A friend of mine -- now an International Commissar -- told me about the time
he had to measure the advertising on Cindy Whitehead...
== Eric
As a Wyoming kid growing up, I watched Colo USCF officials on the start line
of a spring road race with RULERS in the early 80s measuring riders new club
jersies to see if sponsor logos fit the "rule" size.
I think some of those socks might be illegal too.
Rick Johnson
Bend, OregonEvery revolutionary idea seems to evoke three stages of reaction...
One, it's completely impossible.
Two, it's possible, but it's not worth doing.
Three, I said it was a good idea all along.Arthur C. Clarke
As seen on stage 1 Tour de Romadie (note
that Rodgers in the Green Jersey is not pictured):
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
and what's that in their ears?
On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 4:24 PM, Brooke Hoyer wrote:
> As seen on stage 1 Tour de Romadie (note that Rodgers in the Green Jersey
> is not pictured):
>
>
> http://www.grassyknolltv.com/2012/tour-de-romandie/photos/stage-01/105-RTR31718.jpg
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
>
As seen on stage 1 Tour de Romadie (note that Rodgers in the Green Jersey
is not pictured):
http://www.grassyknolltv.com/2012/tour-de-romandie/photos/stage-01/105-RTR31718.jpg
I love that anti-participatory it's next to USCF in the dictionary ooops I guess they wont be letting me announce there events
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 27, 2012, at 8:26 AM, "Mike Murray" wrote:
> There are many reasons why USCF and OBRA are different. One is that OBRA has fewer anti-participation rules, like requiring jersey approval. Let's keep it that way.
> Mike Murray
> Sent via BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jerald Powell
> Sender: obra-bounces@list.obra.org
> Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:26:39
> To: Kenji Sugahara
> Cc: obra remailer
> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>
> Kenji, there was a rule in the USCF days that team jerseys had to be approved by the federation.
>
> Such a rule would have avoided the situation this year in OBRA where two teams have so nearly the same jerseys that it's difficult to distinguish them even in the finish line camera.
>
> Steve Holland is dead right. And the rider who doesn't understand that it does make a difference what team(s) riders are down the road doesn't understand the difference between a break you can ignore and one you have to chase. I understand that there is likely a reason the question came up in the first place. It seems to me that the OBRA board's decision is unique in the whole world of bike racing. No-one that races at cat 1, cat 2 or Pro level misunderstands that "similar jerseys" means jerseys that everyone, officials, team-mates and opponents, can identify from a distance.
>
> Jerry
>
> Jerald M Powell
> 1926 SW Madison Street
> Portland Oregon 97205
>
> 503 222 7173
> 503 799 7823 (cell)
>
> jpowell@spiritone.com
>
>
>
>
> On Apr 26, 2012, at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
>
>> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team may
>> have the same colors?
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz wrote:
>>> "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
>>> jerseys."
>>>
>>> If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe zero
>>> nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
>>> chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>>>
>>>
>>> a.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point. Unless
>>>> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no more than
>>>> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
>>>> different team kits.
>>>> have fun out there.
>>>> ron
>>>>
>>>> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
>>>> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>>
>>>> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
>>>> ruling.
>>>>
>>>> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly "black"
>>>> jersey.
>>>>
>>>> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders in
>>>> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from a
>>>> distance.
>>>>
>>>> STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>>> C(360) 600-2702
>>>>
>>>> From: Candi Murray
>>>> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
>>>> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>>
>>>> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat ½ team
>>>> members of the same club wearing different jerseys. In both cases this
>>>> involved the same jersey design but with different back grounds. i.e. on
>>>> white or on black. The OBRA rule is
>>>>
>>>> 7.2.2 Team/Club clothing
>>>> No rider may wear the jersey of a club or team that the rider is not
>>>> eligible to represent.
>>>> In mass start events Category 1 and 2 riders from the same club/
>>>> team must wear uniforms that are obviously similar unless the
>>>> rules for the specific event require otherwise
>>>>
>>>> The Board of Directors have reviewed and came up with this decision.
>>>>
>>>> “This is a judgment call, but the spirit of the rule is that the kits must
>>>> be easily identifiable as part of the same team within the peloton. It is
>>>> the board’s opinion that the design elements of these kits (a human factors
>>>> engineer would say Design Language) meet that requirement”.
>>>>
>>>> Candi
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> OBRA mailing list
>>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> OBRA mailing list
>>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> OBRA mailing list
>>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OBRA mailing list
>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Kenji Sugahara
>> Executive Director
>> Oregon Bicycle Racing Association
>> Phone: 503-278-5550
>> http://www.obra.org
>> _______________________________________________
>> OBRA mailing list
>> obra@list.obra.org
>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
Now that is an idea..........let 'em wear "any jersey they want" (that will
not get them arrested), but make them wear MATCHING COTTON TUBE SOCKS.
rotten feet guaranteed....but you would know what team they were on even
though everyone would smell the same!
I am off to some dirt now that I have left some here on chat.
ron
-----Original Message-----
From: Eric
Sent: Friday, April 27, 2012 8:36 AM
To: mike.murray@obra.org
Cc: 'remailer, OBRA'
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
Anybody remember the "White or no socks" rule?
== Eric
-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Murray
Sent: Friday, April 27, 2012 7:01 AM
Cc: remailer, OBRA
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
There are many reasons why USCF and OBRA are different. One is that OBRA has
fewer anti-participation rules, like requiring jersey approval. Let's keep
it that way.
Mike Murray
Sent via BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Jerald Powell
Sender: obra-bounces@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:26:39
To: Kenji Sugahara
Cc: obra remailer
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
Kenji, there was a rule in the USCF days that team jerseys had to be
approved by the federation.
Such a rule would have avoided the situation this year in OBRA where two
teams have so nearly the same jerseys that it's difficult to distinguish
them even in the finish line camera.
Steve Holland is dead right. And the rider who doesn't understand that it
does make a difference what team(s) riders are down the road doesn't
understand the difference between a break you can ignore and one you have to
chase. I understand that there is likely a reason the question came up in
the first place. It seems to me that the OBRA board's decision is unique in
the whole world of bike racing. No-one that races at cat 1, cat 2 or Pro
level misunderstands that "similar jerseys" means jerseys that everyone,
officials, team-mates and opponents, can identify from a distance.
Jerry
Jerald M Powell
1926 SW Madison Street
Portland Oregon 97205
503 222 7173
503 799 7823 (cell)
jpowell@spiritone.com
On Apr 26, 2012, at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team may
> have the same colors?
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz wrote:
>> "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
>> jerseys."
>>
>> If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe
zero
>> nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
>> chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>>
>>
>> a.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>>
>>> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
Unless
>>> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no more
than
>>> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
>>> different team kits.
>>> have fun out there.
>>> ron
>>>
>>> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
>>> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
>>> ruling.
>>>
>>> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly
"black"
>>> jersey.
>>>
>>> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders
in
>>> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from
a
>>> distance.
>>>
>>> STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> C(360) 600-2702
>>>
>>> From: Candi Murray
>>> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
>>> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat ½
team
>>> members of the same club wearing different jerseys. In both cases this
>>> involved the same jersey design but with different back grounds. i.e. on
>>> white or on black. The OBRA rule is
>>>
>>> 7.2.2 Team/Club clothing
>>> No rider may wear the jersey of a club or team that the rider is not
>>> eligible to represent.
>>> In mass start events Category 1 and 2 riders from the same club/
>>> team must wear uniforms that are obviously similar unless the
>>> rules for the specific event require otherwise
>>>
>>> The Board of Directors have reviewed and came up with this decision.
>>>
>>> “This is a judgment call, but the spirit of the rule is that the kits
must
>>> be easily identifiable as part of the same team within the peloton. It
is
>>> the board’s opinion that the design elements of these kits (a human
factors
>>> engineer would say Design Language) meet that requirement”.
>>>
>>> Candi
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OBRA mailing list
>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OBRA mailing list
>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OBRA mailing list
>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OBRA mailing list
>> obra@list.obra.org
>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Kenji Sugahara
> Executive Director
> Oregon Bicycle Racing Association
> Phone: 503-278-5550
> http://www.obra.org
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
Anybody remember the "White or no socks" rule?
== Eric
-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Murray
Sent: Friday, April 27, 2012 7:01 AM
Cc: remailer, OBRA
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
There are many reasons why USCF and OBRA are different. One is that OBRA has
fewer anti-participation rules, like requiring jersey approval. Let's keep
it that way.
Mike Murray
Sent via BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Jerald Powell
Sender: obra-bounces@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:26:39
To: Kenji Sugahara
Cc: obra remailer
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
Kenji, there was a rule in the USCF days that team jerseys had to be
approved by the federation.
Such a rule would have avoided the situation this year in OBRA where two
teams have so nearly the same jerseys that it's difficult to distinguish
them even in the finish line camera.
Steve Holland is dead right. And the rider who doesn't understand that it
does make a difference what team(s) riders are down the road doesn't
understand the difference between a break you can ignore and one you have to
chase. I understand that there is likely a reason the question came up in
the first place. It seems to me that the OBRA board's decision is unique in
the whole world of bike racing. No-one that races at cat 1, cat 2 or Pro
level misunderstands that "similar jerseys" means jerseys that everyone,
officials, team-mates and opponents, can identify from a distance.
Jerry
Jerald M Powell
1926 SW Madison Street
Portland Oregon 97205
503 222 7173
503 799 7823 (cell)
jpowell@spiritone.com
On Apr 26, 2012, at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team may
> have the same colors?
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz wrote:
>> "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
>> jerseys."
>>
>> If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe
zero
>> nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
>> chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>>
>>
>> a.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>>
>>> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
Unless
>>> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no more
than
>>> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
>>> different team kits.
>>> have fun out there.
>>> ron
>>>
>>> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
>>> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
>>> ruling.
>>>
>>> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly
"black"
>>> jersey.
>>>
>>> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders
in
>>> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from
a
>>> distance.
>>>
>>> STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> C(360) 600-2702
>>>
>>> From: Candi Murray
>>> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
>>> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
There are many reasons why USCF and OBRA are different. One is that OBRA has fewer anti-participation rules, like requiring jersey approval. Let's keep it that way.
Mike Murray
Sent via BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Jerald Powell
Sender: obra-bounces@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:26:39
To: Kenji Sugahara
Cc: obra remailer
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
Kenji, there was a rule in the USCF days that team jerseys had to be approved by the federation.
Such a rule would have avoided the situation this year in OBRA where two teams have so nearly the same jerseys that it's difficult to distinguish them even in the finish line camera.
Steve Holland is dead right. And the rider who doesn't understand that it does make a difference what team(s) riders are down the road doesn't understand the difference between a break you can ignore and one you have to chase. I understand that there is likely a reason the question came up in the first place. It seems to me that the OBRA board's decision is unique in the whole world of bike racing. No-one that races at cat 1, cat 2 or Pro level misunderstands that "similar jerseys" means jerseys that everyone, officials, team-mates and opponents, can identify from a distance.
Jerry
Jerald M Powell
1926 SW Madison Street
Portland Oregon 97205
503 222 7173
503 799 7823 (cell)
jpowell@spiritone.com
On Apr 26, 2012, at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team may
> have the same colors?
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz wrote:
>> "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
>> jerseys."
>>
>> If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe zero
>> nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
>> chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>>
>>
>> a.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>>
>>> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point. Unless
>>> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no more than
>>> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
>>> different team kits.
>>> have fun out there.
>>> ron
>>>
>>> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
>>> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
>>> ruling.
>>>
>>> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly "black"
>>> jersey.
>>>
>>> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders in
>>> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from a
>>> distance.
>>>
>>> STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> C(360) 600-2702
>>>
>>> From: Candi Murray
>>> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
>>> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
There are many reasons why USCF and OBRA are different. One is that OBRA has fewer anti-participation rules, like requiring jersey approval. Let's keep it that way.
Mike Murray
Sent via BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Jerald Powell
Sender: obra-bounces@list.obra.org
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2012 18:26:39
To: Kenji Sugahara
Cc: obra remailer
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
Kenji, there was a rule in the USCF days that team jerseys had to be approved by the federation.
Such a rule would have avoided the situation this year in OBRA where two teams have so nearly the same jerseys that it's difficult to distinguish them even in the finish line camera.
Steve Holland is dead right. And the rider who doesn't understand that it does make a difference what team(s) riders are down the road doesn't understand the difference between a break you can ignore and one you have to chase. I understand that there is likely a reason the question came up in the first place. It seems to me that the OBRA board's decision is unique in the whole world of bike racing. No-one that races at cat 1, cat 2 or Pro level misunderstands that "similar jerseys" means jerseys that everyone, officials, team-mates and opponents, can identify from a distance.
Jerry
Jerald M Powell
1926 SW Madison Street
Portland Oregon 97205
503 222 7173
503 799 7823 (cell)
jpowell@spiritone.com
On Apr 26, 2012, at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team may
> have the same colors?
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz wrote:
>> "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
>> jerseys."
>>
>> If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe zero
>> nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
>> chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>>
>>
>> a.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>>
>>> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point. Unless
>>> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no more than
>>> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
>>> different team kits.
>>> have fun out there.
>>> ron
>>>
>>> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
>>> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
>>> ruling.
>>>
>>> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly "black"
>>> jersey.
>>>
>>> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders in
>>> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from a
>>> distance.
>>>
>>> STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> C(360) 600-2702
>>>
>>> From: Candi Murray
>>> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
>>> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
We all know from the Halloween Crusade a few years ago that bare skin can take a few pins...
On Apr 26, 2012, at 6:51 PM, "T. Kenji Sugahara" wrote:
> Where ya gonna pin your race number?
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 6:47 PM, don person wrote:
>> Shirts and skins!
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, April 26, 2012, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
>>>
>>> Even better- solid colors only.
>>>
>>> Gentle lovers- hot pink
>>> Bridgetown- fluorescent orange
>>> Team Oregon- incandescent red
>>>
>>> etc.
>>>
>>> :P
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Matthew Haughey
>>> wrote:
>>>> I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
>>>> team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and the
>>>> other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked that the
>>>> riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most comfortable
>>>> (including 1/2 racers).
>>>>
>>>> Matt
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Less rules. More racing. Wear the right jersey! Simple.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team
>>>>>> may
>>>>>> have the same colors?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
>>>>>>> jerseys."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have
>>>>>>> maybe
>>>>>>> zero
>>>>>>> nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops,
>>>>>>> start
>>>>>>> chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> a.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
>>>>>>>> Unless
>>>>>>>> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no
>>>>>>>> more
>>>>>>>> than
>>>>>>>> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
>>>>>>>> different team kits.
>>>>>>>> have fun out there.
>>>>>>>> ron
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
>>>>>>>> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
>>>>>>>> ruling.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly
>>>>>>>> "black"
>>>>>>>> jersey.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate
>>>>>>>> riders
>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable
>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>> distance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>>>>>>> C(360) 600-2702
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Candi Murray
>>>>>>>> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
>>>>>>>> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
>>>>>>>> ½
>>>>>>>> team
>>>>>>>> members of the same club wearing different jerseys. In both cases
>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>> involved the same jersey design but with different back grounds.
>>>>>>>> i.e.
>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> white or on black. The OBRA rule is
>>>>>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Don Person (shiggy)
>> http://mtbtires.com
>> http://titusti.com
>> http://shop.on-one-usa.com
>
>
>
> --
> Kenji Sugahara
> Executive Director
> Oregon Bicycle Racing Association
> Phone: 503-278-5550
> http://www.obra.org
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
Just like in a triathlon, written, or a tattoo
-----Original Message-----
From: obra-bounces@list.obra.org [mailto:obra-bounces@list.obra.org] On
Behalf Of T. Kenji Sugahara
Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 6:52 PM
To: don person
Cc: OBRA
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
Where ya gonna pin your race number?
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 6:47 PM, don person wrote:
> Shirts and skins!
>
>
> On Thursday, April 26, 2012, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
>>
>> Even better- solid colors only.
>>
>> Gentle lovers- hot pink
>> Bridgetown- fluorescent orange
>> Team Oregon- incandescent red
>>
>> etc.
>>
>> :P
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Matthew Haughey
>> wrote:
>> > I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
>> > team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and
>> > the other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked
>> > that the riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most
>> > comfortable (including 1/2 racers).
>> >
>> > Matt
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
>> > wrote:
>> >> Less rules.
Spray adhesive!!
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 26, 2012, at 7:10 PM, don person wrote:
> No pins, duct tape
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 6:51 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
>> Where ya gonna pin your race number?
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 6:47 PM, don person wrote:
>>> Shirts and skins!
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, April 26, 2012, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Even better- solid colors only.
>>>>
>>>> Gentle lovers- hot pink
>>>> Bridgetown- fluorescent orange
>>>> Team Oregon- incandescent red
>>>>
>>>> etc.
>>>>
>>>> :P
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Matthew Haughey
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
>>>>> team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and the
>>>>> other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked that the
>>>>> riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most comfortable
>>>>> (including 1/2 racers).
>>>>>
>>>>> Matt
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> Less rules. More racing. Wear the right jersey! Simple.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team
>>>>>>> may
>>>>>>> have the same colors?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
>>>>>>>> jerseys."
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have
>>>>>>>> maybe
>>>>>>>> zero
>>>>>>>> nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops,
>>>>>>>> start
>>>>>>>> chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> a.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
>>>>>>>>> Unless
>>>>>>>>> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no
>>>>>>>>> more
>>>>>>>>> than
>>>>>>>>> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
>>>>>>>>> different team kits.
>>>>>>>>> have fun out there.
>>>>>>>>> ron
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
>>>>>>>>> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
>>>>>>>>> ruling.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly
>>>>>>>>> "black"
>>>>>>>>> jersey.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate
>>>>>>>>> riders
>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable
>>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>> distance.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>>>>>>>> C(360) 600-2702
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> From: Candi Murray
>>>>>>>>> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
>>>>>>>>> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
>>>>>>>>> ½
>>>>>>>>> team
>>>>>>>>> members of the same club wearing different jerseys. In both cases
>>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>>> involved the same jersey design but with different back grounds.
>>>>>>>>> i.e.
>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>> white or on black. The OBRA rule is
>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Don Person (shiggy)
>>> http://mtbtires.com
>>> http://titusti.com
>>> http://shop.on-one-usa.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Kenji Sugahara
>> Executive Director
>> Oregon Bicycle Racing Association
>> Phone: 503-278-5550
>> http://www.obra.org
>
>
>
> --
> Don Person (shiggy)
> http://mtbtires.com
> http://titusti.com
> http://shop.on-one-usa.com
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
No pins, duct tape
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 6:51 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
> Where ya gonna pin your race number?
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 6:47 PM, don person wrote:
>> Shirts and skins!
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, April 26, 2012, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
>>>
>>> Even better- solid colors only.
>>>
>>> Gentle lovers- hot pink
>>> Bridgetown- fluorescent orange
>>> Team Oregon- incandescent red
>>>
>>> etc.
>>>
>>> :P
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Matthew Haughey
>>> wrote:
>>> > I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
>>> > team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and the
>>> > other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked that the
>>> > riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most comfortable
>>> > (including 1/2 racers).
>>> >
>>> > Matt
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
>>> > wrote:
>>> >> Less rules.
Where ya gonna pin your race number?
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 6:47 PM, don person wrote:
> Shirts and skins!
>
>
> On Thursday, April 26, 2012, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
>>
>> Even better- solid colors only.
>>
>> Gentle lovers- hot pink
>> Bridgetown- fluorescent orange
>> Team Oregon- incandescent red
>>
>> etc.
>>
>> :P
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Matthew Haughey
>> wrote:
>> > I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
>> > team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and the
>> > other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked that the
>> > riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most comfortable
>> > (including 1/2 racers).
>> >
>> > Matt
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
>> > wrote:
>> >> Less rules.
Shirts and skins!
On Thursday, April 26, 2012, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
> Even better- solid colors only.
>
> Gentle lovers- hot pink
> Bridgetown- fluorescent orange
> Team Oregon- incandescent red
>
> etc.
>
> :P
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Matthew Haughey
> wrote:
> > I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
> > team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and the
> > other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked that the
> > riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most comfortable
> > (including 1/2 racers).
> >
> > Matt
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
> > wrote:
> >> Less rules. More racing. Wear the right jersey! Simple.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team
> may
> >>> have the same colors?
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz
> wrote:
> >>> > "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
> >>> > jerseys."
> >>> >
> >>> > If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have
> maybe
> >>> > zero
> >>> > nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops,
> start
> >>> > chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > a.
> >>> >
> >>> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
> >>> >>
> >>> >> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
> >>> >> Unless
> >>> >> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no
> more
> >>> >> than
> >>> >> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
> >>> >> different team kits.
> >>> >> have fun out there.
> >>> >> ron
> >>> >>
> >>> >> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
> >>> >> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
> >>> >> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
> >>> >> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
> >>> >> ruling.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly
> >>> >> "black"
> >>> >> jersey.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate
> riders
> >>> >> in
> >>> >> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable
> from
> >>> >> a
> >>> >> distance.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> STEVEN R HOLLAND
> >>> >> C(360) 600-2702
> >>> >>
> >>> >> From: Candi Murray
> >>> >> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
> >>> >> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
> >>> >> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
> >>> >>
> >>> >> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
>
I'll vote for the status quo on this one... I think the rule is perfectly
fine as is. Again, the rules state the the jerseys must be the same in any
1/2 race. Trying to ask OBRA to police which teams are wearing which
colors, or having OBRA be involved in the pre-planning of kits by each team
prior to the beginning of the season just creates a whole lot of ridiculous
oversight.
Lets say that I only buy two jerseys at the beginning of the season, a
black jersey for crap weather, and a white jersey for the two nice sunny
hot days that we get here in Portland. Now, unfortunately, because I went
down in a small crash on a training ride the week before, I'm left with
just the white jersey. Are we really proposing that I can't wear the white
jersey when the rest of my team is wearing black kits? The logos are all
the same, is it that hard to determine what team I ride for? Can I wear a
skin suit when other guys on my team are wearing their regular kits?
I hope we're not worrying about this whole thing because of a race at PIR.
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 6:05 PM, anklebiter456 wrote:
> I think the ruling makes sense and that it should be all black or all
> white the day of the race. It is only not fair to the other riders.
> Cycling is a team sport kind of like chess and it make a difference who is
> allowed up the road who is not. I have worn a kit that has been Red
> /Yellow and White for many years. Believe me when I go up the road you
> can see me for about 3/4 of a mile and riders do chase depending on who it
> is. For some reason for the last two years white and black has become the
> predominant color in the peloton. We now have three out of the 5 teams
> in Eugene in black depending on the day. I think it is almost to the point
> were OBRA should limit the amount of registered teams in a given color.
>
> Sorry, my two cents.
>
> AP
>
> *From:* T. Kenji Sugahara
> *To:* Matthew Haughey
> *Cc:* OBRA
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 26, 2012 5:13 PM
>
> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>
> Even better- solid colors only.
>
> Gentle lovers- hot pink
> Bridgetown- fluorescent orange
> Team Oregon- incandescent red
>
> etc.
>
> :P
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Matthew Haughey
> wrote:
> > I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
> > team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and the
> > other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked that the
> > riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most comfortable
> > (including 1/2 racers).
> >
> > Matt
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
> > wrote:
> >> Less rules. More racing. Wear the right jersey! Simple.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team
> may
> >>> have the same colors?
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz
> wrote:
> >>> > "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
> >>> > jerseys."
> >>> >
> >>> > If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have
> maybe
> >>> > zero
> >>> > nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops,
> start
> >>> > chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > a.
> >>> >
> >>> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
> >>> >>
> >>> >> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
> >>> >> Unless
> >>> >> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no
> more
> >>> >> than
> >>> >> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
> >>> >> different team kits.
> >>> >> have fun out there.
> >>> >> ron
> >>> >>
> >>> >> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
> >>> >> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
> >>> >> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
> >>> >> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
> >>> >> ruling.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly
> >>> >> "black"
> >>> >> jersey.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate
> riders
> >>> >> in
> >>> >> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable
> from
> >>> >> a
> >>> >> distance.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> STEVEN R HOLLAND
> >>> >> C(360) 600-2702
> >>> >>
> >>> >> From: Candi Murray
> >>> >> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
> >>> >> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
> >>> >> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
> >>> >>
> >>> >> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
>
Kenji, there was a rule in the USCF days that team jerseys had to be approved by the federation.
Such a rule would have avoided the situation this year in OBRA where two teams have so nearly the same jerseys that it's difficult to distinguish them even in the finish line camera.
Steve Holland is dead right. And the rider who doesn't understand that it does make a difference what team(s) riders are down the road doesn't understand the difference between a break you can ignore and one you have to chase. I understand that there is likely a reason the question came up in the first place. It seems to me that the OBRA board's decision is unique in the whole world of bike racing. No-one that races at cat 1, cat 2 or Pro level misunderstands that "similar jerseys" means jerseys that everyone, officials, team-mates and opponents, can identify from a distance.
Jerry
Jerald M Powell
1926 SW Madison Street
Portland Oregon 97205
503 222 7173
503 799 7823 (cell)
jpowell@spiritone.com
On Apr 26, 2012, at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team may
> have the same colors?
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz wrote:
>> "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
>> jerseys."
>>
>> If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe zero
>> nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
>> chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>>
>>
>> a.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>>
>>> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point. Unless
>>> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no more than
>>> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
>>> different team kits.
>>> have fun out there.
>>> ron
>>>
>>> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
>>> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
>>> ruling.
>>>
>>> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly "black"
>>> jersey.
>>>
>>> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders in
>>> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from a
>>> distance.
>>>
>>> STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> C(360) 600-2702
>>>
>>> From: Candi Murray
>>> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
>>> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>>
>>> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
I think the ruling makes sense and that it should be all black or all white the day of the race. It is only not fair to the other riders. Cycling is a team sport kind of like chess and it make a difference who is allowed up the road who is not. I have worn a kit that has been Red /Yellow and White for many years. Believe me when I go up the road you can see me for about 3/4 of a mile and riders do chase depending on who it is. For some reason for the last two years white and black has become the predominant color in the peloton. We now have three out of the 5 teams in Eugene in black depending on the day. I think it is almost to the point were OBRA should limit the amount of registered teams in a given color.
Sorry, my two cents.
AP
________________________________
From: T. Kenji Sugahara
To: Matthew Haughey
Cc: OBRA
Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 5:13 PM
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
Even better- solid colors only.
Gentle lovers- hot pink
Bridgetown- fluorescent orange
Team Oregon- incandescent red
etc.
:P
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Matthew Haughey wrote:
> I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
> team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and the
> other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked that the
> riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most comfortable
> (including 1/2 racers).
>
> Matt
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
> wrote:
>> Less rules. More racing. Wear the right jersey! Simple.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
>>>
>>> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team may
>>> have the same colors?
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz wrote:
>>> > "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
>>> > jerseys."
>>> >
>>> > If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe
>>> > zero
>>> > nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
>>> > chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > a.
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
>>> >> Unless
>>> >> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no more
>>> >> than
>>> >> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
>>> >> different team kits.
>>> >> have fun out there.
>>> >> ron
>>> >>
>>> >> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> >> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
>>> >> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> >> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>> >>
>>> >> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
>>> >> ruling.
>>> >>
>>> >> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly
>>> >> "black"
>>> >> jersey.
>>> >>
>>> >> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders
>>> >> in
>>> >> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from
>>> >> a
>>> >> distance.
>>> >>
>>> >> STEVEN R HOLLAND
>>> >> C(360) 600-2702
>>> >>
>>> >> From: Candi Murray
>>> >> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
>>> >> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
>>> >> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>>> >>
>>> >> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat ½
>>> >> team
>>> >> members of the same club wearing different jerseys. In both cases this
>>> >> involved the same jersey design but with different back grounds. i.e.
>>> >> on
>>> >> white or on black. The OBRA rule is
>>> >>
>>> >> 7.2.2 Team/Club clothing
>>> >> No rider may wear the jersey of a club or team that the rider is not
>>> >> eligible to represent.
>>> >> In mass start events Category 1 and 2 riders from the same club/
>>> >> team must wear uniforms that are obviously similar unless the
>>> >> rules for the specific event require otherwise
>>> >>
>>> >> The Board of Directors have reviewed and came up with this decision.
>>> >>
>>> >> “This is a judgment call, but the spirit of the rule is that the kits
>>> >> must
>>> >> be easily identifiable as part of the same team within the peloton. It
>>> >> is
>>> >> the board’s opinion that the design elements of these kits (a human
>>> >> factors
>>> >> engineer would say Design Language) meet that requirement”.
>>> >>
>>> >> Candi
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> OBRA mailing list
>>> >> obra@list.obra.org
>>> >> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> >> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> ________________________________
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> OBRA mailing list
>>> >> obra@list.obra.org
>>> >> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> >> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> OBRA mailing list
>>> >> obra@list.obra.org
>>> >> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> >> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > OBRA mailing list
>>> > obra@list.obra.org
>>> > http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> > Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Kenji Sugahara
>>> Executive Director
>>> Oregon Bicycle Racing Association
>>> Phone: 503-278-5550
>>> http://www.obra.org
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OBRA mailing list
>>> obra@list.obra.org
>>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OBRA mailing list
>> obra@list.obra.org
>> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
>> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>>
> _______________________________________________
> OBRA mailing list
> obra@list.obra.org
> http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
> Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
>
--
Kenji Sugahara
Executive Director
Oregon Bicycle Racing Association
Phone: 503-278-5550
http://www.obra.org
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
Even better- solid colors only.
Gentle lovers- hot pink
Bridgetown- fluorescent orange
Team Oregon- incandescent red
etc.
:P
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Matthew Haughey wrote:
> I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
> team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and the
> other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked that the
> riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most comfortable
> (including 1/2 racers).
>
> Matt
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
> wrote:
>> Less rules.
I bet it adds a wrinkle to scoring racers visually, but being on a
team that made two jerseys in the same year where one was navy and the
other white (a "summer" jersey for the hottest days), I liked that the
riders had the flexibility to wear whatever made them most comfortable
(including 1/2 racers).
Matt
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 5:02 PM, william fasano
wrote:
> Less rules.
Less rules. More racing. Wear the right jersey! Simple.
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:58 PM, T. Kenji Sugahara wrote:
> So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team may
> have the same colors?
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz wrote:
> > "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
> > jerseys."
> >
> > If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe
> zero
> > nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
> > chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
> >
> >
> > a.
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
> >>
> >> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
> Unless
> >> you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no more
> than
> >> basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be
> >> different team kits.
> >> have fun out there.
> >> ron
> >>
> >> From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
> >> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
> >> To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
> >> Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
> >>
> >> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
> >> ruling.
> >>
> >> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly
> "black"
> >> jersey.
> >>
> >> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders
> in
> >> a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from
> a
> >> distance.
> >>
> >> STEVEN R HOLLAND
> >> C(360) 600-2702
> >>
> >> From: Candi Murray
> >> To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
> >> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
> >> Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
> >>
> >> There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
So the next obvious question is- do we then make a rule that no team may
have the same colors?
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andrew Utz wrote:
> "I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
> jerseys."
>
> If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe zero
> nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
> chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
>
>
> a.
>
> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
>>
>> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
"I would have won that race, but that team wore differently colored
jerseys."
If I had a nickel for every time that excuse was valid, I'd have maybe zero
nickels. Do you see YOUR team's jersey(s) up the road? No? Oops, start
chasing. Who cares what the guys who did make the break are wearing?
a.
On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:17 PM, wrote:
> I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point.
> Unless you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no
> more than basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to
> be different team kits.
> have fun out there.
> ron
>
> *From:* STEVEN R HOLLAND
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
> *To:* cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
> *Subject:* Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>
> Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the
> ruling.
>
> A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly "black"
> jersey.
>
> One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders
> in a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposablefrom a distance.
>
> STEVEN R HOLLAND
> C(360) 600-2702
>
> *From:* Candi Murray
> *To:* obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
> *Subject:* [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
>
> *There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
I do not even do road racing, but Steven makes a very good point. Unless you have the same visual perception as a hawk, a group ahead is no more than basic shapes and colors. Black and White jerseys will appear to be different team kits.
have fun out there.
ron
From: STEVEN R HOLLAND
Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 4:12 PM
To: cmurray@obra.org ; obra@list.obra.org ; obrarace@list.obra.org
Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the ruling.
A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly "black" jersey.
One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders in a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from a distance.
STEVEN R HOLLAND
C(360) 600-2702
From: Candi Murray
To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat ½ team members of the same club wearing different jerseys. In both cases this involved the same jersey design but with different back grounds. i.e. on white or on black. The OBRA rule is
7.2.2 Team/Club clothing
No rider may wear the jersey of a club or team that the rider is not
eligible to represent.
In mass start events Category 1 and 2 riders from the same club/
team must wear uniforms that are obviously similar unless the
rules for the specific event require otherwise
The Board of Directors have reviewed and came up with this decision.
“This is a judgment call, but the spirit of the rule is that the kits must be easily identifiable as part of the same team within the peloton. It is the board’s opinion that the design elements of these kits (a human factors engineer would say Design Language) meet that requirement”.
Candi
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
Fire the board...................I could not disagree more with the ruling.
A predominantly "white" jersey is not the same as a predominantly "black" jersey.
One of the reasons to have the "same" jersey is to differentiate riders in a break that is "up the rode". This would be hard if not imposable from a distance.
STEVEN R HOLLAND
C(360) 600-2702
________________________________
From: Candi Murray
To: obra@list.obra.org; obrarace@list.obra.org
Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 8:02 AM
Subject: [OBRA Chat] Rules about similar Jerseys
There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat ½ team members of the same club wearing different jerseys. In both cases this involved the same jersey design but with different back grounds. i.e. on white or on black. The OBRA rule is
7.2.2 Team/Club clothing
No rider may wear the jersey of a club or team that the rider is not
eligible to represent.
In mass start events Category 1 and 2 riders from the same club/
team must wear uniforms that are obviously similar unless the
rules for the specific event require otherwise
The Board of Directors have reviewed and came up with this decision.
“This is a judgment call, but the spirit of the rule is that the kits must be easily identifiable as part of the same team within the peloton. It is the board’s opinion that the design elements of these kits (a human factors engineer would say Design Language) meet that requirement”.
Candi
_______________________________________________
OBRA mailing list
obra@list.obra.org
http://list.obra.org/mailman/listinfo/obra
Unsubscribe: obra-unsubscribe@list.obra.org
There has been some discussion and a request for a ruling about Cat
© 2025 Oregon Bicycle Racing Association
