OBRA: OBRA Chat: Ask A Roadie

eric nachtrab

2010-02-01

i think this is over dramatic bs. sometimes people like to socialize and ride in groups. sometimes people prefer to be alone. we are competitive and take being passed by someone else too personally sometimes. let's give this one a rest.

--- On Mon, 2/1/10, david baker wrote:

From: david baker
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask a roadie
To: "Steve Brown" , "Jayson Varney"
Cc: obra@list.obra.org
Date: Monday, February 1, 2010, 11:52 AM

I think it points out the fact that there really is not a lot of camaraderie in cycling, not that there should be any more than any other aspect of life. Group rides, races, and chat rooms are social but a normal encounter on the road is just as eventful as any other encounter, whether it be pedestrian, vehicular, at work, at a bar, at church,etc.
People that notice our disconnectedness are probably sensitive people, and that's good. People that don't notice are content and relatively happy and that's fine.
The thing that is sad is the condition of our society.

I guess I just don't feel it's a good subject to make light of.

----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Brown
To: Jayson Varney
Cc: obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 8:33 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask a roadie

Jayson,

The real question, and it was nothing more than a casual observation was that some people acknowledge riders when they over take them and so do not. Might be as simple as some people are social and some are more private. As a mentioned, I always thought it was the polite thing to do, if possible. Just for me, I never want to be seen as riding faster, with cool stuff and ignoring the little people who do not ride as fast. That does not place a value judgement on the actions of others. I was simply trying to amuse myself and maybe others while pondering one of the very small things in life.
I could really care less about most other riders out there on their own with their heads down. There are several long and boring stories about the reason I may tend toward the more social end when I am riding. Boy, was I surprised at the responses. But if you never ask, you never know.
What puzzles me now, is why someone with clipless pedals and a freewheel would track stand at a stop light. It looks really hard and very uncomfortable. Thanks for reviving my post, I was thinking that Candi would only allow me one stupid semi sarcastic post a year and was fretting about how to ask this question without stirring up the same mess I caused last week.

Perplexed and easily amused at the track.

On Feb 1, 2010, at 7:43 AM, Jayson Varney wrote:

The reason nobody waves at you is because your in the big city and everyone's got the "attitude" that comes with that.
     Leave the city and go ride in say Bender area for example and you will get the wave or the casual hello. Almost every time you will get the two finger what up peace sign.
   Don't be fooled by the B.S. excuses that's given to you from what city people say on O.C. about the riders in P-town. Roadies, here are VERY "Click-ish" and most of them wont give you the time of day.
           I'm speaking from an outsider looking in, hard as it may be to swallow Portlanders but "You all Got some serious Holier than thou ATTITUDE"
                              I swear Obra chat should be a soap opera show on fox called "As the wheel turns",, seriously cry me a river. Stop complaining and ride your freekin bikes. OC should be about ride/race info and or selling gear,, not gossip. Uh...So much drama here better call a WAAMbulance...
Peace...

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david baker

2010-02-01

I think it points out the fact that there really is not a lot of camaraderie in cycling, not that there should be any more than any other aspect of life. Group rides, races, and chat rooms are social but a normal encounter on the road is just as eventful as any other encounter, whether it be pedestrian, vehicular, at work, at a bar, at church,etc.
People that notice our disconnectedness are probably sensitive people, and that's good. People that don't notice are content and relatively happy and that's fine.
The thing that is sad is the condition of our society.

I guess I just don't feel it's a good subject to make light of.

----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Brown
To: Jayson Varney
Cc: obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 8:33 AM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask a roadie

Jayson,

The real question, and it was nothing more than a casual observation was that some people acknowledge riders when they over take them and so do not. Might be as simple as some people are social and some are more private. As a mentioned, I always thought it was the polite thing to do, if possible. Just for me, I never want to be seen as riding faster, with cool stuff and ignoring the little people who do not ride as fast. That does not place a value judgement on the actions of others. I was simply trying to amuse myself and maybe others while pondering one of the very small things in life.
I could really care less about most other riders out there on their own with their heads down. There are several long and boring stories about the reason I may tend toward the more social end when I am riding. Boy, was I surprised at the responses. But if you never ask, you never know.
What puzzles me now, is why someone with clipless pedals and a freewheel would track stand at a stop light. It looks really hard and very uncomfortable. Thanks for reviving my post, I was thinking that Candi would only allow me one stupid semi sarcastic post a year and was fretting about how to ask this question without stirring up the same mess I caused last week.

Perplexed and easily amused at the track.

On Feb 1, 2010, at 7:43 AM, Jayson Varney wrote:

The reason nobody waves at you is because your in the big city and everyone's got the "attitude" that comes with that.
Leave the city and go ride in say Bender area for example and you will get the wave or the casual hello. Almost every time you will get the two finger what up peace sign.
Don't be fooled by the B.S. excuses that's given to you from what city people say on O.C. about the riders in P-town. Roadies, here are VERY "Click-ish" and most of them wont give you the time of day.
I'm speaking from an outsider looking in, hard as it may be to swallow Portlanders but "You all Got some serious Holier than thou ATTITUDE"
I swear Obra chat should be a soap opera show on fox called "As the wheel turns",, seriously cry me a river. Stop complaining and ride your freekin bikes. OC should be about ride/race info and or selling gear,, not gossip. Uh...So much drama here better call a WAAMbulance...
Peace...

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Steve Brown

2010-02-01

Jayson,

The real question, and it was nothing more than a casual observation
was that some people acknowledge riders when they over take them and
so do not. Might be as simple as some people are social and some are
more private. As a mentioned, I always thought it was the polite
thing to do, if possible. Just for me, I never want to be seen as
riding faster, with cool stuff and ignoring the little people who do
not ride as fast. That does not place a value judgement on the
actions of others. I was simply trying to amuse myself and maybe
others while pondering one of the very small things in life.
I could really care less about most other riders out there on their
own with their heads down. There are several long and boring stories
about the reason I may tend toward the more social end when I am
riding. Boy, was I surprised at the responses. But if you never
ask, you never know.
What puzzles me now, is why someone with clipless pedals and a
freewheel would track stand at a stop light. It looks really hard
and very uncomfortable. Thanks for reviving my post, I was thinking
that Candi would only allow me one stupid semi sarcastic post a year
and was fretting about how to ask this question without stirring up
the same mess I caused last week.

Perplexed and easily amused at the track.

On Feb 1, 2010, at 7:43 AM, Jayson Varney wrote:

> The reason nobody waves at you is because your in the big city and
> everyone's got the "attitude" that comes with that.
> Leave the city and go ride in say Bender area for example and
> you will get the wave or the casual hello. Almost every time you
> will get the two finger what up peace sign.
> Don't be fooled by the B.S. excuses that's given to you from
> what city people say on O.C. about the riders in P-town. Roadies,
> here are VERY "Click-ish" and most of them wont give you the time
> of day.
> I'm speaking from an outsider looking in, hard as it may
> be to swallow Portlanders but "You all Got some serious Holier than
> thou ATTITUDE"
> I swear Obra chat should be a soap
> opera show on fox called "As the wheel turns",, seriously cry me a
> river. Stop complaining and ride your freekin bikes. OC should be
> about ride/race info and or selling gear,, not gossip. Uh...So much
> drama here better call a WAAMbulance...
> Peace...
>
> Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. Sign up now.
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Jayson Varney

2010-02-01

The reason nobody waves at you is because your in the big city and everyone's got the "attitude" that comes with that.

Leave the city and go ride in say Bender area for example and you will get the wave or the casual hello. Almost every time you will get the two finger what up peace sign.

Don't be fooled by the B.S. excuses that's given to you from what city people say on O.C. about the riders in P-town. Roadies, here are VERY "Click-ish" and most of them wont give you the time of day.

I'm speaking from an outsider looking in, hard as it may be to swallow Portlanders but "You all Got some serious Holier than thou ATTITUDE"

I swear Obra chat should be a soap opera show on fox called "As the wheel turns",, seriously cry me a river. Stop complaining and ride your freekin bikes. OC should be about ride/race info and or selling gear,, not gossip. Uh...So much drama here better call a WAAMbulance...

Peace...

_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.
http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469227/direct/01/

Brady Brady

2010-01-30

It’s the Rapha ads. One can’t be a true uuuuuber Euro-cool poseur unless one is helmetless, preferably on a slick, foggy mountain descent.

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Robert Anderson
Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 3:47 AM
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

If you are not wearing a helmet while riding, then you obviously have nothing to protect. And if you are riding without a helmet in front of children, you set a bad example. So even if you have no brain, you should still wear a helmet. -Rob Anderson
On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 1:15 PM, Maximillian Kirchoff > wrote:
IT's funny you should mention kits Ron as most commute-racers I run across are actually kitted out. I don't really wear kits on my ride or when I commute. I wear bibs sometimes without anything over them, and many times with jeans over them, so it's difficult to identify me as anything more than a regular commuter. The fun part about that is the tri guys or cat 4s who seem to think that since I'm a large dude and not kitted out they must pass me, which is often-times rather funny. Especially when they attack me uphill, then quickly run out of gas and start huffing and puffing in car lane to my left as I steadily keep my cadence. I don't hold any ill-will towards them, I think it's more funny than anything. I'm just trying to get home most of the time, not win the tour. Which, on a small tagent I wanted to mention a funny trend I've began to see. I'm not sure if it's new racers who don't understand helmets, old racers who just don't like them, or people that are just forgetful...but wearing a full winter kit, winter cap, gloves, shoe covers, clipped into your pedal is pretty damn funny when you're not wearing a helmet. Spending all that time and money to train in the winter on the road, without the one thing that can actually save your life in a tough spot. Hell I've ridden without helmets...in jeans and a tshirt, on my way to the store. But a training ride fully kitted out....hiiiiilarious. Especially since a helmet is probably the least dorky looking thing in a kit.

But I digress. We're all just peoples. I often, in my jeans and windbreaker, wave to roadies and commuters alike just to get a snarl or grimace. But it doesn't bother me, I'm just trying to be nice. Just be the bigger person and spit into the draft. haha.

______________{ :)
Max Kirchoff
(503) 770-0629
max@maxisnow.com
http://www.maxisnow.com
http://www.treesbybike.com
http://portfolio.maxisnow.com

On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 12:59 PM, Ron and Dorothy Strasser > wrote:
From my perspective that is a good time to give the "commuter" trying staying on your wheel some positive comments, then point them toward PIR. This happens all the time (especially if you are wearing a kit)... regular riders who do not see themselves as racers.... go through an instant transformation.... and become Lance. Usually they fade after a few blocks at most, but some are pretty strong. It is human nature. Giving them some positive feedback is good for society and might even get a new obra member. I wave to most other riders if I am not sucking air big time or it is unsafe. I think it is a very good thing to wave or say hi to other riders especially if wearing a kit. It is that type of behavior that removes barriers instead of producing perceived or real ones. All this said, I do not feel bad is someone does not wave or say hi to me. The great thing about cycling is it can be a social or private activity.
go ride.
ron
----- Original Message -----
From: Dan Silvernail
To: obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Friday, January 29, 2010 12:24 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

I'm glad that the record has been set straight. Up until today I would just get completely bummed out when someone didn't return my little chin raise whenever I'd pass them. Sorry to anyone that I yelled "Unsociable pr**ck" to. (I kid!) (I'm just as guilty as the next guy of not extending a full-on warm embrace to anyone on a bike that I encounter. I wave and not and that's good enough)
Hell, while I have the floor, here is something that eats at me and I want to know why people do this: why, oh why, do people just have to speed up and "get on my wheel" whenever I pass them? It doesn't matter if I'm commuting through downtown or on a training ride up on Skyline. Whenever I approach someone while out riding, I'm at the point where I feel the need to "attack" them instead of rolling past because if I just roll past (saying HI to them as I pass), 8 out of 10 people on bikes will stick right to my rear wheel. Why? I don't have this problem when I'm out walking or running. I mean, if you were walking your dog and passed a slower walker and they picked up the pace and started walking step for step 6" back of you, what would you think? I'd turn the dog loose on them! That's what I'd do! (well, not really, my dog is a chicken ass who'd just beg for a cookie). Anyway. Next time someone wants to draft off of me, I'll tell them to take out an OBRA licence and go up to PIR and race. There, it's OK to ride someone's ass.

Rant over. Let the weekend begin!
On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 12:04 PM, Erik Long > wrote:
Yeah, dude. Some people just aren't social animals. Often when a rider goes riding alone, he does so specifically to ride alone - in fact, that's almost always the case. There are other factors - the guy could be riding on a very limited schedule, possibly in the middle of a structured workout, who knows.

If you're on a group ride, you can expect more of a social event. There's no reason to take offense just because a lone rider didn't smile and wave from the other side of the road. This is a silly reason to get bent out of shape.

________________________________
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 11:10:25 -0800
From: tackyglueit@gmail.com
To: sbrown@stevebrowncompany.com
CC: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

you're a clown. maybe the guys dog just died. the world is bigger then you.
On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Steve Brown > wrote:
Dear Ask A Roadie,

I seem to need some help regarding the secret handshake. Even though I am fairly sociable when I riding, every once in a while someone will simply ride by with their head down. I always thought that even if you wanted to be left alone, at least acknowledging the overtaken rider was the polite thing to do. One thought is that these are tri's who have taken off the aero bars and are not real roadies.
I have a cool bike, wear a cycling hat with the bill turned up under my helmet, and wear red aero covers over my booties or shoes. Are these riders just showing me "they are the man". Should I latch on to their wheel, and then sprint by to show them I am the man?
What am I missing?

Steve Brown
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Robert Anderson

2010-01-30

If you are not wearing a helmet while riding, then you obviously have
nothing to protect. And if you are riding without a helmet in front of
children, you set a bad example. So even if you have no brain, you should
still wear a helmet. -Rob Anderson

On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 1:15 PM, Maximillian Kirchoff wrote:

> IT's funny you should mention kits Ron as most commute-racers I run across
> are actually kitted out. I don't really wear kits on my ride or when I
> commute. I wear bibs sometimes without anything over them, and many times
> with jeans over them, so it's difficult to identify me as anything more than
> a regular commuter. The fun part about that is the tri guys or cat 4s who
> seem to think that since I'm a large dude and not kitted out they must pass
> me, which is often-times rather funny. Especially when they attack me
> uphill, then quickly run out of gas and start huffing and puffing in car
> lane to my left as I steadily keep my cadence. I don't hold any ill-will
> towards them, I think it's more funny than anything. I'm just trying to get
> home most of the time, not win the tour. Which, on a small tagent I wanted
> to mention a funny trend I've began to see. I'm not sure if it's new racers
> who don't understand helmets, old racers who just don't like them, or people
> that are just forgetful...but wearing a full winter kit, winter cap, gloves,
> shoe covers, clipped into your pedal is pretty damn funny when you're not
> wearing a helmet. Spending all that time and money to train in the winter on
> the road, without the one thing that can actually save your life in a tough
> spot. Hell I've ridden without helmets...in jeans and a tshirt, on my way to
> the store. But a training ride fully kitted out....hiiiiilarious. Especially
> since a helmet is probably the least dorky looking thing in a kit.
>
> But I digress. We're all just peoples. I often, in my jeans and
> windbreaker, wave to roadies and commuters alike just to get a snarl or
> grimace. But it doesn't bother me, I'm just trying to be nice. Just be the
> bigger person and spit into the draft. haha.
>
> ______________{ :)
> Max Kirchoff
> (503) 770-0629
> max@maxisnow.com
> http://www.maxisnow.com
> http://www.treesbybike.com
> http://portfolio.maxisnow.com
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 12:59 PM, Ron and Dorothy Strasser <
> rondot@spiritone.com> wrote:
>
>> From my perspective that is a good time to give the "commuter" trying
>> staying on your wheel some positive comments, then point them toward PIR.
>> This happens all the time (especially if you are wearing a kit)... regular
>> riders who do not see themselves as racers.... go through an instant
>> transformation.... and become Lance. Usually they fade after a few blocks
>> at most, but some are pretty strong. It is human nature. Giving them some
>> positive feedback is good for society and might even get a new obra member.
>> I wave to most other riders if I am not sucking air big time or it is
>> unsafe. I think it is a very good thing to wave or say hi to other riders
>> especially if wearing a kit. It is that type of behavior that removes
>> barriers instead of producing perceived or real ones. All this said, I do
>> not feel bad is someone does not wave or say hi to me. The great thing
>> about cycling is it can be a social or private activity.
>> go ride.
>> ron
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> *From:* Dan Silvernail
>> *To:* obra@list.obra.org
>> *Sent:* Friday, January 29, 2010 12:24 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie
>>
>> I'm glad that the record has been set straight. Up until today I would
>> just get completely bummed out when someone didn't return my little chin
>> raise whenever I'd pass them. Sorry to anyone that I yelled "Unsociable
>> pr**ck" to. (I kid!) (I'm just as guilty as the next guy of not extending
>> a full-on warm embrace to anyone on a bike that I encounter. I wave and not
>> and that's good enough)
>> Hell, while I have the floor, here is something that eats at me and I want
>> to know why people do this: why, oh why, do people just have to speed up
>> and "get on my wheel" whenever I pass them? It doesn't matter if I'm
>> commuting through downtown or on a training ride up on Skyline. Whenever I
>> approach someone while out riding, I'm at the point where I feel the need to
>> "attack" them instead of rolling past because if I just roll past (saying HI
>> to them as I pass), 8 out of 10 people on bikes will stick right to my rear
>> wheel. Why? I don't have this problem when I'm out walking or running. I
>> mean, if you were walking your dog and passed a slower walker and they
>> picked up the pace and started walking step for step 6" back of you, what
>> would you think? I'd turn the dog loose on them! That's what I'd do!
>> (well, not really, my dog is a chicken ass who'd just beg for a cookie).
>> Anyway. Next time someone wants to draft off of me, I'll tell them to take
>> out an OBRA licence and go up to PIR and race. There, it's OK to ride
>> someone's ass.
>>
>> Rant over. Let the weekend begin!
>> On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 12:04 PM, Erik Long wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah, dude. Some people just aren't social animals. Often when a rider
>>> goes riding alone, he does so specifically to ride alone - in fact, that's
>>> almost always the case. There are other factors - the guy could be riding
>>> on a very limited schedule, possibly in the middle of a structured workout,
>>> who knows.
>>>
>>> If you're on a group ride, you can expect more of a social event.
>>> There's no reason to take offense just because a lone rider didn't smile and
>>> wave from the other side of the road. This is a silly reason to get bent
>>> out of shape.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>> Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 11:10:25 -0800
>>> From: tackyglueit@gmail.com
>>> To: sbrown@stevebrowncompany.com
>>> CC: obra@list.obra.org
>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie
>>>
>>>
>>> you're a clown. maybe the guys dog just died. the world is bigger then
>>> you.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Steve Brown <
>>> sbrown@stevebrowncompany.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Dear Ask A Roadie,
>>>
>>> I seem to need some help regarding the secret handshake. Even
>>> though I am fairly sociable when I riding, every once in a while someone
>>> will simply ride by with their head down. I always thought that even if you
>>> wanted to be left alone, at least acknowledging the overtaken rider was the
>>> polite thing to do. One thought is that these are tri's who have taken off
>>> the aero bars and are not real roadies.
>>> I have a cool bike, wear a cycling hat with the bill turned up under my
>>> helmet, and wear red aero covers over my booties or shoes. Are these riders
>>> just showing me "they are the man". Should I latch on to their wheel, and
>>> then sprint by to show them I am the man?
>>> What am I missing?
>>>
>>>
>>> Steve Brown
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OBRA mailing list
>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>> Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now.
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OBRA mailing list
>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>
>>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
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>>
>>
>
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Randy Dreiling

2010-01-29

Good one!

Randy Dreiling
Owner - Oregon Adventures www.oregon-adventures.com
Promoter - Mt Bike Oregon www.mtbikeoregon.com

----- Original Message ----
From: Rick Johnson
To: joec@aracnet.com
Cc: obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Fri, January 29, 2010 2:54:17 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

Ah, we've finally stumbled upon the real reason we start scheduling races in the middle of winter!
;-)

Rick Johnson
Bend, Oregon

Every revolutionary idea seems to evoke three stages of reaction...
One, it's completely impossible. Two, it's possible, but it's not worth doing. Three, I said it was a good idea all along.

Arthur C. Clarke

Joe Cipale wrote:
> Damn I will be SOO GLAD when racing season starts...
> _______________________________________________
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Rick Johnson

2010-01-29

Ah, we've finally stumbled upon the real reason we start scheduling
races in the middle of winter!
;-)

Rick Johnson
Bend, Oregon

Every revolutionary idea seems to evoke three stages of reaction...
One, it's completely impossible.
Two, it's possible, but it's not worth doing.
Three, I said it was a good idea all along.

Arthur C. Clarke

Joe Cipale wrote:
> Damn I will be SOO GLAD when racing season starts...
> _______________________________________________
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> obra@list.obra.org
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>
>

Jim Moore

2010-01-29

How about if you do the Seattle to Portland in one day and draft someone's wheel the whole way(and not a word the entire 200 miles) and pass him/her for the photo finish? bad form?

> Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 14:43:41 -0800
> From: joec@aracnet.com
> To: jimmym808@hotmail.com
> CC: dansilvernail@gmail.com; obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie
>
> Damn I will be SOO GLAD when racing season starts...

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Joe Cipale

2010-01-29

Damn I will be SOO GLAD when racing season starts...

Jim Moore

2010-01-29

Maybe you smell like the fallen sweat on the padded floor of Kobra-kai's Dojo, and the passed person is compelled to follow out of sheer respect for you awesomeness.

Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 12:24:56 -0800
From: dansilvernail@gmail.com
To: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

I'm glad that the record has been set straight. Up until today I would just get completely bummed out when someone didn't return my little chin raise whenever I'd pass them. Sorry to anyone that I yelled "Unsociable pr**ck" to. (I kid!) (I'm just as guilty as the next guy of not extending a full-on warm embrace to anyone on a bike that I encounter. I wave and not and that's good enough)

Hell, while I have the floor, here is something that eats at me and I want to know why people do this: why, oh why, do people just have to speed up and "get on my wheel" whenever I pass them? It doesn't matter if I'm commuting through downtown or on a training ride up on Skyline. Whenever I approach someone while out riding, I'm at the point where I feel the need to "attack" them instead of rolling past because if I just roll past (saying HI to them as I pass), 8 out of 10 people on bikes will stick right to my rear wheel. Why? I don't have this problem when I'm out walking or running. I mean, if you were walking your dog and passed a slower walker and they picked up the pace and started walking step for step 6" back of you, what would you think? I'd turn the dog loose on them! That's what I'd do! (well, not really, my dog is a chicken ass who'd just beg for a cookie). Anyway. Next time someone wants to draft off of me, I'll tell them to take out an OBRA licence and go up to PIR and race. There, it's OK to ride someone's ass.

Rant over. Let the weekend begin!

On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 12:04 PM, Erik Long wrote:

Yeah, dude. Some people just aren't social animals. Often when a rider goes riding alone, he does so specifically to ride alone - in fact, that's almost always the case. There are other factors - the guy could be riding on a very limited schedule, possibly in the middle of a structured workout, who knows.

If you're on a group ride, you can expect more of a social event. There's no reason to take offense just because a lone rider didn't smile and wave from the other side of the road. This is a silly reason to get bent out of shape.

Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 11:10:25 -0800
From: tackyglueit@gmail.com
To: sbrown@stevebrowncompany.com
CC: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

you're a clown. maybe the guys dog just died. the world is bigger then you.

On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Steve Brown wrote:

Dear Ask A Roadie,

I seem to need some help regarding the secret handshake. Even though I am fairly sociable when I riding, every once in a while someone will simply ride by with their head down. I always thought that even if you wanted to be left alone, at least acknowledging the overtaken rider was the polite thing to do. One thought is that these are tri's who have taken off the aero bars and are not real roadies.
I have a cool bike, wear a cycling hat with the bill turned up under my helmet, and wear red aero covers over my booties or shoes. Are these riders just showing me "they are the man". Should I latch on to their wheel, and then sprint by to show them I am the man?
What am I missing?

Steve Brown
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eric aldinger

2010-01-29

I call it commuter tactics. You're just mad because I beat you to the stop
sign.

Actually I really hate people not sharing the burden of pulling.

On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 2:33 PM, Long, Steve wrote:

> It’s also bad form to sit on a guys wheel for the length of the
> Springwater quarter from OMSI to Spokane st and then attack him toward the
> end. I’ve actually had guys team up on me to do this. Sheesh!
>
>
>
> *From:* obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] *On
> Behalf Of *Jerald M Powell
> *Sent:* Friday, January 29, 2010 2:30 PM
> *To:* Dan Silvernail
> *Cc:* obra@list.obra.org
> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie
>
>
>
> Dan, are you sure you're just envious of the old guy that can catch your
> wheel? Hey, if there's a faster wheel going by my front wheel, I'll grab it
> in a second. It is, however (IMHO) bad form to half-wheel whoever it is I'm
> getting a free (well, 30% free) ride off of.
>
>
>
> Jerry
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 29, 2010, at 12:24 PM, Dan Silvernail wrote:
>
>
>
> I'm glad that the record has been set straight. Up until today I would
> just get completely bummed out when someone didn't return my little chin
> raise whenever I'd pass them. Sorry to anyone that I yelled "Unsociable
> pr**ck" to. (I kid!) (I'm just as guilty as the next guy of not extending
> a full-on warm embrace to anyone on a bike that I encounter. I wave and not
> and that's good enough)
>
> Hell, while I have the floor, here is something that eats at me and I want
> to know why people do this: why, oh why, do people just have to speed up
> and "get on my wheel" whenever I pass them? It doesn't matter if I'm
> commuting through downtown or on a training ride up on Skyline. Whenever I
> approach someone while out riding, I'm at the point where I feel the need to
> "attack" them instead of rolling past because if I just roll past (saying HI
> to them as I pass), 8 out of 10 people on bikes will stick right to my rear
> wheel. Why? I don't have this problem when I'm out walking or running. I
> mean, if you were walking your dog and passed a slower walker and they
> picked up the pace and started walking step for step 6" back of you, what
> would you think? I'd turn the dog loose on them! That's what I'd do!
> (well, not really, my dog is a chicken ass who'd just beg for a cookie).
> Anyway. Next time someone wants to draft off of me, I'll tell them to take
> out an OBRA licence and go up to PIR and race. There, it's OK to ride
> someone's ass.
>
>
>
> Rant over. Let the weekend begin!
>
> On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 12:04 PM, Erik Long wrote:
>
> Yeah, dude. Some people just aren't social animals. Often when a rider
> goes riding alone, he does so specifically to ride alone - in fact, that's
> almost always the case. There are other factors - the guy could be riding
> on a very limited schedule, possibly in the middle of a structured workout,
> who knows.
>
> If you're on a group ride, you can expect more of a social event. There's
> no reason to take offense just because a lone rider didn't smile and wave
> from the other side of the road. This is a silly reason to get bent out of
> shape.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 11:10:25 -0800
> From: tackyglueit@gmail.com
> To: sbrown@stevebrowncompany.com
> CC: obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie
>
>
>
> you're a clown. maybe the guys dog just died. the world is bigger then
> you.
>
> On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Steve Brown <
> sbrown@stevebrowncompany.com> wrote:
>
> Dear Ask A Roadie,
>
> I seem to need some help regarding the secret handshake. Even
> though I am fairly sociable when I riding, every once in a while someone
> will simply ride by with their head down. I always thought that even if you
> wanted to be left alone, at least acknowledging the overtaken rider was the
> polite thing to do. One thought is that these are tri's who have taken off
> the aero bars and are not real roadies.
> I have a cool bike, wear a cycling hat with the bill turned up under my
> helmet, and wear red aero covers over my booties or shoes. Are these riders
> just showing me "they are the man". Should I latch on to their wheel, and
> then sprint by to show them I am the man?
> What am I missing?
>
>
> Steve Brown
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>

--
Eric Aldinger

Long, Steve

2010-01-29

It's also bad form to sit on a guys wheel for the length of the
Springwater quarter from OMSI to Spokane st and then attack him toward
the end. I've actually had guys team up on me to do this. Sheesh!

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Jerald M Powell
Sent: Friday, January 29, 2010 2:30 PM
To: Dan Silvernail
Cc: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

Dan, are you sure you're just envious of the old guy that can catch your
wheel? Hey, if there's a faster wheel going by my front wheel, I'll
grab it in a second. It is, however (IMHO) bad form to half-wheel
whoever it is I'm getting a free (well, 30% free) ride off of.

Jerry

On Jan 29, 2010, at 12:24 PM, Dan Silvernail wrote:

I'm glad that the record has been set straight. Up until today I would
just get completely bummed out when someone didn't return my little chin
raise whenever I'd pass them. Sorry to anyone that I yelled
"Unsociable pr**ck" to. (I kid!) (I'm just as guilty as the next guy
of not extending a full-on warm embrace to anyone on a bike that I
encounter. I wave and not and that's good enough)

Hell, while I have the floor, here is something that eats at me and I
want to know why people do this: why, oh why, do people just have to
speed up and "get on my wheel" whenever I pass them? It doesn't matter
if I'm commuting through downtown or on a training ride up on Skyline.
Whenever I approach someone while out riding, I'm at the point where I
feel the need to "attack" them instead of rolling past because if I just
roll past (saying HI to them as I pass), 8 out of 10 people on bikes
will stick right to my rear wheel. Why? I don't have this problem when
I'm out walking or running. I mean, if you were walking your dog and
passed a slower walker and they picked up the pace and started walking
step for step 6" back of you, what would you think? I'd turn the dog
loose on them! That's what I'd do! (well, not really, my dog is a
chicken ass who'd just beg for a cookie). Anyway. Next time someone
wants to draft off of me, I'll tell them to take out an OBRA licence and
go up to PIR and race. There, it's OK to ride someone's ass.

Rant over. Let the weekend begin!

On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 12:04 PM, Erik Long
wrote:

Yeah, dude. Some people just aren't social animals. Often when a rider
goes riding alone, he does so specifically to ride alone - in fact,
that's almost always the case. There are other factors - the guy could
be riding on a very limited schedule, possibly in the middle of a
structured workout, who knows.

If you're on a group ride, you can expect more of a social event.
There's no reason to take offense just because a lone rider didn't smile
and wave from the other side of the road. This is a silly reason to get
bent out of shape.

________________________________

Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 11:10:25 -0800
From: tackyglueit@gmail.com
To: sbrown@stevebrowncompany.com
CC: obra@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

you're a clown. maybe the guys dog just died. the world is bigger then
you.

On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Steve Brown
wrote:

Dear Ask A Roadie,

I seem to need some help regarding the secret handshake. Even
though I am fairly sociable when I riding, every once in a while someone
will simply ride by with their head down. I always thought that even if
you wanted to be left alone, at least acknowledging the overtaken rider
was the polite thing to do. One thought is that these are tri's who
have taken off the aero bars and are not real roadies.
I have a cool bike, wear a cycling hat with the bill turned up under my
helmet, and wear red aero covers over my booties or shoes. Are these
riders just showing me "they are the man". Should I latch on to their
wheel, and then sprint by to show them I am the man?
What am I missing?

Steve Brown
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

________________________________

Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now.

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Jerald M Powell

2010-01-29

Dan, are you sure you're just envious of the old guy that can catch
your wheel? Hey, if there's a faster wheel going by my front wheel,
I'll grab it in a second. It is, however (IMHO) bad form to half-
wheel whoever it is I'm getting a free (well, 30% free) ride off of.

Jerry

On Jan 29, 2010, at 12:24 PM, Dan Silvernail wrote:

> I'm glad that the record has been set straight. Up until today I
> would just get completely bummed out when someone didn't return my
> little chin raise whenever I'd pass them. Sorry to anyone that I
> yelled "Unsociable pr**ck" to. (I kid!) (I'm just as guilty as the
> next guy of not extending a full-on warm embrace to anyone on a bike
> that I encounter. I wave and not and that's good enough)
> Hell, while I have the floor, here is something that eats at me and
> I want to know why people do this: why, oh why, do people just have
> to speed up and "get on my wheel" whenever I pass them? It doesn't
> matter if I'm commuting through downtown or on a training ride up on
> Skyline. Whenever I approach someone while out riding, I'm at the
> point where I feel the need to "attack" them instead of rolling past
> because if I just roll past (saying HI to them as I pass), 8 out of
> 10 people on bikes will stick right to my rear wheel. Why? I don't
> have this problem when I'm out walking or running. I mean, if you
> were walking your dog and passed a slower walker and they picked up
> the pace and started walking step for step 6" back of you, what
> would you think? I'd turn the dog loose on them! That's what I'd
> do! (well, not really, my dog is a chicken ass who'd just beg for a
> cookie). Anyway. Next time someone wants to draft off of me, I'll
> tell them to take out an OBRA licence and go up to PIR and race.
> There, it's OK to ride someone's ass.
>
> Rant over. Let the weekend begin!
> On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 12:04 PM, Erik Long
> wrote:
> Yeah, dude. Some people just aren't social animals. Often when a
> rider goes riding alone, he does so specifically to ride alone - in
> fact, that's almost always the case. There are other factors - the
> guy could be riding on a very limited schedule, possibly in the
> middle of a structured workout, who knows.
>
> If you're on a group ride, you can expect more of a social event.
> There's no reason to take offense just because a lone rider didn't
> smile and wave from the other side of the road. This is a silly
> reason to get bent out of shape.
>
>
>
> Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 11:10:25 -0800
> From: tackyglueit@gmail.com
> To: sbrown@stevebrowncompany.com
> CC: obra@list.obra.org
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie
>
>
> you're a clown. maybe the guys dog just died. the world is bigger
> then you.
>
> On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Steve Brown > wrote:
> Dear Ask A Roadie,
>
> I seem to need some help regarding the secret handshake.
> Even though I am fairly sociable when I riding, every once in a
> while someone will simply ride by with their head down. I always
> thought that even if you wanted to be left alone, at least
> acknowledging the overtaken rider was the polite thing to do. One
> thought is that these are tri's who have taken off the aero bars and
> are not real roadies.
> I have a cool bike, wear a cycling hat with the bill turned up under
> my helmet, and wear red aero covers over my booties or shoes. Are
> these riders just showing me "they are the man". Should I latch on
> to their wheel, and then sprint by to show them I am the man?
> What am I missing?
>
>
> Steve Brown
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
> Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now.
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

david baker

2010-01-29

I know that some people out there are suffering from mental illness. I
believe as a society we underestimate the number of people suffering.
Exercise is often used as a coping tool for mental illness. Those people
could be some of the most loving thoughtful people you will ever see. I have
spent thousands of hours using exercise as a coping tool for my illness. It
is not an easy life.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Brown"
To: "OBRA remailer"
Sent: Friday, January 29, 2010 10:45 AM
Subject: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

> Dear Ask A Roadie,
>
> I seem to need some help regarding the secret handshake. Even though I
> am fairly sociable when I riding, every once in a while someone will
> simply ride by with their head down. I always thought that even if you
> wanted to be left alone, at least acknowledging the overtaken rider was
> the polite thing to do. One thought is that these are tri's who have
> taken off the aero bars and are not real roadies.
> I have a cool bike, wear a cycling hat with the bill turned up under my
> helmet, and wear red aero covers over my booties or shoes. Are these
> riders just showing me "they are the man". Should I latch on to their
> wheel, and then sprint by to show them I am the man?
> What am I missing?
>
>
> Steve Brown
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>

Jess Mace

2010-01-29

As the wise man, Robert Anderson, once said…if you race bikes and someone decides to draft off your wheel on a ride, do what you can to drop them. If you can’t drop them, recruit them.

Jess Mace, MPH, CCRP
Clinical Outcomes Research - Oregon Sinus Center
Department of Otolaryngology - Head and Neck Surgery
Oregon Health & Science University
503.494.5886

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On Behalf Of Steve Brown
Sent: Friday, January 29, 2010 1:31 PM
To: Dan Silvernail
Cc: OBRA remailer
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Ask A Roadie

Dan,

Great question. And as a compulsive wheel sucker I might be qualified to answer to some degree. My first thought is always, free ride. If you look like you are able to ride with someone on your wheel, and somewhat in your own space, then you probably did not care someone was back behind you. No asking to ride along or bother, just taking advantage of the draft. Usually thank them for the pull.
I never want to invade someone's space. So I appreciate the perspective.
On the social contract side, my rational has been that if someone rides by me and does not acknowledge me I am not butt hurt. But I take that as a sign that you really don't care who else is on the road and so why should you care if someone is behind you as long as they are safe. If someone rides by me, gives the acknowledgment and rides off, I would take that as a signal that they want or need to be left alone.
I am thinking that there should be a signal so that we can all identify each other, social riders vs soloists and so no one is offended. I have met some wonderful people by chance encounters. I don't do a lot of team rides, so riding can be a social event for me. Maybe on that side, I am also conscious of overtaking riders. Never want to be considered an elitist roadie inconsiderate of the little people.
And as such I have never had anyone latch on to my wheel.
I know now that I will forever more be aware of the taking a wheel unasked. By the way, is there a proper way to ask to draft or is it that if you have to ask you should not.