Chris Deardorff

First off, I appreciate all the judges have to go through and it's a shame Mike has to write an email like this from time to time.  That being said, I love #2  "You weren't going fast enough, just deal with it."  That's awesome!  It put a smile on my face when I read it  (and yes, I was in the "not going fast enough" crowd)

________________________________
From: Mike Murray
To: obra@list.obra.org
Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2011 10:49 PM
Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bad racer behavior

I saw several case of bad racer behavior at the criterium today.  Most of
them were exacerbated by haranguing the officials at the judging table.  The
job of the officials at the judging table is to tabulate the results of the
current race.  The are not there for you to yell at because you thought
something went wrong.  They are busy judging the race and can't be expected
to drop everything to address your issues.  Specific issues today were:

1) Free laps - Criteriums may have a free lap. The rules concerning crit
free laps are under 15.4.6 in the OBRA rules
(http://www.obra.org/pdfs/2011rules.pdf).  The free lap rules use the term
"mishap" which is defined under 2.11. Mishaps are falls or when something
breaks. Loose stuff doesn't count.  If you didn't fall and nothing broke
don't yell at the pit officials, yell at the judges, etc.  Next time make
sure all the bits on your bike are adequately tightened.

2) Lapped or out of contention riders - Rules 15.4.3 and 15.4.4.  If you are
pulled from the race you have to leave the race course.  Don't yell at the
judges, go to the registration table, demand your money back, etc.  You
weren't going fast enough, just deal with it.

3) Place protest - Rule 12.1  If you think your place is wrong notify the
Chief Judge, give the reason why you think the results are incorrect and
then walk away.  This is best done in writing.  Do not expect that the Chief
Judge will drop everything to resolve the question of your results
immediately.  They are going to be busy judging the currently running race.
Judges make mistakes but keep in mind that for a crit the judges count each
field as it goes by each lap.  If the photo finish camera is being used then
there is a picture of every rider as they cross the finish line every lap.
You may have counted x numbers of riders ahead of you but your accuracy is
suspect compared to judges and photo finish camera.  Out of breath bike
racers are notoriously inaccurate at counting the riders around them.  More
importantly if you are certain that you finished in x place but they have
you down for x + 2 or 3 it is probably not very significant.

4) Yelling "crash" at the judges table as you race by - Riders fall at
nearly every bike race.  Thankfully most of the time riders fall they get
back up again.  Maybe if you see someone still on the ground when you come
around a second time and no one is attending them you might consider
stopping to notify people at the finish line but yelling as you go by does
no good.  No one knows where the crash is, no one knows how serious the
crash is, most often the riders will be up and gone when someone from the
finish gets there, etc.  At most crits there are course volunteers all
around the course who will see the crash, have more information, be able to
contact the first aid provider, etc.

Mike Murray

_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org

Nathan Spear

Hey Mike, I was gonna email and ask for the OBRA rules to review but didn't
when I realized they must be on obra.org. Thanks for sending the link out.
Also, I'm sorry for causing some of that chaos yesterday.

I want to apologize to Super Steve-O for my bad behavior in the wheel pit.
Steve, I'm sorry that I gave you grief when you told me that my loose
cassette doesn't warrant a free lap. I've never pitted in a crit before and
just didn't realize it is only for flats and crashes. I was told that this
was reviewed at the starting line, but I must admit I was busy visiting with
riders I hadn't seen in years and not listening to instructions.

Candi, I'm sorry if I created another rogue rider situation but pitting,
getting back in, and then having the gall to ask if I could stop killing
myself holding position exactly 1/2 a lap behind the field and get caught
and rejoin, at that point, 2 laps down. I guess I got so used to getting
lapped in the 6-day by Super Steve-O and Mark Blackwelder that it seemed
like a good option for everyone.

Mike, Candi and all of the promoters, officials and volunteers thanks for
all that you do for bike racing.

-Nathan

On Sat, Jun 25, 2011 at 10:49 PM, Mike Murray wrote:

> I saw several case of bad racer behavior at the criterium today. Most of
> them were exacerbated by haranguing the officials at the judging table.
> The
> job of the officials at the judging table is to tabulate the results of the
> current race. The are not there for you to yell at because you thought
> something went wrong. They are busy judging the race and can't be expected
> to drop everything to address your issues. Specific issues today were:
>
> 1) Free laps - Criteriums may have a free lap. The rules concerning crit
> free laps are under 15.4.6 in the OBRA rules
> (http://www.obra.org/pdfs/2011rules.pdf). The free lap rules use the term
> "mishap" which is defined under 2.11. Mishaps are falls or when something
> breaks. Loose stuff doesn't count. If you didn't fall and nothing broke
> don't yell at the pit officials, yell at the judges, etc. Next time make
> sure all the bits on your bike are adequately tightened.
>
> 2) Lapped or out of contention riders - Rules 15.4.3 and 15.4.4. If you
> are
> pulled from the race you have to leave the race course. Don't yell at the
> judges, go to the registration table, demand your money back, etc. You
> weren't going fast enough, just deal with it.
>
> 3) Place protest - Rule 12.1 If you think your place is wrong notify the
> Chief Judge, give the reason why you think the results are incorrect and
> then walk away. This is best done in writing. Do not expect that the
> Chief
> Judge will drop everything to resolve the question of your results
> immediately. They are going to be busy judging the currently running race.
> Judges make mistakes but keep in mind that for a crit the judges count each
> field as it goes by each lap. If the photo finish camera is being used
> then
> there is a picture of every rider as they cross the finish line every lap.
> You may have counted x numbers of riders ahead of you but your accuracy is
> suspect compared to judges and photo finish camera. Out of breath bike
> racers are notoriously inaccurate at counting the riders around them. More
> importantly if you are certain that you finished in x place but they have
> you down for x + 2 or 3 it is probably not very significant.
>
> 4) Yelling "crash" at the judges table as you race by - Riders fall at
> nearly every bike race. Thankfully most of the time riders fall they get
> back up again. Maybe if you see someone still on the ground when you come
> around a second time and no one is attending them you might consider
> stopping to notify people at the finish line but yelling as you go by does
> no good. No one knows where the crash is, no one knows how serious the
> crash is, most often the riders will be up and gone when someone from the
> finish gets there, etc. At most crits there are course volunteers all
> around the course who will see the crash, have more information, be able to
> contact the first aid provider, etc.
>
>
> Mike Murray
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>

Mike Murray

I saw several case of bad racer behavior at the criterium today. Most of
them were exacerbated by haranguing the officials at the judging table. The
job of the officials at the judging table is to tabulate the results of the
current race. The are not there for you to yell at because you thought
something went wrong. They are busy judging the race and can't be expected
to drop everything to address your issues. Specific issues today were:

1) Free laps - Criteriums may have a free lap. The rules concerning crit
free laps are under 15.4.6 in the OBRA rules
(http://www.obra.org/pdfs/2011rules.pdf). The free lap rules use the term
"mishap" which is defined under 2.11. Mishaps are falls or when something
breaks. Loose stuff doesn't count. If you didn't fall and nothing broke
don't yell at the pit officials, yell at the judges, etc. Next time make
sure all the bits on your bike are adequately tightened.

2) Lapped or out of contention riders - Rules 15.4.3 and 15.4.4. If you are
pulled from the race you have to leave the race course. Don't yell at the
judges, go to the registration table, demand your money back, etc. You
weren't going fast enough, just deal with it.

3) Place protest - Rule 12.1 If you think your place is wrong notify the
Chief Judge, give the reason why you think the results are incorrect and
then walk away. This is best done in writing. Do not expect that the Chief
Judge will drop everything to resolve the question of your results
immediately. They are going to be busy judging the currently running race.
Judges make mistakes but keep in mind that for a crit the judges count each
field as it goes by each lap. If the photo finish camera is being used then
there is a picture of every rider as they cross the finish line every lap.
You may have counted x numbers of riders ahead of you but your accuracy is
suspect compared to judges and photo finish camera. Out of breath bike
racers are notoriously inaccurate at counting the riders around them. More
importantly if you are certain that you finished in x place but they have
you down for x + 2 or 3 it is probably not very significant.

4) Yelling "crash" at the judges table as you race by - Riders fall at
nearly every bike race. Thankfully most of the time riders fall they get
back up again. Maybe if you see someone still on the ground when you come
around a second time and no one is attending them you might consider
stopping to notify people at the finish line but yelling as you go by does
no good. No one knows where the crash is, no one knows how serious the
crash is, most often the riders will be up and gone when someone from the
finish gets there, etc. At most crits there are course volunteers all
around the course who will see the crash, have more information, be able to
contact the first aid provider, etc.

Mike Murray