Long, Steve

Wow, if I were going to have this type of insurance, I think I'd look
elsewhere. It sounds like AFLAC's paying anything is highly unlikely.

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Gregg Magnus
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 11:10 AM
To: Mark Ginsburg; obra@list.obra.org; ty_naugle@us.aflac.com
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Supplemental Insurance - the final word.

So after seeing everything posted and falsely believing that AFLAC would
indeed cover since I had spoken with my Rep initially I emailed AFLAC to
get an answer from them. I have an accident policy, the older one as
well as disability rider. After one response that would not answer my
questions at all this was there final response:

Thank you for your recent inquiry. Per your request and per your policy
limitations and exclusions section, participating in any organized
sporting event (bike racing) where you receive any type of wage,
compensation or profit benefits would not be payable however; if you are
participating in an organized sporting event where you are not receiving
any type of wage, compensation or profit we will review for possible
benefits.

If we can be of further assistance, please let us know.

Thank you for choosing Aflac.

Sincerely,

Aflac Client Services Support

J4M

I am being told that the new policy they have may be different and am
waiting for my rep to find out from Aflac. So if they don't cover me in
bicycle racing then they are losing my business and I will seek out one
of the companies that others reccomended.

Gregg

________________________________

Date: Thu, 19 May 2011 09:31:17 -0700
From: markjginsberg@yahoo.com
To: obra@list.obra.org; ty_naugle@us.aflac.com
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Supplemental Insurance - the final word.

Again, with all due respect to Ty, who is cc'd here.

The person selling the policy is not the person down the road who makes
the coverage decision.

so while Ty can tell you what he thinks, and honestly believes,
regardless of company, it is someone else down the line who deals with
claims and coverage later.

Take car insurance for example. Many people say their car is only for
pleasure use. then one day they driver to work and the boss asks them to
bring something to the post office, while driving to the post office,
the rearend someone.
No Coverage? Maybe. could the insurance company deny, as the use was not
part of what they were insuring? Yes. do they? Usually not. Have they
sometimes? Yes.

Mark

Mark J. Ginsberg
Berkshire Ginsberg, LLC
Attorneys At Law
1216 SE Belmont St.
Portland, OR 97214
(503) 542-3000
Fax (503) 233-6874
markjginsberg@yahoo.com
www.bikesafetylaw.com

________________________________

From: Noel Snodgrass
To: obra@list.obra.org; Ty Naugle
Sent: Wed, May 18, 2011 1:20:58 PM
Subject: [OBRA Chat] Supplemental Insurance - the final word.

As I deal with insurance companies on a daily basis I thought I'd look
in to the whole AFLAC flack that was flying around.
Ty Naugle is an insurance broker and trainer for AFLAC, and really knows
his stuff. I send people his way all the time.
Here's what he has to say regarding their plans and how they affect
amateur bicycle racing.

"Thank you for bringing this to my attention. The problem is that the
person reading the brochure is reading the "Old" plan. The Aflac
accident plan was upgraded a little over a year ago and the new plan
will cover most of the mentioned events. There is even an accidental
death benefit specific to "Hazardous Activities". The current version of
our accident plan should cover these events. The current plan is knows
as the Accident Indemnity Advantage plan. The old plan was known as the
Personal Accident Indemnity plan.

I'm happy to discuss more or to answer any questions. Please contact me
on my cell at 503-381-3513 for more information.

Regards,

Ty Naugle
Aflac
503-383-3513 cell
ty_naugle@us.aflac.com"

Feel free to give him a call, and he'll answer all your questions!
Cheers!

--

Dr. Noel Snodgrass
Chiropractic Physician

Appointments always available online!
web: http://www.portlandchi.com
office: (503) 213-3745

_______________________________________________ OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

This e-mail and related attachments and any response may be subject to public disclosure under state law.

Gregg Magnus

So after seeing everything posted and falsely believing that AFLAC would indeed cover since I had spoken with my Rep initially I emailed AFLAC to get an answer from them. I have an accident policy, the older one as well as disability rider. After one response that would not answer my questions at all this was there final response:

Thank you for your recent inquiry. Per your request and per your policy limitations and exclusions section, participating in any organized sporting event (bike racing) where you receive any type of wage, compensation or profit benefits would not be payable however; if you are participating in an organized sporting event where you are not receiving any type of wage, compensation or profit we will review for possible benefits.

If we can be of further assistance, please let us know.

Thank you for choosing Aflac.

Sincerely,

Aflac Client Services Support
J4M

I am being told that the new policy they have may be different and am waiting for my rep to find out from Aflac. So if they don't cover me in bicycle racing then they are losing my business and I will seek out one of the companies that others reccomended.

Gregg

Date: Thu, 19 May 2011 09:31:17 -0700
From: markjginsberg@yahoo.com
To: obra@list.obra.org; ty_naugle@us.aflac.com
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Supplemental Insurance - the final word.

Again, with all due respect to Ty, who is cc'd here.

The person selling the policy is not the person down the road who makes the coverage decision.

so while Ty can tell you what he thinks, and honestly believes, regardless of company, it is someone else down the line who deals with claims and coverage later.

Take car insurance for example. Many people say their car is only for pleasure use. then one day they driver to work and the boss asks them to bring something to the post office, while driving to the post office, the rearend someone.
No Coverage? Maybe. could the insurance company deny, as the use was not part of what they were insuring? Yes. do they? Usually not. Have they sometimes? Yes.

Mark

Mark J. Ginsberg
Berkshire Ginsberg, LLC
Attorneys At Law
1216 SE Belmont St.
Portland, OR 97214
(503) 542-3000
Fax (503) 233-6874
markjginsberg@yahoo.com
www.bikesafetylaw.com

From: Noel Snodgrass
To: obra@list.obra.org; Ty Naugle
Sent: Wed, May 18, 2011 1:20:58 PM
Subject: [OBRA Chat] Supplemental Insurance - the final word.

As I deal with insurance companies on a daily basis I thought I'd look in to the whole AFLAC flack that was flying around.
Ty Naugle is an insurance broker and trainer for AFLAC, and really knows his stuff. I send people his way all the time.
Here's what he has to say regarding their plans and how they affect amateur bicycle racing.

"Thank you for bringing this to my attention. The problem is that the person reading the brochure is reading the "Old" plan. The Aflac accident plan was upgraded a little over a year ago and the new plan will cover most of the mentioned events. There is even an accidental death benefit specific to "Hazardous Activities". The current version of our accident plan should cover these events. The current plan is knows as the Accident Indemnity Advantage plan. The old plan was known as the Personal Accident Indemnity plan. I'm happy to discuss more or to answer any questions. Please contact me on my cell at 503-381-3513 for more information.

Regards,

Ty Naugle
Aflac
503-383-3513 cell
ty_naugle@us.aflac.com"

Feel free to give him a call, and he'll answer all your questions!
Cheers!
--

Dr. Noel Snodgrass
Chiropractic Physician

Appointments always available online!
web: http://www.portlandchi.com
office: (503) 213-3745

_______________________________________________ OBRA mailing list obra@list.obra.org http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Mark J. Ginsberg

Again, with all due respect to Ty, who is cc'd here.

The person selling the policy is not the person down the road who makes the
coverage decision.

so while Ty can tell you what he thinks, and honestly believes, regardless of
company, it is someone else down the line who deals with claims and coverage
later.

Take car insurance for example. Many people say their car is only for pleasure
use. then one day they driver to work and the boss asks them to bring something
to the post office, while driving to the post office, the rearend someone.
No Coverage? Maybe. could the insurance company deny, as the use was not part of
what they were insuring? Yes. do they? Usually not. Have they sometimes? Yes.

Mark

Mark J. Ginsberg
Berkshire Ginsberg, LLC
Attorneys At Law
1216 SE Belmont St.
Portland, OR 97214
(503) 542-3000
Fax (503) 233-6874
markjginsberg@yahoo.com
www.bikesafetylaw.com

________________________________
From: Noel Snodgrass
To: obra@list.obra.org; Ty Naugle
Sent: Wed, May 18, 2011 1:20:58 PM
Subject: [OBRA Chat] Supplemental Insurance - the final word.

As I deal with insurance companies on a daily basis I thought I'd look in to
the whole AFLAC flack that was flying around.
Ty Naugle is an insurance broker and trainer for AFLAC, and really knows his
stuff. I send people his way all the time.
Here's what he has to say regarding their plans and how they affect amateur
bicycle racing.

"Thank you for bringing this to my attention. The problem is that the person
reading the brochure is reading the "Old" plan. The Aflac accident plan was
upgraded a little over a year ago and the new plan will cover most of the
mentioned events. There is even an accidental death benefit specific to
"Hazardous Activities". The current version of our accident plan should
cover these events. The current plan is knows as the Accident Indemnity
Advantage plan. The old plan was known as the Personal Accident Indemnity
plan.

I'm happy to discuss more or to answer any questions. Please contact me on my
cell at 503-381-3513 for more information. Regards, Ty Naugle Aflac
503-383-3513 cell

ty_naugle@us.aflac.com" Feel free to give him a call, and he'll answer all your
questions! Cheers!

--

Dr. Noel Snodgrass - Chiropractic Physician 503.975.0961
Dr. Noel Snodgrass
Chiropractic Physician

Appointments always available online!
web: http://www.portlandchi.com
office: (503) 213-3745

Long, Steve

It's a little like M.C. Hammer's "Can't touch this" except it's "Can't
trust this" J

From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Kevin
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2011 10:44 PM
To: eric939@redshift.com; noel@portlandchi.com
Cc: obra@list.obra.org; Ty Naugle
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Supplemental Insurance - the final word.

Don't miss that "most" a few lines prior either. Insurance Company
dodges/loop holes.

I had an insurance adjuster tell me that after a car ran a stop sign and
hit me ($28,000 in medical bills) that the driver's insurance would not
cover me because their company considered me a pedestrian and "we don't
cover pedestrians". That's when you pick up the phone and call one of
the OBRA list's lawyers. Mike Colbach convinced the company that yes,
they do cover my injuries, and damage to the bike, and a little for pain
and suffering, and a little for just their plain stupidity.

I know, it's a game of numbers. Many will just walk away if told that
it's not covered. A penny saved is a penny earned.

Keep you eyes on those "usually's", "most often's", "should's", and "in
most cases"

Kevin

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
What is happening in Kevin's corner of the bike world?
http://the-whir-of-spokes-in-air.blogspot.com
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

________________________________

From: "eric939@redshift.com"
To: noel@portlandchi.com
Cc: obra@list.obra.org; Ty Naugle
Sent: Wed, May 18, 2011 10:10:56 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Supplemental Insurance - the final word.

"Should?"

== Eric

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> As I deal with insurance companies on a daily basis I thought I'd
> look in to the whole AFLAC flack that was flying around.

> Ty Naugle is an insurance broker and trainer for AFLAC, and really
> knows his stuff.  I send people his way all the time.

> Here's what he has to say regarding their plans and how they affect
> amateur bicycle racing.

>

> "Thank you for bringing this to my attention. The problem is that
> the person reading the brochure is reading the "Old" plan. The
Aflac
> accident plan was upgraded a little over a year ago and the new
plan
> will cover most of the mentioned events. There is even an
accidental
> death benefit specific to "Hazardous Activities". The current
> version of our accident plan should cover these events. The current
> plan is knows as the Accident Indemnity Advantage plan. The old
plan
> was known as the Personal Accident Indemnity plan.
>

I'm happy to discuss more or to answer any questions.

> Please contact me on my cell at 503-381-3513 for more information.

>

> Regards,

>

> Ty Naugle

> Aflac

> 503-383-3513 cell

> 

 href="mailto:ty_naugle@us.aflac.com">ty_naugle@us.aflac.com"

>

> Feel free to give him a call, and he'll answer all your questions!

> Cheers!

> 

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

This e-mail and related attachments and any response may be subject to public disclosure under state law.

Kevin

Don't miss that "most" a few lines prior either. Insurance Company dodges/loop
holes.

I had an insurance adjuster tell me that after a car ran a stop sign and hit me
($28,000 in medical bills) that the driver's insurance would not cover me
because their company considered me a pedestrian and "we don't cover
pedestrians". That's when you pick up the phone and call one of the OBRA list's
lawyers. Mike Colbach convinced the company that yes, they do cover my
injuries, and damage to the bike, and a little for pain and suffering, and a
little for just their plain stupidity.

I know, it's a game of numbers. Many will just walk away if told that it's not
covered. A penny saved is a penny earned.

Keep you eyes on those "usually's", "most often's", "should's", and "in most
cases"

Kevin

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
What is happening in Kevin's corner of the bike world?
http://the-whir-of-spokes-in-air.blogspot.com
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

________________________________
From: "eric939@redshift.com"
To: noel@portlandchi.com
Cc: obra@list.obra.org; Ty Naugle
Sent: Wed, May 18, 2011 10:10:56 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Supplemental Insurance - the final word.

"Should?"

== Eric

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> As I deal with insurance companies on a daily basis I thought I'd
> look in to the whole AFLAC flack that was flying around.

> Ty Naugle is an insurance broker and trainer for AFLAC, and really
> knows his stuff.  I send people his way all the time.

> Here's what he has to say regarding their plans and how they affect
> amateur bicycle racing.

>

> "Thank you for bringing this to my attention. The problem is that
> the person reading the brochure is reading the "Old" plan. The Aflac
> accident plan was upgraded a little over a year ago and the new plan
> will cover most of the mentioned events. There is even an accidental
> death benefit specific to "Hazardous Activities". The current
> version of our accident plan should cover these events. The current
> plan is knows as the Accident Indemnity Advantage plan. The old plan
> was known as the Personal Accident Indemnity plan.
>

I'm happy to discuss more or to answer any questions.

> Please contact me on my cell at 503-381-3513 for more information.

>

> Regards,

>

> Ty Naugle

> Aflac

> 503-383-3513 cell

> 

 href="mailto:ty_naugle@us.aflac.com">ty_naugle@us.aflac.com"

>

> Feel free to give him a call, and he'll answer all your questions!

> Cheers!

> 

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

eric939@redshift.com

"Should?"

== Eric

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> As I deal with insurance companies on a daily basis I thought I'd
> look in to the whole AFLAC flack that was flying around.

> Ty Naugle is an insurance broker and trainer for AFLAC, and really
> knows his stuff.  I send people his way all the time.

> Here's what he has to say regarding their plans and how they affect
> amateur bicycle racing.

>

> "Thank you for bringing this to my attention. The problem is that
> the person reading the brochure is reading the "Old" plan. The Aflac
> accident plan was upgraded a little over a year ago and the new plan
> will cover most of the mentioned events. There is even an accidental
> death benefit specific to "Hazardous Activities". The current
> version of our accident plan should cover these events. The current
> plan is knows as the Accident Indemnity Advantage plan. The old plan
> was known as the Personal Accident Indemnity plan.
>

I'm happy to discuss more or to answer any questions.

> Please contact me on my cell at 503-381-3513 for more information.

>

> Regards,

>

> Ty Naugle

> Aflac

> 503-383-3513 cell

> 

 href="mailto:ty_naugle@us.aflac.com">ty_naugle@us.aflac.com"

>

> Feel free to give him a call, and he'll answer all your questions!

> Cheers!

> 

Noel Snodgrass

As I deal with insurance companies on a daily basis I thought I'd
look in to the whole AFLAC flack that was flying around.

Ty Naugle is an insurance broker and trainer for AFLAC, and really
knows his stuff.  I send people his way all the time.

Here's what he has to say regarding their plans and how they affect
amateur bicycle racing.



"Thank you for bringing this to my attention. The problem is that
the person reading the brochure is reading the "Old" plan. The Aflac
accident plan was upgraded a little over a year ago and the new plan
will cover most of the mentioned events. There is even an accidental
death benefit specific to "Hazardous Activities". The current
version of our accident plan should cover these events. The current
plan is knows as the Accident Indemnity Advantage plan. The old plan
was known as the Personal Accident Indemnity plan.

I'm happy to discuss more or to answer any questions.  Please contact me on my cell at 503-381-3513 for more information.

Regards,

Ty Naugle

Aflac

503-383-3513 cell

ty_naugle@us.aflac.com"

Feel free to give him a call, and he'll answer all your questions!

Cheers!