I am very interesting in some open debate on this issue as it directly effects me and my 5 year old son. I personally think he is currently way too young to be in any kind of real race with me today, but was wondering when we could race together as we ride a few days a week now. I was thinking 8 is likely a good age for stokers in mass start events, but I think it depends on the event and I think we need to consider a few things.
1) Crashes still happen, even in parent/child tandem races and we need to consider the effect of a crash on someone under 10 or 8 or whatever the new rule is. I am still very nervous on open rodes with my son as all it will take is one bad moment to cause him more than his fare share of pain or worse. I am thinking here is where 10 is almost a good age for a crit or a road race, but seems too old for a TT. I would even venture to say that 10 is a little on the young side for a crit in many cases, but not all.
2) Endurance and overworking a kid is likely an issue as they hit that middle ground around 8 years old. Today my son coasts as much as he rides and doesn't really get overworked even on a two hour ride. Anything over an hour and I tend to take a break to get him off the saddle. However I would venture to guess that the competitive spirit and understanding of the results will soon change that and I will have to start pushing him to slow down and relax at some point. Here a distance limit seems like a good idea for anyone under a certain age.
3) Drivers age is important as well. A 12 year driving an 8 year is not a good idea, but where is the line? I think a good default is a parent driver for youth, but that seems to restrictive. There just needs to some thought in this area as well as even an 18 year driver with a sub 10 year old stoker in a crit seems like a dangerous idea to me. I was making way to many marginal assumptions at 18 to have a little kid at the whim of each of my crashes. I think I crashed more between 18 and 21 than I have between 22 and 38.
4) Insurance. How does this affect the OBRA insurance policy?
5) Participation. I am far more likely to enter an OBRA youth tandem event if I know that I and my children are being protected to an extent. This means requiring experienced drivers for mass start events and knowing that everyone else in the race has something a little more fragile on the back side. Races bring out aggression and that competitive spirit in me as much as the next person but if everyone is in the same boat, then I think it could be very fun. I know that my sone talks all the time about how he won the blue ribbon at Alpenrose last year. He really wants to race this year.
My current thoughts are that any age should be permitted for a TT, I could even see myself entering a race this year with my 5 year old, and next year with my daughter when she turns 4. Crashes are rare and without all the other riders next to you it would be easy for each parent to ensure that their kids are not overworked and just out to enjoy the event. Not everything needs to be a race to the finish. However I would be very unlikely to enter my son in a crit if there were two adults or even older child stokers. I am not sure what age I would want to subject him to that, but under 10 year old stokers should not be mixed with over ... 14 year old stokers in the same crit or road race ... maybe?
In the end the rules are meant for interpretation and rules are also meant to be changed as needed. I think it is very healthy to have a race of mixed youth and adults as long as the whole group is that way.
My current idea would be something like the following.
Youth tandem races are defined as any race that allows an adult driver (over age 16?, 18?) and a youth stoker (under age 10). Drivers must have previous race experience for mass start races and be at least category 4. For mass start races the driver is recommended to be at least a cat 3 with previous experience racing a tandem.
Events that allow youth stokers must state so on the official flyer for the race. Youth stokers will be permitted in any time trial at the discretion of the promoter. For mass start races youth stokers should be in events with only other youth stokers or junior stokers upto age 14 and with appropriately experienced drivers. While promoters have the ability to combine groups it is not recommended to combine youth tandem events with other tandem groups with the exception already noted of stokers upto age 14. Youth stokers are not allowed to be combined with non tandem events. Tandem events with stokers under the age of 8 cannot be combined with tandem races that include adult stokers for mass start events.
Duration: Youth tandem events are limited in duration. 30 minutes for a crit and 40 miles for a road race. Exceptions for road races with appropriate sag support is allowed.
Equipment: Do we allow the tag-a-long type bikes in TT events? I would assume that a standard tandem would be required for all mass start events, but again to encourage people to come to these events, I think a tag-a-long attachment would be fine for a TT.
So there is a first draft of a rule change ... lets see what happens.
Jamie
----- Original Message -----
From: Brett Luelling
To: OBRA
Sent: Sunday, May 24, 2009 7:08 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Juniors on Tandems
I agree that the rule was probably not originally intended for kids riding stoker on a tandem. Candi has provided a path to correct the issue though, a rule change needs to be proposed and voted on. Any volunteers to propose the rule change?
Brett
On Sat, May 23, 2009 at 11:27 PM, scott hill wrote:
yes let us/me know because i have a young child and we were going to buy a co-motion tandem specifically for this purpose. parent/child tandem racing. if OBRA were to get ride of this type of racing it would really hurt getting kids involved in racing.
scott
--- On Sun, 5/24/09, Salvatore Collura wrote:
From: Salvatore Collura
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Juniors on Tandems
To: "Mike Rosenberg" , cmurray@obra.org, obra@list.obra.org
Date: Sunday, May 24, 2009, 12:07 AM
I agree that the interpretation of this rule should be clearly defined, one way or the other, and soon.
It will affect our categories at 2009 Co-Motion Classic Racing events.
BTW, the parent/child class is the fastest growing group in tandem racing.
-sal
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From: Micros8391@aol.com
Date: Sun, 24 May 2009 00:35:54 -0400
To: cmurray@obra.org; obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Juniors on Tandems
First off, let me make it clear that this new interpretation of rules regarding the age of stokers in tandem races does not affect me personally. My kids are both beyond that age. However, I think this should be reconsidered. I understand that it is probably not possible to change the rules in mid-season (or maybe it is). But, I think this is clearly an issue of interpretation of the rules. And this is a brand new interpretation. Many of the local time trials have been well attended by this demographic. The Co-Motion Classic Tandem Race even includes a C category that does a short time trial and road race that mostly caters to the parent child combination. I am fairly certain that the people who conceived this rule were not considering kids stoking tandems. It makes perfect sense to not allow very young kids to control a bike in a race on open roads or in races with older riders to whom they could pose a danger. However it makes no sense to not allow a young kid to ride behind their parent in a tandem race. We have a big problem in Oregon racing in that there are hardly any kids participating. This will make it even worse. The OBRA Championship race today had 7 total kids between the ages of 10 and 14. That covered four separate categories! Racing tandems with their parents is a great way to give kids exposure to racing, and turn them into life long competitors and fans.
Once again, I am not sure there needs a change in the rules, just an interpretation that makes more sense. Is there a rules interpretation committee or technical advisory committee within OBRA? If there is, that body should consider this issue.
Mike Rosenberg
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