OBRA: OBRA Chat: Bicycle registration Bill i...

Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

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Augusto C.D. Carneiro

2003-03-13

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<P>Regarding fees for bike lane funding: A good part of your property taxes that all of you pay directly (mortgages) or indirectly (rent) go towards road maintenance. So even if you are strictly a bike commuter like my self and never pay a cent on gas taxes (my wife's car not included in this argument :), you are more than paying for your bike lanes. In fact I have heard figures that each car in the US has a federal subsidy of about $3,000. And I think that is yearly! So the arguments that we should pay registration fees and other fees for bike lanes is bogus. The truth is that cars should be paying much higher gas taxes - and this is not including cost of military to secure oil prices abroad or environmental costs to be borne by our kids in the future. But alas I am guilty of driving occasionally and being dependent on cars as well. BUT THESE COSTS SHOULD NOT BE TAGGED ON TO BICYCLES!</P>

<P>Regarding bike theft and recovery, somebody has already mentioned the National Bike Registry that has a one time registration fee and does not involve all the bureaucracy of the proposed bill.</P>

<P>Augusto</P>

<P>Los Ciclistas</P>

<P>(team announcement coming soon!) </P>

<P></FONT><BR><BR></P></DIV>

<DIV></DIV>

<DIV></DIV>>From: samu-@pdx.edu

<DIV></DIV>>Reply-To: samu-@pdx.edu

<DIV></DIV>>To: t.hoff-@verizon.net

<DIV></DIV>>CC: ob-@topica.com

<DIV></DIV>>Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

<DIV></DIV>>Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 20:50:06 -0800

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>How many cyclists also own cars? I'm willing to bet that at least 50%. If

<DIV></DIV>>you build a bike lane(and cars stay out of it) how long will it last? A lot

<DIV></DIV>>longer than the same stretch of road with cars driving up and down it. I

<DIV></DIV>>realize that it costs a lot of money to add bike lanes to streets but it

<DIV></DIV>>certainly is cheaper than laying pavemant for cars every five years. Plus

<DIV></DIV>>bike lanes are for more than just cyclists, they keep traffic moving faster in

<DIV></DIV>>general and make drivers more comfortable in passing cyclists. Cyclists also

<DIV></DIV>>save everyone money in many different ways which if you think about are

<DIV></DIV>>obvious so I won't waste time describing them. I see no need for cyclists to

<DIV></DIV>>pay more.

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>>Quoting THOMAS HOFFMAN <T.HOFF-@VERIZON.NET>:

<DIV></DIV>>

<DIV></DIV>> > I think the Idea has merit, maybe not in this form, but an idea worth

<DIV></DIV>> > exploring. But not so my stolen bike would be returned. I could get behind a

<DIV></DIV>> > registration a one time Fee at time of purchase in order to facilitate a

<DIV></DIV>> > database and create funds that increase the amount of money dedicated to

<DIV></DIV>> > alternative transportation. When I was a kid, every fire station in San Jose

<DIV></DIV>> > took care of bike regitration. I think it cost $5. Those of us residing in

<DIV></DIV>> > the Portland Metro area have benefited greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds,

<DIV></DIV>> > and the BTA, that require or help (depending on your point of view)

<DIV></DIV>> > municipalities to create bike paths. So far bicyclists have not paid directly

<DIV></DIV>> > for these lanes. The 75% of the Portland area that do not ride bikes, may

<DIV></DIV>> > have something to say about bikers paying there fair share. As a skier, I pay

<DIV></DIV>> > every year for a Snow park permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads

<DIV></DIV>> > open for those that are using it, so I don't mind.

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country, are sold by mass merchants.

<DIV></DIV>> > Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the world.

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper work is worth letting them keep

<DIV></DIV>> > a third of the fee. They should not have to work for free.

<DIV></DIV>> > ----- Original Message -----

<DIV></DIV>> > From: Pat Sagers

<DIV></DIV>> > To: 'ob-@topica.com'

<DIV></DIV>> > Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01 PM

<DIV></DIV>> > Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > I don't think the motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles.

<DIV></DIV>> > License all my bicycles? That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes,

<DIV></DIV>> > 2 road bikes and one tandem. I'll have to sell a bike to register the rest.

<DIV></DIV>> > I think strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human

<DIV></DIV>> > powered vehicle should be registered too. Gosh, we may be able to dismiss

<DIV></DIV>> > the state income tax.

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > Pat Sagers

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > -----Original Message-----

<DIV></DIV>> > From: Gregg Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com]

<DIV></DIV>> > Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 4:43 PM

<DIV></DIV>> > To: ob-@topica.com

<DIV></DIV>> > Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives

<DIV></DIV>> > Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes.

<DIV></DIV>> > It is House Bill 3135..here is the link

<DIV></DIV>> > http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is

<DIV></DIV>> > we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the

<DIV></DIV>> > state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The

<DIV></DIV>> > argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if

<DIV></DIV>> > they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be

<DIV></DIV>> > of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a

<DIV></DIV>> > committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but

<DIV></DIV>> > Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to call

<DIV></DIV>> > or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it

<DIV></DIV>> > progresses any where.

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > Here is the contact info for him.

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422

<DIV></DIV>> > email: rep.clif-@state.or.us

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > If you any one has any questions let me know,

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > -Gregg Magnus

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> > greg-@hotmail.com

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

<DIV></DIV>> >

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Ed Lanton

2003-03-13

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Thomas, I have no doubt that retail establishments that sell guns would be happy to sell hunting permits without charge, since it is a great way to get bodies in the door to have a look at GI Joe's wide variety of hunting inventory. Same with ski shops selling snow park permits.

Your point with respect to the lottery is well taken, although there is a huge question about just how much the lottery sales should be turned over to the merchants. When I was in private practice, I had numerous clients that were making more off lottery revenues than any other portion of their business. Was that the intent of the legislature? No.

THOMAS HOFFMAN <t.hoff-@verizon.net> wrote:Ask your attorney how much he charges to fill out a legal document for you. I bet it is way more than the 3.35 bucks that a store would collect for a 10 liscence fee. Think about it this way, why force a buisnes to take time to fill out and file a goverment form and not compesate them for it? It happens for ski park passes, Lottery ticket, etc. I am sure that GI Joes would not sale hunting liscences if they were not compensated for it. It would cost the state a lot more to staff a person at some other office. Of course we can all keep good records of our serila numbers, CALL the non response (cuz nobody wants to pay for them) Police. And hope they get lucky and find your bike. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ed Lanton To: ob-@topica.com Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:24 PMSubject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

Gee, Thomas. By this logic the businesses should be able to retain a portion of the Social Security withholding tax (both the employer and employee portion I presume), Medicaid withholding, Federal and State employee income withholding taxes, estimated income taxes, sales tax (in states that have it), fuel excise taxes (state and federal), tobacco excise taxes, etc., etc.

Sorry, but accounting for trust fund taxes by what ever name is just part of the cost of doing business. Even if the idea had merit, is there even a scintilla of evidence showing the relationship between 1/3 of the tax and the cost of collection?

THOMAS HOFFMAN <t.hoff-@verizon.net> wrote:

v\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML)}o\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML)}w\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML)}.shape { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML)}st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }I think the Idea has merit, maybe not in this form, but an idea worth exploring. But not so my stolen bike would be returned. I could get behind a registration a one time Fee at time of purchase in order to facilitate a database and create funds that increase the amount of money dedicated to alternative transportation. When I was a kid, every fire station in San Jose took care of bike regitration. I think it cost $5. Those of us residing in the Portland Metro area have benefited greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds, and the BTA, that require or help (depending on your point of view) municipalities to create bike paths. So far bicyclists have not paid directly for these lanes. The 75% of the Portland area that do not ride bikes, may have something to say about bikers paying there fair share. As a skier, I pay every year for a Snow park permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads open for those that are using it, so I don't mind. Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country, are sold by mass merchants. Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the world. Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper work is worth letting them keep a third of the fee. They should not have to work for free. ----- Original Message ----- From: Pat Sagers To: 'ob-@topica.com' Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01 PMSubject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

I don't think the motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles. License all my bicycles? That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes, 2 road bikes and one tandem. I'll have to sell a bike to register the rest. I think strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human powered vehicle should be registered too. Gosh, we may be able to dismiss the state income tax.

Pat Sagers

-----Original Message-----

From: Gregg Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 4:43 PM

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the link http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html

This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it progresses any where.

Here is the contact info for him.

Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422 email: rep.clif-@state.or.us

If you any one has any questions let me know,

-Gregg Magnus

greg-@hotmail.com

---------------------------------

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<P>Thomas, I have no doubt that retail establishments that sell guns would be happy to sell hunting permits without charge, since it is a great way to get bodies in the door to have a look at GI Joe's wide variety of hunting inventory. Same with ski shops selling snow park permits.

<P>Your point with respect to the lottery is well taken, although there is a huge question about just how much the lottery sales should be turned over to the merchants. When I was in private practice, I had numerous clients that were making more off lottery revenues than any other portion of their business. Was that the intent of the legislature? No.

<P> <B><I>THOMAS HOFFMAN <t.hoff-@verizon.net></I></B> wrote:

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Ask your attorney how much he charges to fill out a legal document for you. I bet it is way more than the 3.35 bucks that a store would collect for a 10 liscence fee. Think about it this way, why force a buisnes to take time to fill out and file a goverment form and not compesate them for it? It happens for ski park passes, Lottery ticket, etc. I am sure that GI Joes would not sale hunting liscences if they were not compensated for it. It would cost the state a lot more to staff a person at some other office. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Of course we can all keep good records of our serila numbers, CALL the non response (cuz nobody wants to pay for them) Police. And hope they get lucky and find your bike. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">

<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A href="mailto:anque-@yahoo.com" title=an-@yahoo.com>Ed Lanton</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A href="mailto:ob-@topica.com" title-@topica.com>ob-@topica.com</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:24 PM</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital</DIV>

<DIV><BR></DIV>

<P>Gee, Thomas. By this logic the businesses should be able to retain a portion of the Social Security withholding tax (both the employer and employee portion I presume), Medicaid withholding, Federal and State employee income withholding taxes, estimated income taxes, sales tax (in states that have it), fuel excise taxes (state and federal), tobacco excise taxes, etc., etc.

<P>Sorry, but accounting for trust fund taxes by what ever name is just part of the cost of doing business. Even if the idea had merit, is there even a scintilla of evidence showing the relationship between 1/3 of the tax and the cost of collection?

<P>

<P><STRONG><EM></EM></STRONG>

<P><STRONG><EM>THOMAS HOFFMAN <t.hoff-@verizon.net></EM></STRONG> wrote:

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I think the Idea has merit, maybe not in this form, but an idea worth exploring. But not so my stolen bike would be returned. I could get behind a registration a one time Fee at time of purchase in order to facilitate a database and create funds that increase the amount of money dedicated to alternative transportation. When I was a kid, every fire station in San Jose took care of bike regitration. I think it cost $5. Those of us residing in the Portland Metro area have benefited greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds, and the BTA, that require or help (depending on your point of view) municipalities to create bike paths. So far bicyclists have not paid directly for these lanes. The 75% of the Portland area that do not ride bikes, may have something to say about bikers paying there fair share. </FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>As a skier, I pay every year for a Snow park permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads open for those that are using it, so I don't mind. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country, are sold by mass merchants. Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the world. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper work is worth letting them keep a third of the fee. They should not have to work for free. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">

<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A href="mailto:pat_s-@orcom.com" title=pa-@orcom.com>Pat Sagers</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A href="mailto:'ob-@topica.com'" title-@topica.com>'ob-@topica.com'</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01 PM</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital</DIV>

<DIV><BR></DIV>

<DIV class=Section1>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT color=navy face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I don't think the motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>License all my bicycles?<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes, 2 road bikes and one tandem.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I'll have to sell a bike to register the rest.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I think strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human powered vehicle should be registered too.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Gosh, we may be able to dismiss the state income tax.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT color=navy face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT color=navy face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Pat Sagers<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT color=navy face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">-----Original Message-----<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> Gregg Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com] <BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> </SPAN></FONT><?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:date Month="3" Day="8" Year="2003"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Saturday, March 08, 2003</SPAN></FONT></st1:date><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </SPAN></FONT><st1:time Hour="16" Minute="43"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">4:43 PM</SPAN></FONT></st1:time><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> ob-@topica.com<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P>

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the link <A href="http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html">http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it progresses any where.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Here is the contact info for him.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422 email: <A href="mailto:rep.clif-@state.or.us">rep.clif-@state.or.us</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">If you any one has any questions let me know,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">-Gregg Magnus<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in; mso-margin-top-alt: 5.0pt"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">greg-@hotmail.com<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV></DIV>

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</SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>To respond to the list manager send to ob-@teleport.com To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com<PRE></PRE><BR><BR>

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THOMAS HOFFMAN

2003-03-13

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Ask your attorney how much he charges to fill out a legal document for you. I bet it is way more than the 3.35 bucks that a store would collect for a 10 liscence fee. Think about it this way, why force a buisnes to take time to fill out and file a goverment form and not compesate them for it? It happens for ski park passes, Lottery ticket, etc. I am sure that GI Joes would not sale hunting liscences if they were not compensated for it. It would cost the state a lot more to staff a person at some other office.

Of course we can all keep good records of our serila numbers, CALL the non response (cuz nobody wants to pay for them) Police. And hope they get lucky and find your bike.

----- Original Message -----

From: Ed Lanton

To: ob-@topica.com

Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:24 PM

Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

Gee, Thomas. By this logic the businesses should be able to retain a portion of the Social Security withholding tax (both the employer and employee portion I presume), Medicaid withholding, Federal and State employee income withholding taxes, estimated income taxes, sales tax (in states that have it), fuel excise taxes (state and federal), tobacco excise taxes, etc., etc.

Sorry, but accounting for trust fund taxes by what ever name is just part of the cost of doing business. Even if the idea had merit, is there even a scintilla of evidence showing the relationship between 1/3 of the tax and the cost of collection?





THOMAS HOFFMAN <t.hoff-@verizon.net> wrote:

    I think the Idea has merit, maybe not in this form, but an idea worth exploring. But not so my stolen bike would be returned. I could get behind a registration a one time Fee at time of purchase in order to facilitate a database and create funds that increase the amount of money dedicated to alternative transportation. When I was a kid, every fire station in San Jose took care of bike regitration. I think it cost $5. Those of us residing in the Portland Metro area have benefited greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds, and the BTA, that require or help (depending on your point of view) municipalities to create bike paths. So far bicyclists have not paid directly for these lanes. The 75% of the Portland area that do not ride bikes, may have something to say about bikers paying there fair share. As a skier, I pay every year for a Snow park permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads open for those that are using it, so I don't mind.

    Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country, are sold by mass merchants. Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the world.

    Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper work is worth letting them keep a third of the fee. They should not have to work for free.

    ----- Original Message -----

      From: Pat Sagers

      To: 'ob-@topica.com'

      Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01 PM

      Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

      I don't think the motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles. License all my bicycles? That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes, 2 road bikes and one tandem. I'll have to sell a bike to register the rest. I think strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human powered vehicle should be registered too. Gosh, we may be able to dismiss the state income tax.



      Pat Sagers



      -----Original Message-----

      From: Gregg Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com]

      Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 4:43 PM

      To: ob-@topica.com

      Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital



      Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the link http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html

      This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it progresses any where.

      Here is the contact info for him.

      Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422 email: rep.clif-@state.or.us

      If you any one has any questions let me know,

      -Gregg Magnus

      greg-@hotmail.com

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Ask your attorney how much he charges to fill out a

legal document for you. I bet it is way more than the 3.35 bucks that a store

would collect for a 10 liscence fee. Think about it this way, why force a

buisnes to take time to fill out and file a goverment form and not compesate

them for it? It happens for ski park passes, Lottery ticket, etc. I am

sure that GI Joes would not sale hunting liscences if they were not compensated

for it. It would cost the state a lot more to staff a person at some other

office. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Of course we can all keep good records of our

serila numbers, CALL the non response (cuz nobody wants to pay for them) Police.

And hope they get lucky and find your bike. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>

<DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE

style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

<DIV

style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>

<A title=an-@yahoo.com href="mailto:anque-@yahoo.com">Ed Lanton</A>

</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title-@topica.com

href="mailto:ob-@topica.com">ob-@topica.com</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:24

PM</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle

registration Bill in the capital</DIV>

<DIV><BR></DIV>

<P>Gee, Thomas. By this logic the businesses should be able to retain a

portion of the Social Security withholding tax (both the employer and

employee portion I presume), Medicaid withholding, Federal and State

employee income withholding taxes, estimated income taxes, sales tax

(in states that have it), fuel excise taxes (state and federal), tobacco

excise taxes, etc., etc.

<P>Sorry, but accounting for trust fund taxes by what ever name is just part

of the cost of doing business. Even if the idea had merit, is there even

a scintilla of evidence showing the relationship between 1/3 of the tax

and the cost of collection?

<P>

<P><STRONG><EM></EM></STRONG>

<P><STRONG><EM>THOMAS HOFFMAN <t.hoff-@verizon.net></EM></STRONG>

wrote:

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    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I think the Idea has merit, maybe not

    in this form, but an idea worth exploring. But not so my stolen

    bike would be returned. I could get behind a registration a one time Fee at

    time of purchase in order to facilitate a database and create funds

    that increase the amount of money dedicated to alternative transportation.

    When I was a kid, every fire station in San Jose took care of bike

    regitration. I think it cost $5. Those of us residing in the Portland

    Metro area have benefited greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds, and the

    BTA, that require or help (depending on your point of view)

    municipalities to create bike paths. So far bicyclists have not paid

    directly for these lanes. The 75% of the Portland area that do not ride

    bikes, may have something to say about bikers paying there fair share.

    </FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>As a skier, I pay every year for a Snow park

    permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads open for those that are

    using it, so I don't mind. </FONT></DIV>

    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country,

    are sold by mass merchants. Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the

    world. </FONT></DIV>

    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper

    work is worth letting them keep a third of the fee. They should not have to

    work for free. </FONT></DIV>

    <DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV>

    <BLOCKQUOTE

    style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

      <DIV

      style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>

      <A title=pa-@orcom.com href="mailto:pat_s-@orcom.com">Pat

      Sagers</A> </DIV>

      <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title-@topica.com

      href="mailto:'ob-@topica.com'">'ob-@topica.com'</A> </DIV>

      <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01

      PM</DIV>

      <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [OBRA Chat] Bicycle

      registration Bill in the capital</DIV>

      <DIV><BR></DIV>

      <DIV class=Section1>

      <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I don't think the

      motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles.<SPAN

      style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>License all my bicycles?<SPAN

      style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3

      mountain bikes, 2 road bikes and one tandem.<SPAN

      style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I'll have to sell a bike to

      register the rest.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I think

      strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human powered

      vehicle should be registered too.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes">

      </SPAN>Gosh, we may be able to dismiss the state income

      tax.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Pat Sagers<SPAN

      style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=Tahoma

      size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">-----Original

      Message-----<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> Gregg

      Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com] <BR><B><SPAN

      style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> </SPAN></FONT><st1:date

      Year="2003" Day="8" Month="3"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">Saturday, March 08,

      2003</SPAN></FONT></st1:date><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> </SPAN></FONT><st1:time

      Minute="43" Hour="16"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">4:43

      PM</SPAN></FONT></st1:time><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"><BR><B><SPAN

      style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> ob-@topica.com<BR><B><SPAN

      style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [OBRA Chat] Bicycle

      registration Bill in the capital</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P>

      <P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"

      size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <DIV>

      <DIV>

      <P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a

      House of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will

      affect all of us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the

      link <A

      href="http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html">http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but

      what it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of

      our bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not

      specify the frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that

      bicycles can be identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I

      don't see how registering them would be of any benefit for this. If

      you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would

      be its next step to becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who

      put this bill forward you may want to call or email him. I will try

      and track this bill and update everyone if it progresses any

      where.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Here is the contact info for

      him.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican

      phone: (503) 986-1422 email: <A

      href="mailto:rep.clif-@state.or.us">rep.clif-@state.or.us</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">If you any one has any questions let me

      know,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">-Gregg Magnus<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

      <P

      style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in; mso-margin-top-alt: 5.0pt"><FONT

      face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

      style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">greg-@hotmail.com<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV></DIV>

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      <HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>

      </SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>To respond to the list manager send to

      ob-@teleport.com To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com<PRE></PRE><BR><BR>

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2003-03-13

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I have one thing to say about this bill , are we then to asume that all city

and state sidewalks need fundng from the walkers , should we also have a shoe

fee that must be collected by shoe stores , i think that this is a silly ,

hopefully all of you do to so this bill will be torn up and thrown out

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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">I have one thing to say about this bill , are we then to asume that all city and state sidewalks need fundng from the walkers , should we also have a shoe fee that must be collected by shoe stores , i think that this is a silly , hopefully all of you do to so this bill will be torn up and thrown out</FONT>

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Michael O'Hair

2003-03-12

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The 1/3 skim is called a sweetener and is designed to keep Toys-R-Us, Fred Meyer, Costco, Sears, etc., from rejecting their "forced tax collector" job out of hand. You will note that I did not list Bike Gallery, River City, etc. In the land of lobbyists, real bike shops have nowhere near the clout that the big boxes have.

The movement to "pay your way" started when "budget cutting" was aimed at bodies that didn't have the lobbyists to fight back, e.g., national parks. The concept of "public value" was jettisoned quite a while ago. Cyclists are being told that it's time that they contribute.

This bike registration thing is working on the premise of "we need the money and will get it any way we can," plain and simple. The fluff about "bike safety education" will probably work out to some posters and cute photo-ops at grade schools.   The "bike recovery" part is basic BS. People that have bikes that they value already have the serial numbers recorded. I would opine that the "200 unclaimed bikes" in Salem are probably beaters and kids' bikes. ( Maybe we should go down and inventory them to see if there are some unclaimed Colnagos. )   In my humble opinion, the only part of the bill that has any reasonable merit is the bike path bit. First, I would like to see how they define "bike path." Years ago, the City Of Portland installed an asphalt strip going over Terwilliger Blvd from Captiol to Sam Jackson. It was deemed a bike path. Within a year, it was full of runners and bike riders were told to get off the "runners' path." The bike lanes on the street were installed a couple of years later. As a point of interest, how many bike paths are there in Malheur County? I would prefer to see studded snow tires licensed to pay for the damage they do, but that would create a big hullabaloo from tire companies, dealers, and drivers. For what it's worth, ODOT did an analysis of the damage done by cars running studded tires and the result was several times their worst fears. The report was filed away.

I would find a ten dollar "Purchase Surcharge" on new bicycles acceptable if it was guaranteed to go towards bike path maintenence. But the "big box" stores would have a fit over that.

The bottom line is that the proposed bill has serious problems ( such as track bikes that never see the road ) and the only way we can deal with it is to protest politely but firmly to the members of the Transportation Committee and to spread the word to our non-racing cohorts. My neighbor, who has four mountain bikes for himself, wife and two boys, was very interested in this issue. Those bikes don't get used more than fifty hours a year and he was not happy about putting up with another bureaucratic boondoggle.

----- Original Message -----

From: Ed Lanton

To: ob-@topica.com

Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:24 PM

Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

Sorry, but accounting for trust fund taxes by what ever name is just part of the cost of doing business. Even if the idea had merit, is there even a scintilla of evidence showing the relationship between 1/3 of the tax and the cost of collection?

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The 1/3 skim is called a sweetener and is designed

to keep Toys-R-Us, Fred Meyer, Costco, Sears, etc., from rejecting their "forced

tax collector" job out of hand. You will note that I did not list Bike

Gallery, River City, etc. In the land of lobbyists, real bike

shops have nowhere near the clout that the big boxes have.</FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The movement to "pay your way" started when "budget

cutting" was aimed at bodies that didn't have the lobbyists to fight back, e.g.,

national parks. The concept of "public value" was jettisoned quite a while

ago. Cyclists are being told that it's time that they

contribute.</FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This bike registration thing is working on the

premise of "we need the money and will get it any way we can," plain and

simple. The fluff about "bike safety education" will probably work out to

some posters and cute photo-ops at grade schools.   The "bike

recovery" part is basic BS. People that have bikes that they value already

have the serial numbers recorded.  I would opine that

the "200 unclaimed bikes" in Salem are probably beaters and kids'

bikes. ( Maybe we should go down and inventory them to see if there are

some unclaimed Colnagos. )   In my humble opinion, the only part of

the bill that has any reasonable merit is the bike path bit. First, I

would like to see how they define "bike path." Years ago, the City Of

Portland installed an asphalt strip going over Terwilliger Blvd from Captiol to

Sam Jackson. It was deemed a bike path. Within a year, it was full

of runners and bike riders were told to get off the "runners' path." The

bike lanes on the street were installed a couple of years later. As a

point of interest, how many bike paths are there in Malheur County? I

would prefer to see studded snow tires licensed to pay for the damage they do,

but that would create a big hullabaloo from tire companies, dealers, and

drivers. For what it's worth, ODOT did an analysis of the damage done by

cars running studded tires and the result was several times their worst

fears. The report was filed away.</FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I would find a ten dollar "Purchase Surcharge" on

new bicycles acceptable if it was guaranteed to go towards bike path

maintenence. But the "big box" stores would have a fit over

that.</FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The bottom line is that the proposed bill has

serious problems ( such as track bikes that never see the road ) and the only

way we can deal with it is to protest politely but firmly to the members of the

Transportation Committee and to spread the word to our non-racing cohorts.

My neighbor, who has four mountain bikes for himself, wife and two boys, was

very interested in this issue. Those bikes don't get used more than fifty

hours a year and he was not happy about putting up with another bureaucratic

boondoggle.</FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE

style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>

<DIV

style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>

<A title=an-@yahoo.com href="mailto:anque-@yahoo.com">Ed Lanton</A>

</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title-@topica.com

href="mailto:ob-@topica.com">ob-@topica.com</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:24

PM</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle

registration Bill in the capital</DIV>

<DIV><BR></DIV>

<P>Sorry, but accounting for trust fund taxes by what ever name is just part

of the cost of doing business. Even if the idea had merit, is there even

a scintilla of evidence showing the relationship between 1/3 of the tax

and the cost of collection?   </P></BLOCKQUOTE>

</BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C2E8EF.F220D160--

Ed Lanton

2003-03-12

--0-32256691-1047533070=:23763

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Gee, Thomas. By this logic the businesses should be able to retain a portion of the Social Security withholding tax (both the employer and employee portion I presume), Medicaid withholding, Federal and State employee income withholding taxes, estimated income taxes, sales tax (in states that have it), fuel excise taxes (state and federal), tobacco excise taxes, etc., etc.

Sorry, but accounting for trust fund taxes by what ever name is just part of the cost of doing business. Even if the idea had merit, is there even a scintilla of evidence showing the relationship between 1/3 of the tax and the cost of collection?

THOMAS HOFFMAN <t.hoff-@verizon.net> wrote:

v\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML)}o\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML)}w\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML)}.shape { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML)}st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }I think the Idea has merit, maybe not in this form, but an idea worth exploring. But not so my stolen bike would be returned. I could get behind a registration a one time Fee at time of purchase in order to facilitate a database and create funds that increase the amount of money dedicated to alternative transportation. When I was a kid, every fire station in San Jose took care of bike regitration. I think it cost $5. Those of us residing in the Portland Metro area have benefited greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds, and the BTA, that require or help (depending on your point of view) municipalities to create bike paths. So far bicyclists have not paid directly for these lanes. The 75% of the Portland area that do not ride bikes, may have something to say about bikers paying there fair share. As a skier, I pay every year for a Snow park permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads open for those that are using it, so I don't mind. Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country, are sold by mass merchants. Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the world. Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper work is worth letting them keep a third of the fee. They should not have to work for free. ----- Original Message ----- From: Pat Sagers To: 'ob-@topica.com' Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01 PMSubject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

I don't think the motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles. License all my bicycles? That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes, 2 road bikes and one tandem. I'll have to sell a bike to register the rest. I think strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human powered vehicle should be registered too. Gosh, we may be able to dismiss the state income tax.

Pat Sagers

-----Original Message-----

From: Gregg Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 4:43 PM

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the link http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html

This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it progresses any where.

Here is the contact info for him.

Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422 email: rep.clif-@state.or.us

If you any one has any questions let me know,

-Gregg Magnus

greg-@hotmail.com

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<P>Gee, Thomas. By this logic the businesses should be able to retain a portion of the Social Security withholding tax (both the employer and employee portion I presume), Medicaid withholding, Federal and State employee income withholding taxes, estimated income taxes, sales tax (in states that have it), fuel excise taxes (state and federal), tobacco excise taxes, etc., etc.

<P>Sorry, but accounting for trust fund taxes by what ever name is just part of the cost of doing business. Even if the idea had merit, is there even a scintilla of evidence showing the relationship between 1/3 of the tax and the cost of collection?

<P>

<P><STRONG><EM></EM></STRONG>

<P><STRONG><EM>THOMAS HOFFMAN <t.hoff-@verizon.net></EM></STRONG> wrote:

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I think the Idea has merit, maybe not in this form, but an idea worth exploring. But not so my stolen bike would be returned. I could get behind a registration a one time Fee at time of purchase in order to facilitate a database and create funds that increase the amount of money dedicated to alternative transportation. When I was a kid, every fire station in San Jose took care of bike regitration. I think it cost $5. Those of us residing in the Portland Metro area have benefited greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds, and the BTA, that require or help (depending on your point of view) municipalities to create bike paths. So far bicyclists have not paid directly for these lanes. The 75% of the Portland area that do not ride bikes, may have something to say about bikers paying there fair share. </FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>As a skier, I pay every year for a Snow park permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads open for those that are using it, so I don't mind. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country, are sold by mass merchants. Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the world. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper work is worth letting them keep a third of the fee. They should not have to work for free. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=pa-@orcom.com href="mailto:pat_s-@orcom.com">Pat Sagers</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title-@topica.com href="mailto:'ob-@topica.com'">'ob-@topica.com'</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01 PM</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital</DIV>

<DIV><BR></DIV>

<DIV class=Section1>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I don't think the motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>License all my bicycles?<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes, 2 road bikes and one tandem.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I'll have to sell a bike to register the rest.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I think strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human powered vehicle should be registered too.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Gosh, we may be able to dismiss the state income tax.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Pat Sagers<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">-----Original Message-----<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> Gregg Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com] <BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> </SPAN></FONT><?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:date Month="3" Day="8" Year="2003"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">Saturday, March 08, 2003</SPAN></FONT></st1:date><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> </SPAN></FONT><st1:time Hour="16" Minute="43"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">4:43 PM</SPAN></FONT></st1:time><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"><BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> ob-@topica.com<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P>

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the link <A href="http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html">http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it progresses any where.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Here is the contact info for him.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422 email: <A href="mailto:rep.clif-@state.or.us">rep.clif-@state.or.us</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">If you any one has any questions let me know,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">-Gregg Magnus<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in; mso-margin-top-alt: 5.0pt"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">greg-@hotmail.com<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV></DIV>

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><BR style="mso-special-character: line-break" clear=all><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<DIV style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in">

<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">

<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>

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samu-@pdx.edu

2003-03-12

How many cyclists also own cars? I'm willing to bet that at least 50%. If

you build a bike lane(and cars stay out of it) how long will it last? A lot

longer than the same stretch of road with cars driving up and down it. I

realize that it costs a lot of money to add bike lanes to streets but it

certainly is cheaper than laying pavemant for cars every five years. Plus

bike lanes are for more than just cyclists, they keep traffic moving faster in

general and make drivers more comfortable in passing cyclists. Cyclists also

save everyone money in many different ways which if you think about are

obvious so I won't waste time describing them. I see no need for cyclists to

pay more.

Quoting THOMAS HOFFMAN <t.hoff-@verizon.net>:

I think the Idea has merit, maybe not in this form, but an idea worth

exploring. But not so my stolen bike would be returned. I could get behind a

registration a one time Fee at time of purchase in order to facilitate a

database and create funds that increase the amount of money dedicated to

alternative transportation. When I was a kid, every fire station in San Jose

took care of bike regitration. I think it cost $5. Those of us residing in

the Portland Metro area have benefited greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds,

and the BTA, that require or help (depending on your point of view)

municipalities to create bike paths. So far bicyclists have not paid directly

for these lanes. The 75% of the Portland area that do not ride bikes, may

have something to say about bikers paying there fair share. As a skier, I pay

every year for a Snow park permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads

open for those that are using it, so I don't mind.

Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country, are sold by mass merchants.

Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the world.

Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper work is worth letting them keep

a third of the fee. They should not have to work for free.

----- Original Message -----

   From: Pat Sagers

   To: 'ob-@topica.com'

   Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01 PM

   Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

   I don't think the motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles.

License all my bicycles? That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes,

2 road bikes and one tandem. I'll have to sell a bike to register the rest.

I think strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human

powered vehicle should be registered too. Gosh, we may be able to dismiss

the state income tax.



   Pat Sagers



   -----Original Message-----

   From: Gregg Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com]

   Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 4:43 PM

   To: ob-@topica.com

   Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital



   Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives

Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes.

It is House Bill 3135..here is the link

http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html

   This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is

we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the

state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The

argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if

they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be

of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a

committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but

Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to call

or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it

progresses any where.

   Here is the contact info for him.

   Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422

email: rep.clif-@state.or.us

   If you any one has any questions let me know,

   -Gregg Magnus

   greg-@hotmail.com

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

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THOMAS HOFFMAN

2003-03-12

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I think the Idea has merit, maybe not in this form, but an idea worth exploring. But not so my stolen bike would be returned. I could get behind a registration a one time Fee at time of purchase in order to facilitate a database and create funds that increase the amount of money dedicated to alternative transportation. When I was a kid, every fire station in San Jose took care of bike regitration. I think it cost $5. Those of us residing in the Portland Metro area have benefited greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds, and the BTA, that require or help (depending on your point of view) municipalities to create bike paths. So far bicyclists have not paid directly for these lanes. The 75% of the Portland area that do not ride bikes, may have something to say about bikers paying there fair share. As a skier, I pay every year for a Snow park permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads open for those that are using it, so I don't mind.

Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country, are sold by mass merchants. Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the world.

Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper work is worth letting them keep a third of the fee. They should not have to work for free.

----- Original Message -----

From: Pat Sagers

To: 'ob-@topica.com'

Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01 PM

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

I don't think the motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles. License all my bicycles? That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes, 2 road bikes and one tandem. I'll have to sell a bike to register the rest. I think strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human powered vehicle should be registered too. Gosh, we may be able to dismiss the state income tax.



Pat Sagers



-----Original Message-----

From: Gregg Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 4:43 PM

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital



Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the link http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html

This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it progresses any where.

Here is the contact info for him.

Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422 email: rep.clif-@state.or.us

If you any one has any questions let me know,

-Gregg Magnus

greg-@hotmail.com

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I think the Idea has merit, maybe not in this

form, but an idea worth exploring. But not so my stolen bike would be

returned. I could get behind a registration a one time Fee at time

of purchase in order to facilitate a database and create funds that

increase the amount of money dedicated to alternative transportation. When I was

a kid, every fire station in San Jose took care of bike regitration. I think it

cost $5. Those of us residing in the Portland Metro area have benefited

greatly from legislation, ISTEA Funds, and the BTA, that require or

help (depending on your point of view) municipalities to create bike paths.

So far bicyclists have not paid directly for these lanes. The 75% of the

Portland area that do not ride bikes, may have something to say about bikers

paying there fair share. </FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>As a skier, I pay every

year for a Snow park permit. It's a drag, but it helps keep the roads open for

those that are using it, so I don't mind. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Well over 80% of all bikes sold in the country, are

sold by mass merchants. Toys R Us is the largest bike retailer in the world.

</FONT></DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Requiring a retailer to do execute the paper work

is worth letting them keep a third of the fee. They should not have to work for

free. </FONT></DIV>

<DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV>

<BLOCKQUOTE

style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">

<DIV

style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>

<A title=pa-@orcom.com href="mailto:pat_s-@orcom.com">Pat

Sagers</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title-@topica.com

href="mailto:'ob-@topica.com'">'ob-@topica.com'</A> </DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 08, 2003 10:01

PM</DIV>

<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration

Bill in the capital</DIV>

<DIV><BR></DIV>

<DIV class=Section1>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I don't think the

motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles.<SPAN

style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>License all my bicycles?<SPAN

style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3

mountain bikes, 2 road bikes and one tandem.<SPAN

style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I'll have to sell a bike to register

the rest.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I think strollers,

skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human powered vehicle should be

registered too.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Gosh, we may be

able to dismiss the state income tax.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Pat Sagers<SPAN

style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">-----Original

Message-----<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> Gregg

Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com] <BR><B><SPAN

style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> </SPAN></FONT><st1:date Year="2003"

Day="8" Month="3"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">Saturday, March 08,

2003</SPAN></FONT></st1:date><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> </SPAN></FONT><st1:time

Minute="43" Hour="16"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">4:43

PM</SPAN></FONT></st1:time><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"><BR><B><SPAN

style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> ob-@topica.com<BR><B><SPAN

style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration

Bill in the capital</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P>

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman"

size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<DIV>

<DIV>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House

of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of

us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the link <A

href="http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html">http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what

it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our

bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the

frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be

identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how

registering them would be of any benefit for this. If you have input on

this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would be its next step to

becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you

may want to call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update

everyone if it progresses any where.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Here is the contact info for

him.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican

phone: (503) 986-1422 email: <A

href="mailto:rep.clif-@state.or.us">rep.clif-@state.or.us</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">If you any one has any questions let me

know,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">-Gregg Magnus<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>

<P

style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in; mso-margin-top-alt: 5.0pt"><FONT

face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN

style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">greg-@hotmail.com<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV></DIV>

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Pat Sagers

2003-03-08

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I don't think the motivation for this bill is to track and return bicycles.

License all my bicycles? That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes,

2 road bikes and one tandem. I'll have to sell a bike to register the rest.

I think strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human

powered vehicle should be registered too. Gosh, we may be able to dismiss

the state income tax.

Pat Sagers

-----Original Message-----

From: Gregg Magnus [mailto:greg-@hotmail.com]

Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 4:43 PM

To: ob-@topica.com

Subject: [OBRA Chat] Bicycle registration Bill in the capital

Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives Bill

that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes. It

is House Bill 3135..here is the link

http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html

<http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html>

This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is we

(bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the state,

and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The

argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if

they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be

of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to

a committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but

Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to

call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it

progresses any where.

Here is the contact info for him.

Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422

email: rep.clif-@state.or.us <mailto:rep.clif-@state.or.us>

If you any one has any questions let me know,

-Gregg Magnus

greg-@hotmail.com

_____

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2 months FREE*.

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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:

10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I don't think the motivation for

this bill is to track and return bicycles.<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'>

</span>License all my bicycles?<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'>

</span>That would be 3 childrens bikes, 3 mountain bikes, 2 road bikes and one

tandem.<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'> </span>I'll have to sell a

bike to register the rest.<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'> </span>I think

strollers, skateboards, rollerblades or any other type of human powered vehicle

should be registered too.<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'> </span>Gosh, we

may be able to dismiss the state income tax.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:

10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:

10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Pat Sagers<span

style='mso-spacerun:yes'> </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:

10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span

style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>

<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b> Gregg Magnus

[mailto:greg-@hotmail.com] <br>

<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> </span></font><st1:date

Month="3" Day="8" Year="2003"><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:

10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Saturday, March 08, 2003</span></font></st1:date><font

size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> </span></font><st1:time

Hour="16" Minute="43"><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;

font-family:Tahoma'>4:43 PM</span></font></st1:time><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span

style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>

<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> ob-@topica.com<br>

<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> [OBRA Chat] Bicycle

registration Bill in the capital</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span

style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div>

<p style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span

style='font-size:12.0pt'>Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House

of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of

us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the link <a

href="http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html">http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span

style='font-size:12.0pt'>This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what

it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our

bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the

frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be

identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how

registering them would be of any benefit for this. If you have input on

this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would be its next step to

becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you

may want to call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update

everyone if it progresses any where.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span

style='font-size:12.0pt'>Here is the contact info for him.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span

style='font-size:12.0pt'>Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican

phone: (503) 986-1422 email: <a href="mailto:rep.clif-@state.or.us">rep.clif-@state.or.us</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span

style='font-size:12.0pt'>If you any one has any questions let me know,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span

style='font-size:12.0pt'>-Gregg Magnus<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p style='mso-margin-top-alt:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;

margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:

12.0pt'>greg-@hotmail.com<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

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----=_NextPart_ST_21_56_33_Saturday_March_08_2003_15997--

Gregg Magnus

2003-03-08

<html><div style='background-color:'><DIV>

<P>Hey everyone out there in OBRA land there is a House of Representatives Bill that was introduced on Friday that will affect all of us if it passes. It is House Bill 3135..here is the link <A href="http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html">http://www.leg.state.or.us/03reg/measures/hb3100.dir/hb3135.intro.html</A></P>

<P>This Bill sounds warm and fuzzy at the start but what it comes down to is we (bicycle owners) will have to register each of our bicycles with the state, and renew them periodically (it does not specify the frequency) The argument in favor of this is so that bicycles can be identified easier if they are stolen or in an accident, I don't see how registering them would be of any benefit for this. If you have input on this Bill it has not gone to a committee yet which would be its next step to becoming law, but Representative Cliff Zauner is who put this bill forward you may want to call or email him. I will try and track this bill and update everyone if it progresses any where.</P>

<P>Here is the contact info for him.</P>

<P>Rep Cliff Zauner District 22 Woodburn Republican phone: (503) 986-1422 email: <A href="mailto:rep.clif-@state.or.us">rep.clif-@state.or.us</A></P>

<P>If you any one has any questions let me know,</P>

<P>-Gregg Magnus</P>

<P>greg-@hotmail.com<BR><BR></P></DIV>

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