>
> Thanks for your time.
>
> Mike Rosenfeld.
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 12:39 PM, Steven Beardsley wrote:
>
>> Just to set the right of way discussion straight, at this point the lane
>> of the on-ramp turns Barbur from a two lane road into a three lane road. So
>> any cyclist that does not take the bike path is put in to the middle lane of
>> traffic and no traffic is forced to actually merge. The bus stayed in its
>> lane and the bike should have stayed in the middle lane until it was safe
>> and legal to change lanes.
>>
>>
>>
>> I have just as many confrontations with motorist as anyone else. Just keep
>> things in perspective, the vehicle or object with more lug bolts will win
>> any roadway feud. Unfortunately bikes are at the bottom of that list.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On
>> Behalf Of *Justin Serna
>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 02, 2009 12:03 PM
>> *To:* Chris Alling; Obra
>> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>>
>>
>>
>> I would have to agree with Chris in this situation if the cyclist was in
>> fact traveling at the speeds you described he had every right to hold the
>> lane he was in and the bus should have given him the right of way.
>> However I will agree with you that merging in front of a bus at that speed
>> and proximity is very dangerous. I have found that quite often bus drivers
>> can be the worst offenders when it comes to giving way to cyclist.
>> Unfortunately with the increased popularity of cycling we will see many
>> different types of riders just as we see in those who drive automobiles. I
>> think the key is to judge each situation as an individual case and then
>> remember that everyone has a point of view, but I guess that would be a bit
>> idealistic.
>>
>>
>>
>> Cheers and safe training and riding..........
>>
>>
>> J. Serna
>>
>> #1250
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> *From:* Chris Alling
>> *To:* Obra
>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM
>> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>>
>> >From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the
>> right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the
>> brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the
>> flow af traffic.
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
>> To: obra@list.obra.org
>> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>>
>> Amen !!! Let’s all try to *not* give motorists any reasons to dislike
>> cyclist on the roadways. Let’s make positive progress.
>>
>> john
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On
>> Behalf Of *Mike Rosenfeld
>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
>> *To:* OBRA
>> *Subject:* [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>>
>>
>>
>> I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
>> huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.
>>
>> The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I
>> have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.
>>
>> There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
>> overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.
>>
>> It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.
>>
>> I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards
>> downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal
>> lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I
>> would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth
>> spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of
>> someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30
>> mph. They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over
>> pass.
>>
>> As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
>> coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.
>>
>> The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.
>>
>> The Bus increases speed.
>>
>> I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle
>> in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws
>> as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no
>> joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the
>> cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the
>> bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.
>>
>> The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.
>>
>> I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
>> actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared
>> the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.
>>
>> This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against
>> cyclists.
>>
>> I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
>> being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
>> handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right
>> STUPID!!
>>
>> I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
>> this. My message to you is this:
>>
>> Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
>> abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would
>> have watch you die. *Horribly.* Think of how the driver of the bus
>> would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra
>> seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this
>> before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your
>> decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.
>>
>> I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on
>> and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the
>> situation.
>>
>>
>> Mike Rosenfeld
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it
>> out.
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OBRA mailing list
>> obra@list.obra.org
>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>

--
Rob Anderson
riznob@gmail.com

Mike Rosenfeld

Thanks for all the feed back and more details about the intersection.

I actually do not care if the cyclist was in the right or wrong, or if the
Bus was right or wrong. It all comes down to realizing that what we do in
our day to day lives impact not just us but others around us.

The whole incident actually shook me up pretty badly, the adrenaline boost
made my normal morning cup of coffee go cold. Most days I would have
shrugged this off and not even bothered writing in about it. However a lot
of "what if's" entered my mind I could not shake the image of just how darn
close that 10Ton bus was to the 200 Pounds of biker and bicycle. I have
even thought about the fact that he could have been bounced from the side of
the bus and directly in front of me...causing me to have killed him. Would
not that have been ironic. One avid cyclist kills another avid cyclist.

I am glad that the, to quote Wil Catlin, "Demi god" of a sprinter made it
past the bumper of the bus and all is well. The flip side is this:

He dies.
His mother and father who gave him life, raised him, and loved him are with
out a son.
His present or future children are denied a father.
His extended family and friends are denied the pleasure of his company other
than a yearly visit to his grave marker.
30+ people have to deal with the fact they watch a man in the prime of his
life dragged to his death beneath a large vehicle they were riding in.

One poor decision that worked out in his favor was one poor decision that
could have affected so many people lives.

We are all guilty of it. In my younger years I did not wear a helmet, I ran
stop signs, I cut lanes of traffic with little or no regards to who or what
was where.

I felt I should share this mornings event as a reminder to all of us about
what is important. Your life.... and how you live it, whether you wish to
admit it or not, decisions you make and things you do affect other people.

I am not over thinking this...it is the cold hard truth.

Thanks for your time.

Mike Rosenfeld.

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 12:39 PM, Steven Beardsley wrote:

> Just to set the right of way discussion straight, at this point the lane
> of the on-ramp turns Barbur from a two lane road into a three lane road. So
> any cyclist that does not take the bike path is put in to the middle lane of
> traffic and no traffic is forced to actually merge. The bus stayed in its
> lane and the bike should have stayed in the middle lane until it was safe
> and legal to change lanes.
>
>
>
> I have just as many confrontations with motorist as anyone else. Just keep
> things in perspective, the vehicle or object with more lug bolts will win
> any roadway feud. Unfortunately bikes are at the bottom of that list.
>
>
>
> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On
> Behalf Of *Justin Serna
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 02, 2009 12:03 PM
> *To:* Chris Alling; Obra
> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
>
>
> I would have to agree with Chris in this situation if the cyclist was in
> fact traveling at the speeds you described he had every right to hold the
> lane he was in and the bus should have given him the right of way.
> However I will agree with you that merging in front of a bus at that speed
> and proximity is very dangerous. I have found that quite often bus drivers
> can be the worst offenders when it comes to giving way to cyclist.
> Unfortunately with the increased popularity of cycling we will see many
> different types of riders just as we see in those who drive automobiles. I
> think the key is to judge each situation as an individual case and then
> remember that everyone has a point of view, but I guess that would be a bit
> idealistic.
>
>
>
> Cheers and safe training and riding..........
>
>
> J. Serna
>
> #1250
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Chris Alling
> *To:* Obra
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
> >From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the
> right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the
> brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the
> flow af traffic.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
> Amen !!! Let’s all try to *not* give motorists any reasons to dislike
> cyclist on the roadways. Let’s make positive progress.
>
> john
>
>
>
> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On
> Behalf Of *Mike Rosenfeld
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
> *To:* OBRA
> *Subject:* [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
>
>
> I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
> huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.
>
> The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I
> have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.
>
> There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
> overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.
>
> It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.
>
> I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards
> downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal
> lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I
> would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth
> spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of
> someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30
> mph. They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over
> pass.
>
> As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
> coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.
>
> The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.
>
> The Bus increases speed.
>
> I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle
> in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws
> as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no
> joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the
> cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the
> bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.
>
> The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.
>
> I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
> actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared
> the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.
>
> This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against
> cyclists.
>
> I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
> being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
> handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right
> STUPID!!
>
> I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
> this. My message to you is this:
>
> Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
> abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would
> have watch you die. *Horribly.* Think of how the driver of the bus
> would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra
> seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this
> before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your
> decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.
>
> I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on
> and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the
> situation.
>
>
> Mike Rosenfeld
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it out.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>

Steven Beardsley

Just to set the right of way discussion straight, at this point the lane of the on-ramp turns Barbur from a two lane road into a three lane road. So any cyclist that does not take the bike path is put in to the middle lane of traffic and no traffic is forced to actually merge. The bus stayed in its lane and the bike should have stayed in the middle lane until it was safe and legal to change lanes.

I have just as many confrontations with motorist as anyone else. Just keep things in perspective, the vehicle or object with more lug bolts will win any roadway feud. Unfortunately bikes are at the bottom of that list.

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Justin Serna
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 12:03 PM
To: Chris Alling; Obra
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I would have to agree with Chris in this situation if the cyclist was in fact traveling at the speeds you described he had every right to hold the lane he was in and the bus should have given him the right of way. However I will agree with you that merging in front of a bus at that speed and proximity is very dangerous. I have found that quite often bus drivers can be the worst offenders when it comes to giving way to cyclist. Unfortunately with the increased popularity of cycling we will see many different types of riders just as we see in those who drive automobiles. I think the key is to judge each situation as an individual case and then remember that everyone has a point of view, but I guess that would be a bit idealistic.

Cheers and safe training and riding..........

J. Serna

#1250

_____

From: Chris Alling
To: Obra
Sent: Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

>From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the flow af traffic.

_____

From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
To: obra@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

Amen !!! Let’s all try to not give motorists any reasons to dislike cyclist on the roadways. Let’s make positive progress.

john

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph. They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass.

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would have watch you die. Horribly. Think of how the driver of the bus would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

_____

Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it out.

Catlin, Wil

Yup, it's hard enough for folks to follow the details of even this one
specific situation.

There was no lane holding by the cyclist: that's the problem. The 'on
ramp' there is its own lane in parallel with the two on Barbur that it
joins. Form that point down to the Front St. pullout (or so) there are
three lanes on Barbur.

So, the cyclist legally elected not to follow the bike lane and remained
in the right lane. Fine. BUT, once he passed Capitol HWY he found
himself no longer in the right lane but in the center lane. Bus is in
the right lane, heading on down the road toward its next stop like all
buses do when they aren't out hunting for cyclists. Fine again, in that
at least the bus is not demonstrably hunting. However, the cyclist then
decides he just can't wait for the bus to pass, in fact wants to beat
that damn bus, demoralize the indifferent, godless thing, and forthwith
treats all and sundry to a mortality-flaunting display of horsepower and
senseless verve by outpacing and then Oh! cutting past the beast,
through the lane, a hair's breadth from harm, safely into the ... bike
lane. Surely the stuff of demi-gods on earth, yes? Cripes.

At least, at the very, very least, if cornered and stopped, if pressed
by cops or irate drivers, the cyclist wouldn't have gazed bewildered at
the gathered crowd and said... "Bus? I never saw it."

________________________________

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Justin Serna
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 12:03 PM
To: Chris Alling; Obra
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I would have to agree with Chris in this situation if the cyclist was in
fact traveling at the speeds you described he had every right to hold
the lane he was in and the bus should have given him the right of way.
However I will agree with you that merging in front of a bus at that
speed and proximity is very dangerous. I have found that quite often
bus drivers can be the worst offenders when it comes to giving way to
cyclist. Unfortunately with the increased popularity of cycling we will
see many different types of riders just as we see in those who drive
automobiles. I think the key is to judge each situation as an
individual case and then remember that everyone has a point of view, but
I guess that would be a bit idealistic.

Cheers and safe training and riding..........

J. Serna

#1250

________________________________

From: Chris Alling
To: Obra
Sent: Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

>From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the
right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying
the brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally
with the flow af traffic.

________________________________

From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
To: obra@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

Amen !!! Let's all try to not give motorists any reasons to dislike
cyclist on the roadways. Let's make positive progress.

john

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd.
I have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards
downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with
minimal lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish
helmet. I would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type
of bike, smooth spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear
was indicative of someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed
would be maybe 25 to 30 mph. They decide to bypass the bike path
round-about and go under the over pass.

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every
muscle in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through
clenched jaws as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this
is no joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel
of the cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist
clears the bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have
smeared the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints
against cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down
right STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people
would have watch you die. Horribly. Think of how the driver of the
bus would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what??
30 extra seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think
about this before you do something like this again. Your
actions.....your decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure
on and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment
of the situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

________________________________

Rediscover Hotmail(r): Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it
out.

Bryan Curry

Was he at least wearing a helmet???

Justin Serna

I would have to agree with Chris in this situation if the cyclist was in fact traveling at the speeds you described he had every right to hold the lane he was in and the bus should have given him the right of way.  However I will agree with you that merging in front of a bus at that speed and proximity is very dangerous.  I have found that quite often bus drivers can be the worst offenders when it comes to giving way to cyclist.  Unfortunately with the increased popularity of cycling we will see many different types of riders just as we see in those who drive automobiles.  I think the key is to judge each situation as an individual case and then remember that everyone has a point of view, but I guess that would be a bit idealistic.

Cheers and safe training and riding..........
 
 J. Serna
#1250

________________________________
From: Chris Alling
To: Obra
Sent: Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

>From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the flow af traffic.
 
________________________________
From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
To: obra@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

Amen !!!  Let’s all try to not give motorists any reasons to dislike cyclist on the roadways.  Let’s make positive progress.
john
 
From:obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
 
I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent. 

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd.  I have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown and was passing under the overpass.  I see a cyclist with minimal lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet.  I would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph.  They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass. 

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus.  And this is no joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane. 

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but actually dead.  The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you.  If you had been wrong in your abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would have watch you die.  Horribly.   Think of how the driver of the bus would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life.  For what??  30 extra seconds?  Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this before you do something like this again.  Your actions.....your decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist.  I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on and off for 25 years.  I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

________________________________
Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it out.

Scott Jones

I disagree, I think the rider took a undesirable route and one that put his
own life at risk, but the bus didn't have to yield as the rider crossed a
lane of traffic and there is clearly a bike lane that avoids this action. If
he chooses to take that route, then he lives or dies for his own choice.
Sure it might hurt the cycling community at large with media attention but I
think that he should have yielded the right of way to the bus since he was
the one crossing lanes of traffic.

It just like all the cyclists, both racers and commuters alike, that I see
running red lights and stop signs, weaving through traffic, and failing to
do simple things like signal turns. Its just the basics of following the law
when riding, same as driving a car or bus. Follow the law and stay safe, if
not I will not feel bad for you for doing something stupid and most likely
avoidable.

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 11:09 AM, wrote:

> I have to agree with Chris here.
> To me, it sounds like he was riding with the flow of traffic and
> unfortunately approached the merging of roads at the same time as the bus.
> His only crime, really, is not wearing bright enough clothing. The bus
> should have yielded at that point...if he saw the rider.
>
> You are suggesting that just because there is a bike path that the rider is
> obligated to take it. Sometimes the road is easier, safer than the bike
> path. I say he did nothing wrong. Perhaps he sprinted to save his life
> because the bus driver was in the wrong for not yielding.
>
> my two cents.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chris Alling"
> To: "Obra"
> Sent: Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
> >From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the
> right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the
> brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the
> flow af traffic.
>
> ------------------------------
> From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
> Amen !!! Let’s all try to *not* give motorists any reasons to dislike
> cyclist on the roadways. Let’s make positive progress.
>
> john
>
>
>
> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On
> Behalf Of *Mike Rosenfeld
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
> *To:* OBRA
> *Subject:* [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
>
>
> I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
> huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.
>
> The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I
> have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.
>
> There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
> overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.
>
> It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.
>
> I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards
> downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal
> lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I
> would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth
> spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of
> someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30
> mph. They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over
> pass.
>
> As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
> coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.
>
> The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.
>
> The Bus increases speed.
>
> I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle
> in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws
> as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no
> joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the
> cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the
> bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.
>
> The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.
>
> I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
> actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared
> the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.
>
> This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against
> cyclists.
>
> I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
> being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
> handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right
> STUPID!!
>
> I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
> this. My message to you is this:
>
> Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
> abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would
> have watch you die. *Horribly.* Think of how the driver of the bus
> would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra
> seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this
> before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your
> decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.
>
> I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on
> and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the
> situation.
>
>
> Mike Rosenfeld
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it out.
> _______________________________________________ OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra Unsubscribe:
> obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>

John and Robin McCaffrey

No, Mike was right. The bicyclist would have been at fault if there had been
an accident.

There is a bike path to take riders around to the right side of the right
travel lane which the rider didn't use.

I believe the speed limit there is either 40 or 45. The bus had its own
lane. The rider was moving from the middle lane, across the right lane
(bus) to get to the bike lane.

How many times do you think he'll be successful travelling 30-35mph and
cutting in front of a bus going about 40mph?

John

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Chris Alling
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 10:54 AM
To: Obra
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

>From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the right
of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the brakes
and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the flow af
traffic.

_____

From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
To: obra@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

Amen !!! Let's all try to not give motorists any reasons to dislike cyclist
on the roadways. Let's make positive progress.

john

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I
have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown
and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal lighting
and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I would have
to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and
speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who
knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph. They
decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass.

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle
in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws
as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no
joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the
cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the
bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared
the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against
cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right
STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would
have watch you die. Horribly. Think of how the driver of the bus would
have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra
seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this
before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your
decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on
and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the
situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

_____

Rediscover HotmailR: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it out.

Gregory Leblanc

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 2:09 PM, wrote:
> I have to agree with Chris here.
> To me, it sounds like he was riding with the flow of traffic and
> unfortunately approached the merging of roads at the same time as the bus.
> His only crime, really, is not wearing bright enough clothing. The bus
> should have yielded at that point...if he saw the rider.

It doesn't matter if you're right if you're Dead Right. If you aren't
lit up like the Christmas tree in Pioneer Square, and assuming that
nobody in a motor vehicle can see you, then you're riding wrong. If
you want to kill yourself, there are ways of doing it that won't have
some poor tri-met driver in anguish for years over your dead body.
RIDE SAFE.
Greg

David Hart

so who's going to win? the bus or the cyclist? Even if the vehicle is in the
wrong, you need to prevent an accident if at all possible, you are talking
about your life.

David

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 11:09 AM, wrote:

> I have to agree with Chris here.
> To me, it sounds like he was riding with the flow of traffic and
> unfortunately approached the merging of roads at the same time as the bus.
> His only crime, really, is not wearing bright enough clothing. The bus
> should have yielded at that point...if he saw the rider.
>
> You are suggesting that just because there is a bike path that the rider is
> obligated to take it. Sometimes the road is easier, safer than the bike
> path. I say he did nothing wrong. Perhaps he sprinted to save his life
> because the bus driver was in the wrong for not yielding.
>
> my two cents.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chris Alling"
> To: "Obra"
> Sent: Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
> >From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the
> right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the
> brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the
> flow af traffic.
>
> ------------------------------
> From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
> To: obra@list.obra.org
> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
> Amen !!! Let’s all try to *not* give motorists any reasons to dislike
> cyclist on the roadways. Let’s make positive progress.
>
> john
>
>
>
> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On
> Behalf Of *Mike Rosenfeld
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
> *To:* OBRA
> *Subject:* [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
>
>
>
> I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
> huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.
>
> The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I
> have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.
>
> There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
> overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.
>
> It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.
>
> I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards
> downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal
> lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I
> would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth
> spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of
> someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30
> mph. They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over
> pass.
>
> As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
> coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.
>
> The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.
>
> The Bus increases speed.
>
> I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle
> in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws
> as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no
> joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the
> cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the
> bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.
>
> The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.
>
> I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
> actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared
> the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.
>
> This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against
> cyclists.
>
> I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
> being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
> handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right
> STUPID!!
>
> I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
> this. My message to you is this:
>
> Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
> abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would
> have watch you die. *Horribly.* Think of how the driver of the bus
> would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra
> seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this
> before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your
> decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.
>
> I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on
> and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the
> situation.
>
>
> Mike Rosenfeld
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it out.
> _______________________________________________ OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra Unsubscribe:
> obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>

--
david hart

Mark J. Ginsberg

there is a bike only lane to the right of the ramp which avoids the crossing of the bike and bus which Mike witnessed.

When viewed from above the car lanes on barbur go straight and under the "off" ramp from b-h highway, their is a bike only lane that goes to the right of the "off" ramp, stays at the same grade as barbur but avoids the bike on the left/bus on the offramp on the right that Mike saw.

I was involved in the layout when it was put in.
It may have gravel or need some clean up, but I think Mike's point was the cyclist decided to take the less favorable option and then also decided to not slow down and go behind the bus but rather to sprint in front of the bus.

Mark

Mark J. Ginsberg

Berkshire Ginsberg, LLC

Attorneys At Law

1216 SE Belmont St.

Portland, OR 97214

(503) 542-3000

Fax (503) 233-6874

markjginsberg@yahoo.com

www.bikesafetylaw.com

--- On Thu, 4/2/09, Chris Alling wrote:
From: Chris Alling
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
To: "Obra"
Date: Thursday, April 2, 2009, 10:54 AM

#yiv684721666 .hmmessage P
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>From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the flow af traffic.
 

From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
To: obra@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

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Amen !!!  Let’s all try to not give motorists any reasons to dislike cyclist on the roadways.  Let’s make positive progress.
john
 

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.
 
I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent. 

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd.  I have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown and was passing under the overpass.  I see a cyclist with minimal lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet.  I would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph.  They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass. 

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus.  And this is no joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane. 

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but actually dead.  The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you.  If you had been wrong in your abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would have watch you die.  Horribly.   Think of how the driver of the bus would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life.  For what??  30 extra seconds?  Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this before you do something like this again.  Your actions.....your decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist.  I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on and off for 25 years.  I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it out.
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

chood1@comcast.net

I have to agree with Chris here.
To me, it sounds like he was riding with the flow of traffic and unfortunately approached the merging of roads at the same time as the bus. His only crime, really, is not wearing bright enough clothing. The bus should have yielded at that point...if he saw the rider.

You are suggesting that just because there is a bike path that the rider is obligated to take it. Sometimes the road is easier, safer than the bike path. I say he did nothing wrong. Perhaps he sprinted to save his life because the bus driver was in the wrong for not yielding.

my two cents.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Alling"
To: "Obra"
Sent: Thursday, April 2, 2009 10:54:05 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

>From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the flow af traffic.

From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
To: obra@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

Amen !!! Let’s all try to not give motorists any reasons to dislike cyclist on the roadways. Let’s make positive progress.

john

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph. They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass.

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would have watch you die. Horribly. Think of how the driver of the bus would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. Check it out.
_______________________________________________ OBRA mailing list obra@list.obra.org http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Chris Alling

>From your description it sounds as if the bus should have yielded the right of way to the cyclist and he should be lambasted for not applying the brakes and yielding. It sounds like the bike was traveling legally with the flow af traffic.

From: JRaedeke@roguecc.edu
To: obra@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:07:49 -0700
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

Amen !!! Let’s all try to not give motorists any reasons to dislike cyclist on the roadways. Let’s make positive progress.
john

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph. They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass.

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would have watch you die. Horribly. Think of how the driver of the bus would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

_________________________________________________________________
Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you.
http://windowslive.com/RediscoverHotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Rediscover_Storage1_042009

Raedeke, John

Amen !!! Let's all try to not give motorists any reasons to dislike cyclist on the roadways. Let's make positive progress.
john

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal lighting and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I would have to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph. They decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass.

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would have watch you die. Horribly. Think of how the driver of the bus would have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

Brian Engelen

I'm with you brother. I'm sure we have all made similar mistakes.
Hopefully we learn from them and are not killed by them.

Lesson learned: Don't put yourself in the position to make this mistake.

Brian

_____

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Rosenfeld
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009 9:38 AM
To: OBRA
Subject: [OBRA Chat] What was he thinking.

I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I
have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown
and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal lighting
and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I would have
to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and
speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who
knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph. They
decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass.

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle
in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws
as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no
joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the
cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the
bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared
the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against
cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right
STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would
have watch you die. Horribly. Think of how the driver of the bus would
have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra
seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this
before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your
decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on
and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the
situation.

Mike Rosenfeld

Mike Rosenfeld

I am not one to publicly lambaste another cyclist but I witnessed such a
huge display stupidity this morning I have to take the time to vent.

The incident took place where Capitol Highway merges onto Barbur Blvd. I
have attached a picture of the area to refresh memories.

There is a bike path for those heading towards downtown to go around the
overpass and then merge back onto Barbur Blvd safely.

It was about 7:45am, pouring down rain, and very low visibility.

I was driving (yes I know...you can pick on me for driving) towards downtown
and was passing under the overpass. I see a cyclist with minimal lighting
and dark cycling gear, The rain jacket was Red, bluish helmet. I would have
to gauge this cyclist as a racer due to the type of bike, smooth spin, and
speed at which he was traveling, also the gear was indicative of someone who
knows how to ride in the rain....speed would be maybe 25 to 30 mph. They
decide to bypass the bike path round-about and go under the over pass.

As I close the distance and pass under the overpass I see a Trimet bus
coming down the ramp getting ready to merge onto Barbur from Capitol.

The cyclist stands up and starts to sprint.

The Bus increases speed.

I slow down in case the cyclist needs to veer into my lane....Every muscle
in my body tenses and I mutter a curse under my breath through clenched jaws
as the cyclist cuts across in front of the bus. And this is no
joke.....there was only 5 feet of clearance between the rear wheel of the
cyclist and the bus...it was even less by the time the cyclist clears the
bumper of the bus and is safely across the lane.

The brake lights on the bus never even flickered.

I really thought I was going to watch this guy die....not just hurt but
actually dead. The bus was doing at least mid 30's and would have smeared
the cyclist for at least 100+ feet before stopping.

This is the sort of thing that gives people legitimate complaints against
cyclists.

I know the argument that some experienced cyclists have with regards to
being in control of their environment and know the limitations of their
handling skills and speeds....but for goodness sake this was just down right
STUPID!!

I hope the cyclist is in fact a racer, a member of OBRA, and is reading
this. My message to you is this:

Your actions impact more than just you. If you had been wrong in your
abilities to clear the buses bumper, I and at least 30+ other people would
have watch you die. *Horribly.* Think of how the driver of the bus would
have felt knowing he or she had taken your life. For what?? 30 extra
seconds? Not wanting to deal a little bit of gravel? Think about this
before you do something like this again. Your actions.....your
decisions....have consequences to yourself and others.

I am a cyclist. I have been riding both competitively and for leisure on
and off for 25 years. I state this to lend credence to my assessment of the
situation.

Mike Rosenfeld